The Fumbles, the Lamar Injury, and the Season’s Over?

[ravenslord]

Yeah I probably will have to take that shot Lamar took in the next week or so.

If I get the same shot Lamar took last night I can tell you that the orthopedic doctor told me i need someone to drive me back home afterwards.

 

[Grim]

And this isn't related to you, but I'll piggyback off of it... the high end football teams in this league aren't afraid to let their QB throw it a ton. They don't want to do it every week, but I've quite literally never seen a culture, or even a fanbase, with a franchise QB, that is so adamant that the best strategy to winning is taking the ball out of their QBs hands before.

The Patriots have zero fear of a sophomore QB throwing it 44 times to win. None. They can still score 28 points in a game where they couldn't run the ball at all. In a another game where our opponent couldn't run the ball, the Steelers weren't afraid to let a 44 year old QB who can't move throw it 34 times. And they won.

The better coached teams, and the one's that can win, can beat you multiple ways. The Ravens don't have multiple ways to beat teams. And it's been clear over the years that the culture of the team is "run the ball, stop the run". Well this season is what that looks like. Top 3 in rushing yards. Middle of the pack, but still good, at stopping the run. Near the bottom of the league in pass D, near the bottom of the league in throwing the ball.

It doesn't work.

EDC isn't getting replaced. I'm merely suggesting that if he doesn't modify his roster construction strategy to fit a more modern team, the HC isn't going to matter as much as people think it will.

There’s no doubt we need a philosophical change. I’d say part of it is being smarter about player selection. We’ve seen those run first guys get drafted high and yeah, they can win you games and run out the clock but modern football puts it in the QB hands more than not. I think we saw even yesterday Lamar was playing well enough to win that game, with what many call a terrible OL.

It’s also why we lose. We can’t stop guys. On that one 2pt conversion and the 4th down, I knew we would give those up. There wasn’t any doubt it would happen. I’m not psychic or anything, I just know the team folds and doesn’t hold on. Our problem is a complicated one where:

Players (especially highly compensated ones) aren’t delivering
Coaches are making extremely questionable decisions

 

[Michael M.]

I think roster construction is a collaborative thing at the end of the day. A good GM won’t give a HC a player they don’t want or have input on before drafting or signing, how dumb would it be? If you and I are in business together as partners and I’m the hiring executive and you’re the operations guy who runs the business, if I am good at my job of finding people I will ask you for input on candidates.

That’s why I don’t put it on Eric. I think he’s gotten some great players here for us. He’s a top GM

I think they have the players, the coaches can't seem to put the pieces together. The whole doesn't equal the sum of the parts, for years now.

 

[Grim]

I'm not insinuating anything, I just don't recall a QB getting knocked out of a game with a back bruise. Maybe MRI will show more damage than expected.

Yeah no worries just not sure. Not calling you out but trying to answer the question.

My guess is the x ray was good but they need more in depth view to see if anything is damaged. So they diagnosed it as a back bruise because as of now that’s all they can say it is

 

[rmcjacket23]

I think they have the players, the coaches can't seem to put the pieces together. The whole doesn't equal the sum of the parts, for years now.

I don't. I think they have a bunch of guys that are mentally weak.

If anything else, they need a massive youth infusion in the front seven 7.

 

[Michael M.]

I don't. I think they have a bunch of guys that are mentally weak.

If anything else, they need a massive youth infusion in the front seven 7.

I see a lot of players leave and make solid contributions elsewhere. Even Morgan Moses is a starter for the 12-3 team that beat us last night. Oweh seems to be doing well with the Chargers. I agree with the mentally weak part but I believe that to be a coaching issue. Haven't had a pass rush threat for at least 2yrs now though. Yet Oweh getting sacks.

 

[rmcjacket23]

I see a lot of players leave and make solid contributions elsewhere. Even Morgan Moses is a starter for the 12-3 team that beat us last night. Oweh seems to be doing well with the Chargers. I agree with the mentally weak part but I believe that to be a coaching issue.

I mean Moses has played well for a lot of teams in his career, but he's not better than RR is currently. Oweh just needed a change of scenery. No different than Gilman is playing better here than he was in LA.

I don't see a lot of players leaving here and making solid contributions elsewhere. Especially from the draft pick side. From the free agency side, sure, but they weren't "our guys". Moses wasn't a Raven for that long.

 

[Raven Forever]

I feel like it's premature to say this. We are not eliminated. We have a chance to make the dance. But as a fan I'm at an 8-year low point and agree with many posters here, the time is right for a housecleaning. The result may be made for us but if we finish 7-10 there's a chance for top 10 draft placement. We haven't produced during Jackson's leadership and he's clearly changing from an unpredictable weapon into a new role and we need new coaching and front office leadership to administer that change of scheme.

