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Grim

Grim

Ravens Ring of Honor
rmcjacket23 said:
Nope. It just means if we commit to Lamar long term, and he misses games, this team will lose. Just like it has the last couple years. There aren't roster construction scenarios where you have a $50M QB and then like a $5-10M backup, which is what teams who have quality backups pay for them. It will be Huntley/Brown level backups from here on out...
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Yeah, you either draft or get some UDFA or something to come here and if you catch lightning in a bottle amazing if not well …
 
Davesta

Davesta

Ravens Ring of Honor
rmcjacket23 said:
Well if Lamar holds out until the fall, with a new OC and weapons in town, he deserves none of the money he seeks.
Franchise tag is basically market value for him anyway. There's nothing to bitch about.
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You think he showing up day 1 of training camp on the tag when he did that last season and it got him nowhere?
 
Simba

Simba

Staff Member
Moderator
Davesta said:
You think he showing up day 1 of training camp on the tag when he did that last season and it got him nowhere?
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Probably a little different this offseason with the tag in play because there's an actual imposed deadline instead of a self-imposed one. That window is closed by training camp so the only reason to not show up is to protect himself from injury really. Not out of the question of course, but it's not like there's money to be gained until after the season at that point.
 
rmcjacket23

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
Davesta said:
You think he showing up day 1 of training camp on the tag when he did that last season and it got him nowhere?
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In terms of personal integrity, I'd hope so.

For starters, mid-July is the deadline to for franchise tagged players to get extensions. So by the time training camp arrives, we're going to know whether he's playing the year on the tag, not playing at all, or if he's been extended.

If it's any of the former two, "holding out" only achieves one thing... reducing his ability to get hurt. If that's what's most important to him, so be it.
If I had a new OC, new weapons, etc., and I refuse to participate with them throughout the preseason, that's on him. I have no doubt it'll reflect on how well he does or doesn't play. Not even the world's biggest Lamar slurper could convince himself that Lamar is the kind of player who can skip an entire offseason program and be effective out of the gate.

I don't expect him to participate in any portion of the offseason program until the tag deadline looms. Once that happens, I'd expect him to show up and prepare for the season. If he doesn't, that's on him, not the Ravens.
 
rmcjacket23

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
Michael M. said:
But then is all this gamesmanship in the best interest of the team? How early can the franchise tag be applied?
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Earliest date is February 21st, but March 7th is the deadline to apply tags. So two sides have 7 weeks from today to come to an extension agreement, otherwise, he gets tagged.

March 15th starts FA, March 13th starts the tampering period.

I don't know if the NFL has confirmed franchise tag deadline, but it's typically in mid-July and usually on or around the first day of training camp. So if Lamar doesn't sign, I would expect him to miss mandatory minicamps and all of OTAs, and to be back with the team at the start of training camp.
 
rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
rmcjacket23 said:
I mean if they make it that far it'll be awkward, but I don't think it'll be as bad as people think. He'll get a Jimmy G-level deal most likely. Probably with some inflation. $25-30M a year.

Deep down I think the Giants know that IF they somehow can't come to terms with Jones, there's better or at least comparable fish in the sea. There's veterans out there that could still win in NY. Especially if they upgrade offensively at other positions.

Would also say that the non-exclusive franchise tag will pay ~$32M next year, so they could go that route. Not a gigantic price if he's as good as he's been this year, and they'll happily take two first round picks if somebody wants to make an offer on him.
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and the tag allows them to see if he can back this 1 year explosion up
and if he does then you can feel safer paying him huge money in 2024
 
rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
rmcjacket23 said:
Nope. It just means if we commit to Lamar long term, and he misses games, this team will lose. Just like it has the last couple years. There aren't roster construction scenarios where you have a $50M QB and then like a $5-10M backup, which is what teams who have quality backups pay for them. It will be Huntley/Brown level backups from here on out...
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might have to think about spending more draft capital than we have on backups though

but we're not going to pay them - the time to pay someone was before this year when lamar's cap number got bigger
 
rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
rmcjacket23 said:
In terms of personal integrity, I'd hope so.

