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Lamar Jackson

rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
BloodRaven said:
We definitely have to evolve the passing game, there are going to be playoff games where we can't run and Lamar has to throw 50 times and win.
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that's the evolution that has to happen this offseason - we have to be able to punish teams when they find a way to stop the running game either because of over-committing numbers up front or because the OL shat the bed

id also like to see us adjust a bit in terms of how we operate on 1st down - it's statistically the best down to pass on and we pass up that opportunity far too often when there are easy gains to be made there
 
JoeyFlex5

JoeyFlex5

Hall of Famer
Deebo813 said:
Championship mentality is def a thing. It can also be the same as “ killer mentality” Although i think watson is a better qb and even said that during lamar mvp run, lamar actually does have that mentality. Some just got it in them and some dont. You can see it and feel the energy they posses. Kinda hard to explain, its just something you can see in people.
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Thanks for breaking that down. I wasn’t even gonna bother responding to that, who talks on a football forum and denies “championship mentality” being a real thing? smh
 
Willbacker

Willbacker

Ravens Ring of Honor
On the drive where Lamar threw that killer pick we were driving it down the field with some quick short throws. We need to get Hollywood and the rest of our wideouts more quick timing schemes for yac which would really open up our passing game and basically its going to be on Lamar to make the proper reads on what defense he sees. I also dont understand the lack of audibles. You gotta have confidence in your QB!!! Its not that we really need to open up a deep passing game but just get some damn timing routes. Hell I miss the old hooks that Flacco used to do with Mason. On 1st down a quick 8 yds.
 
rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
Willbacker said:
On the drive where Lamar threw that killer pick we were driving it down the field with some quick short throws. We need to get Hollywood and the rest of our wideouts more quick timing schemes for yac which would really open up our passing game and basically its going to be on Lamar to make the proper reads on what defense he sees. I also dont understand the lack of audibles. You gotta have confidence in your QB!!! Its not that we really need to open up a deep passing game but just get some damn timing routes. Hell I miss the old hooks that Flacco used to do with Mason. On 1st down a quick 8 yds.
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it's also about better weapons - timing routes are only effective if there's chemistry and trust - lamar got burned a couple of times early in the year where boykin got his timing wrong and it led to picks and break-ups

if we give him weapons (and a more constructive offseason) then i think we see an uptick in timing-based routes and even option-routes (if we can find a cool slot) - it's the logical progression - our running game is predicated on making sure the defender is always wrong, why not set up our passing game around option-routes where as long as the QB and the receiver make the same read then the defender is always wrong...

that to me seems like the most obvious next step
 
gtalk12

gtalk12

Ravens Ring of Honor
BoredMarine13 said:
Did you forget Watson played in an AFC championship and built a 21-0 lead before there defense collapsed in on it self allowing 51 points in 2 and 1/2 quarters.


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And did you forget Houston putting up only 10 points in the 2nd quarter and 3rd quarter combined. 0 in the 4th......

1-2 record in the playoffs vs 1-3
 
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BoredMarine13

BoredMarine13

Ravens Ring of Honor
JoeyFlex5 said:
Thanks for breaking that down. I wasn’t even gonna bother responding to that, who talks on a football forum and denies “championship mentality” being a real thing? smh
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Lol Championship mentality is not real or quantifiable. What championship mentality really = hours spent in the film room, practice field, gym, nutrition, sleep schedule, discipline etc.... you think Tom Brady is the best because he has some mythical drive ? No he works his butt off.

This whole argument is silly because someone claimed Lamar has a greater drive than Watson , which there is no way to prove unless your in the building with those guys.


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ravenslord

Ravens Ring of Honor
Where is the talk anymore about Lamar being a very raw QB coming out of Louisville, saying it would take several years for him to start to
get things right?
He has exceeded my expectations so far and I expect him to get better as he matures. The kid is 24 !
 
