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The Brutal, The Bad and The Ugly
- Thread starter rossihunter2
- Start date
the problem is that it's multiple WR coaches and now multiple GMs - so where do you pinpoint the coaching failing?
and idk - who outside of Breshad Perriman has entered the ravens building the last decade and shown talent-wise that they could be anything more than they are or were when they were a raven...
i go back to what i was saying before we drafted hollywood and that it's a failure to take shots on receivers in the draft with enough high picks - steelers bring in a new guy seemingly every year on day 2 - multiple 2nd and 3rd round picks in recent years...
we just haven't taken enough shots - we started to rectify that when we took hollywood and boykin and now duvernay and hollywood looks to be somewhat a success albeit not quite the dominant number 1 we were hoping but still a good player who's a quality starter with game-breaking potential but the other 2 haven't shown much - we have to keep drafting and adding guys and not just rest on our laurels
it's been masked by brandon williams being here for so many years and michael pierce coming in as a udfa but we missed on a lot of DL too but the difference there is that we've consistently taken shots at that position and it means that we get to end up with a justin madubuike
we've been blessed amazing talent evaluators and 2 amazing GMs and sometimes their hit rates at other positions have led us to expect them to nail every single pick every single year when part of the game of the draft (and the reason the ravens have been so good at this) is the understanding that it is a lottery and the more tickets you buy the better chance you have at winning - we've bought lots of tickets at lots of positions but not many WRs the last decade until the last 2 drafts
CanadianRavensFan
Practice Squad
God I hope we sign him or another legitimate #1 receiver
i think that's a good point too about athletes - especially when you're drafting outside the 1st round - your receiver prospect is going to have some flaws and you have to either be able to scheme their usage around those flaws or be able to coach up those flaws - we've not been great imo at identifying guys with coachable flaws vs guys who just aren't ready/just aren't up to snuff
boykin's an athlete, duvernay's an athlete - the difference with hollywood is that he was a good route runner in college with good hands who just happened to also be an explosive and dynamic athlete - there's a place for the boykins and duvernays of this world - their athleticism means that they still have usefulness even if they don't develop - boykin's going to be here again next year because his downfield blocking is excellent and he does have the ability to occasionally make a play down the field - duvernay's still got a chance to develop as a route runner but right now he's someone who you can get the ball to in space and let him create
but they aren't guys who'll win matchups often and i think that's where we're failing
we're not always bringing in guys who's way of "winning" in college translates well to the NFL - i think proche showed some things in his limited snaps that bode well for the future but im surprised he seemed to get no opportunities - yes he was the target on 2 different lamar picks but they were very much on lamar and not him - we need to be better at working out how well the "win" translates
drjohnnyfever
Pro Bowler
That's a bit generous... Other than Torrey Smith, we've never really "hit" on WR despite where he was picked. And that was a modest success at best. Fit the team perfectly, but... You could go all the way back to Travis Taylor - - - none of our picks at the position have panned out particularly well despite their draft position despite trying at all levels. While other teams seem to find, at least, adequacy regularly at any level in the draft.
It's also not fair to look at what we missed by what other teams have done with players and the success they had. Every team misses targets in the drafts or desired players. The point is the picks we have made historically at the WR position have not panned out. I suppose you could blame drafting, but I just don't see it that way over the long haul. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut.
I see it as despite the attributes of the player - and they all differ - we have not been able to develop even ONE all-pro WR! Jermaine Lewis, 1998 and 2001 and that was for KR's. Jacoby Jones in the only other Ravens all pro WR. We've made our hay in the WR department on Free Agent signings.
We wouldn't know how to develop and coach a WR out of college anymore than we'd be able to raise a pig to the Blue Ribbon at the 4H.
Dom McRaven
Hall of Famer
drjohnnyfever
Pro Bowler
There's just no way in my mind that our draft group could have failed in their evaluation of that ONE position group so miserably so consistently. Their track record on other positions would DICTATE at least one success over the years, yet there are NONE. That is a coaching issue. There's no other explanation to me. Who do you blame it on? There's no one person or coach. It's not valued as highly as other positions to coach up is all I can guess. But there is NO way a team as talented, as you say, fails that miserably at evaluating one position as consistently as you are saying we do at WR.
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Pfft dude when we beat the Jags woo hoo!! I'm not on here celebrating wins over bums cause it don't mean squat. Last week we could have easily lost that game. 54secs left 2-3 timeouts and Harbs runs 20 secs off the clock before calling a timeout like wtf? That's $hit is so old man ...dude is shook in the playoffs .. when's the last time someone said wow what a great coaching call by Harbaugh lol don't worry I'll wait.
drjohnnyfever
Pro Bowler
Good night all. Thought we coulda won this one. Still think we were the better team, but alas, here we are again........ looking forward to the draft. 
right but i've gone back to all those picks before - the problem is we just have not made anywhere near the volume of day 1 and 2 picks at the WR position over the last decade or so to end up with the probabilities working in our favour - yes all teams hit and miss on prospects at every position but most of them have taken more shots at WRs than we have - if you look at day 1 and 2 picks - until hollywood and the 2019 draft we'd taken only 2 receivers in the first 2 days of the draft in the 11 drafts before-hand
to compare that with the steelers who many would consider one of the top WR drafting organisations in the league (if not the best...) they've taken a day 1/day2 receiver in 4 of the last 4 drafts, 5 of the last 6 and 6 of the last 8, 8 of the last 12 and 11 of the last 15 draft classes - they may be better at evaluation and development but the biggest difference is simply that they just take more swings - in the last 4 draft classes they'd taken as many WRs in the first 2 days as the ravens had between the 2005 and 2018 drafts... that's a dramatic difference
ill point you to the above post but i really think it's about the volume at the position - i analysed this a ton before the 2019 draft because i found it astonishing but we really just had taken hardly any swings at the position at all - you mentioned torrey smith but it was 4 drafts before him that we took the previous swing and 4 drafts after him that we took the next one - meanwhile most organisations were taking 1 every 2 years or so
bills fans being classy - respect to them
was just about to come and post this - notable that it's the 2nd time this season that steve smith in particular has criticised roman
Dom McRaven
Hall of Famer
Fantastic fanbase. When it comes to away crowds, Bills fans tend to travel well too. Gosh, my feelings for this team has turned a completely 180 LMAOO and I love it. Other from our divisional rivals, I don't like hating on teams lol. Too stressful.
QuothTheRaven
Veteran
God damn man, can we please get a real fucking center? You can't have these snaps spraying all over the place like this - especially from a professional. They create huge negative plays, they spread jitters, they kill momentum and you have to believe that Lamar has in the back of his mind that he needs to corral the snap before he even considers the play. Then today, they got our MVP quarterback taken out of the game. I'm tired of seeing this team beat itself with bad offensive line play!
The defense of both teams deserve credit for the way they played, but man, nothing swings momentum on a promising drive like a snap sailing 15 yards behind the line and causing panic. It can't happen!
The defense of both teams deserve credit for the way they played, but man, nothing swings momentum on a promising drive like a snap sailing 15 yards behind the line and causing panic. It can't happen!
ravenslord
Ravens Ring of Honor
Is Roman fired yet ?