For starters, mid-July is the deadline to for franchise tagged players to get extensions. So by the time training camp arrives, we're going to know whether he's playing the year on the tag, not playing at all, or if he's been extended.

If it's any of the former two, "holding out" only achieves one thing... reducing his ability to get hurt. If that's what's most important to him, so be it.
If I had a new OC, new weapons, etc., and I refuse to participate with them throughout the preseason, that's on him. I have no doubt it'll reflect on how well he does or doesn't play. Not even the world's biggest Lamar slurper could convince himself that Lamar is the kind of player who can skip an entire offseason program and be effective out of the gate.

I don't expect him to participate in any portion of the offseason program until the tag deadline looms. Once that happens, I'd expect him to show up and prepare for the season. If he doesn't, that's on him, not the Ravens.
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yeah i think only way he shows up before camp is if a contract is already done (or imminent)
 
rmcjacket23

rmcjacket23

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rossihunter2 said:
might have to think about spending more draft capital than we have on backups though

but we're not going to pay them - the time to pay someone was before this year when lamar's cap number got bigger
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It just depends on what the price tag is. I'm not one of these people who think's Huntley is going to go get $8-10M as some sort of veteran bridge when his contract expires here. I think we very well may keep him for awhile and he may only make like $2-3M a year while he does it. Or we just do what we've been doing, which is draft somebody later on day 3 and keep them in the system awhile.

My point was more that if people are thinking we're going to go sign like a Teddy Bridgewater or a Mitch Trubisky-level veteran (i.e. somebody who's played for awhile, started multiple places, etc.), I don't see that happening at all.

I think we'll absolutely tender Huntley this offseason, and he and Brown (or somebody else off the street) will compete for the backup job. Probably with the hopes that Brown would win it, since Huntley will be more expensive under an RFA tag.
 
rmcjacket23

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
rossihunter2 said:
yeah i think only way he shows up before camp is if a contract is already done (or imminent)
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I'm not sure you'll see him in OTAs regardless, which I don't really have an issue with. I'll be quite surprised if they tag him and he signs in like April. I think if they tag him, that shit's going all the way until the deadline for him to extend (if he does at all).

I can theoretically see a scenario where he holds out in camp IF a) there's no extension, b) Roman is still OC and c) there's no noticeable upgrades on the pass catching group. Then I could see him holding out purely from frustration, and I probably wouldn't blame him then.

We had a new play caller and another weapon or two, its shut up and play time for Lamar. Regardless of whether he's tagged or extended.
 
rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
rmcjacket23 said:
It just depends on what the price tag is. I'm not one of these people who think's Huntley is going to go get $8-10M as some sort of veteran bridge when his contract expires here. I think we very well may keep him for awhile and he may only make like $2-3M a year while he does it. Or we just do what we've been doing, which is draft somebody later on day 3 and keep them in the system awhile.

My point was more that if people are thinking we're going to go sign like a Teddy Bridgewater or a Mitch Trubisky-level veteran (i.e. somebody who's played for awhile, started multiple places, etc.), I don't see that happening at all.

I think we'll absolutely tender Huntley this offseason, and he and Brown (or somebody else off the street) will compete for the backup job. Probably with the hopes that Brown would win it, since Huntley will be more expensive under an RFA tag.
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you think we'll put the tender on Huntley?
i was assuming we'd let him go, test the market and bid him adieu if someone offers him money and if not bring him back to compete on the minimum
 
rossihunter2

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
rmcjacket23 said:
I can theoretically see a scenario where he holds out in camp IF a) there's no extension, b) Roman is still OC and c) there's no noticeable upgrades on the pass catching group. Then I could see him holding out purely from frustration, and I probably wouldn't blame him then.
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frustration and also just lack of need - he already has a complete mastery of this offence
 
rmcjacket23

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
rossihunter2 said:
you think we'll put the tender on Huntley?
i was assuming we'd let him go, test the market and bid him adieu if someone offers him money and if not bring him back to compete on the minimum
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think its depends on price. May be a low-round tender. Those aren't much more than the veteran minimum.
 
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