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BoredMarine13

BoredMarine13

Ravens Ring of Honor
rossihunter2 said:
right but there are very few "new" plays in football - you will have run similar concepts to every single offence in the NFL (especially in the running game)

but the ravens running offence isnt 'simple' it's highly complex to defend because of it synthesises multiple elements of different running games and brings them together - running multiple different plays out of the exact same alignment, motion and pre-snap look and gaining the numbers advantage via those motions
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I agree there are rarely new plays installed. Everyone’s running something that’s been done with slight variations.

BUT, this is not a complex offensive scheme to defend , just the opposite actually. Lamar is just that much of an X factor. All the motion and pre snap is great but Lamar puts fear in under manned defenses causing them to hesitate and second guess all over the field. You don’t see that hesitation as often vs well coached teams like the Steelers, chiefs, bills, Titans .. etc

The point of this post originated with when we should pay Lamar. Which we will and we should. However, we’re wasting time, money, and his skill set by forcing him to continue to play in this simplistic system. We need to open things up and let Lamar have the entire field to dissect. This kid could be lethal in an open offense with a slight upgrade in talent around him.

PS: synthesis already means the combination of multiple elements so “synthesis multiple” is double tapping yourself. I like the flex though


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Grim

Grim

Ravens Ring of Honor
BoredMarine13 said:
Lol Championship mentality is not real or quantifiable. What championship mentality really = hours spent in the film room, practice field, gym, nutrition, sleep schedule, discipline etc.... you think Tom Brady is the best because he has some mythical drive ? No he works his butt off.

This whole argument is silly because someone claimed Lamar has a greater drive than Watson , which there is no way to prove unless your in the building with those guys.


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I would say that approach to the game Tom Brady takes is "championship" mentality. It means he puts in the work and doesn't quit & tries to elevate his game to be the best. What you said is exactly what Ray Lewis said regarding his approach in that for him it is "Effort, that's it." and I would say that "effort" is what makes up "championship" mentality. Say what you want about Lamar, but he does put forth effort and doesn't go out there and look lazy.
 
rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
BoredMarine13 said:
I agree there are rarely new plays installed. Everyone’s running something that’s been done with slight variations.

BUT, this is not a complex offensive scheme to defend , just the opposite actually. Lamar is just that much of an X factor. All the motion and pre snap is great but Lamar puts fear in under manned defenses causing them to hesitate and second guess all over the field. You don’t see that hesitation as often vs well coached teams like the Steelers, chiefs, bills, Titans .. etc

The point of this post originated with when we should pay Lamar. Which we will and we should. However, we’re wasting time, money, and his skill set by forcing him to continue to play in this simplistic system. We need to open things up and let Lamar have the entire field to dissect. This kid could be lethal in an open offense with a slight upgrade in talent around him.

PS: synthesis already means the combination of multiple elements so “synthesis multiple” is double tapping yourself. I like the flex though


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Click to expand...

the number of OL gurus and former OL in the media who've done very specific breakdowns about how impressive and innovative the running scheme is would tend to suggest otherwise - the running game is all about creating a numbers advantage - yes lamar is part of that running game but the real skill in this offence is that we create a numbers advantage with motion and the way we pull and leave guys unblocked - that does rely on the threat of lamar to a certain extent (but there's nothing stopping other teams doing that with their mobile qbs) - you see a ton of teams running out of the meshpoint now and using zone-reads and RPOs but none are anywhere near as effective as lamar and it's not just the fact that lamar's a better runner than them - it's about how we attack the defence - which guy on any given play is unblocked, who's motioning, who's pulling and are we pulling front-side or back-side, are we running counter...

those teams that have defended us well have often had to over-commit downhill and/or been able to blow-up our interior OL - that's not a schematic failure - the bills are the only team that's really stopped this running scheme - because the steelers, chiefs and titans sure as hell havent

and if you're going to criticise me for a tautology at least actually read what i wrote - i used it as a verb (synthesises) not a noun (synthesis) so it is in fact not "double tapping" myself

and again i agree with you that we need to open up this passing game - but you keep saying this running game is complex to defend... then why did it go over 3000 yards again this year - a feat which has only happened four times in NFL history (and has now been achieved twice in 2 years by this team) - why did it not even get slowed down despite having 1 week without Lamar and a massive offensive slump earlier in the year... and if it had been figured out why did it get better at the end of the year???

the passing game is basic and simplistic and needs a major revamp - the running game is a revolutionary
 
D

Deebo813

Hall of Famer
BoredMarine13 said:
Lol Championship mentality is not real or quantifiable. What championship mentality really = hours spent in the film room, practice field, gym, nutrition, sleep schedule, discipline etc.... you think Tom Brady is the best because he has some mythical drive ? No he works his butt off.

This whole argument is silly because someone claimed Lamar has a greater drive than Watson , which there is no way to prove unless your in the building with those guys.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Brady is the way he is because of his drive.. have you seen him on the field? He has a different look in his eyes than everyone else.. he is focused. No time nor room for excuses.

Have you ever watched kobe or mj play? They were the same way. All that stuff you named is because of the mentality they have. Like i say its hard to really explain.
 
Dom McRaven

Dom McRaven

Hall of Famer
I was at the gym and they had First Take on one of the TVs. What was one of their topics? Is Lamar Jackson's style sustainable? Again, RENT FREE. Lamar will be great as a real estate agent once he retires from the league.
 
D

Deebo813

Hall of Famer
5CDF0ABF-A936-4713-8DDC-49749D38802D.jpeg
Meant to post this here
 
BoredMarine13

BoredMarine13

Ravens Ring of Honor
rossihunter2 said:
the number of OL gurus and former OL in the media who've done very specific breakdowns about how impressive and innovative the running scheme is would tend to suggest otherwise - the running game is all about creating a numbers advantage - yes lamar is part of that running game but the real skill in this offence is that we create a numbers advantage with motion and the way we pull and leave guys unblocked - that does rely on the threat of lamar to a certain extent (but there's nothing stopping other teams doing that with their mobile qbs) - you see a ton of teams running out of the meshpoint now and using zone-reads and RPOs but none are anywhere near as effective as lamar and it's not just the fact that lamar's a better runner than them - it's about how we attack the defence - which guy on any given play is unblocked, who's motioning, who's pulling and are we pulling front-side or back-side, are we running counter...

those teams that have defended us well have often had to over-commit downhill and/or been able to blow-up our interior OL - that's not a schematic failure - the bills are the only team that's really stopped this running scheme - because the steelers, chiefs and titans sure as hell havent

and if you're going to criticise me for a tautology at least actually read what i wrote - i used it as a verb (synthesises) not a noun (synthesis) so it is in fact not "double tapping" myself

and again i agree with you that we need to open up this passing game - but you keep saying this running game is complex to defend... then why did it go over 3000 yards again this year - a feat which has only happened four times in NFL history (and has now been achieved twice in 2 years by this team) - why did it not even get slowed down despite having 1 week without Lamar and a massive offensive slump earlier in the year... and if it had been figured out why did it get better at the end of the year???

the passing game is basic and simplistic and needs a major revamp - the running game is a revolutionary
Click to expand...

Rossi we agree on a lot more than you think.
1. The offense needs an upgrade. A combination of players and scheme.
2. The running game while impressive, is not sustainable over the life of Lamar’s future contract. I do not believe Lamar 3 years from now will be out running defenders. Essentially he needs to make the jump in the passing game. I think he does that in a different offensive scheme with a slight upgrade in personnel.

We’ve built an entire offense around Lamar that has been great. We set records and went to back to back divisional rounds. However, at this point it’s hard to have confidence in the current system and players in place to make the leap from contender to Super Bowl. Our defense played two fantastic games in the playoffs, while the offense looked “ meh”. I imagine all the player frustrating is spilling over because they are way more talented than their performance reflects but feel limited by our current scheme.


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BoredMarine13

BoredMarine13

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BoredMarine13

BoredMarine13

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Dom McRaven said:
I was at the gym and they had First Take on one of the TVs. What was one of their topics? Is Lamar Jackson's style sustainable? Again, RENT FREE. Lamar will be great as a real estate agent once he retires from the league.
Click to expand...

Dom I feel like the pundits are living rent free in your head lol. Who takes shows like first take seriously. All those talking heads are a bunch of boobs getting paid to virtue signal and start controversy.


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