I also feel we are out of schedule. We won a championship in 2000 and 2012, we should have won one last year 2024 and we are definitely not closer to one as this year culminates. Its time.

 

[Dean]

Not running Henry up 11 should make firing Monken today an easy decision.

Monken pulled this nonsense in the Chiefs AFC Championship game too.

Ive seen enough. FIRE HIM TODAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Harblow needs to be gone too!! Sure, we can blame Monken (rightfully so), but Harblow is the head coach, and a bad one at that. Monkey and Harbs had the same exact after game narrative in that CHIEFS game as they did yesterday.

Point is Harbs is in charge and he should have stepped in and overruled monkey in the 4th quarter. I can't watch this team anymore in its current state.

 

[Deebo813]

I mean Moses has played well for a lot of teams in his career, but he's not better than RR is currently. Oweh just needed a change of scenery. No different than Gilman is playing better here than he was in LA.

I don't see a lot of players leaving here and making solid contributions elsewhere. Especially from the draft pick side. From the free agency side, sure, but they weren't "our guys". Moses wasn't a Raven for that long.

Yea it hast been many at all. Maybe like 4 tops i can think off. Judon, zadairus, guy from dolphins and thats about all i can think of.

 

[Deebo813]

Harbsugh said taking henry out for mitchell was a mistake. They were suppose to rotate but they forget at the start of the drive lol

 

[Sandtown]

Harbsugh said taking henry out for mitchell was a mistake. They were suppose to rotate but they forget at the start of the drive lol

Mitchell kind of shown why he's a running back that doesn't need alot of carries but I get the ravens trying to get him involved though. His speed is dangerous but at the same time he still so limited as a receiver and pass blocker. Patriots weren't really afraid of him at all and he doesn't run with alot of power either.

 

[Sandtown]

I think they have the players, the coaches can't seem to put the pieces together. The whole doesn't equal the sum of the parts, for years now.

Honestly I don't know . I think they probably need add more players to the team that can keep the team mentally focused because honestly counting on the coaching staff or even new coaching staff to do so is a bit unrealistic.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

And this isn't related to you, but I'll piggyback off of it... the high end football teams in this league aren't afraid to let their QB throw it a ton. They don't want to do it every week, but I've quite literally never seen a culture, or even a fanbase, with a franchise QB, that is so adamant that the best strategy to winning is taking the ball out of their QBs hands before.

The Patriots have zero fear of a sophomore QB throwing it 44 times to win. None. They can still score 28 points in a game where they couldn't run the ball at all. In a another game where our opponent couldn't run the ball, the Steelers weren't afraid to let a 44 year old QB who can't move throw it 34 times. And they won.

The better coached teams, and the one's that can win, can beat you multiple ways. The Ravens don't have multiple ways to beat teams. And it's been clear over the years that the culture of the team is "run the ball, stop the run". Well this season is what that looks like. Top 3 in rushing yards. Middle of the pack, but still good, at stopping the run. Near the bottom of the league in pass D, near the bottom of the league in throwing the ball.

It doesn't work.

The issue with us throwing the ball isn’t with the throwing part, it’s the pass protection part, when the ravens have to air it out in 2025 it is downright scary seeing the backfield, so you need to run and then build off of that in order to slow the pass rush.

It’s a failure of the trenches, and the play designs needed to cover that weakness are inconsistent at best.

If we had a solid OL along with play design that can protect the qb against 4 and 5 man rushes, then I think airing it out 40+ times a game would work fine, but our qb is dangerously exposed in these situations

 

[gtalk12]

The issue with us throwing the ball isn’t with the throwing part, it’s the pass protection part, when the ravens have to air it out in 2025 it is downright scary seeing the backfield, so you need to run and then build off of that in order to slow the pass rush.

It’s a failure of the trenches, and the play designs needed to cover that weakness are inconsistent at best.

If we had a solid OL along with play design that can protect the qb against 4 and 5 man rushes, then I think airing it out 40+ times a game would work fine, but our qb is dangerously exposed in these situations

Lamar needs to be 100% healthy if this is the way they want to go. The pass protection has been abysmal but I also feel like they for the most part didn't have plays where you asked Lamar to throw the ball on time.

I just don't see it

 

[Michael M.]

Honestly I don't know . I think they probably need add more players to the team that can keep the team mentally focused because honestly counting on the coaching staff or even new coaching staff to do so is a bit unrealistic.

They seem to create their own adversity half the time and then can't come back from it. That first game loss seemed to set the tone, but that was like 15 games ago. They're lacking a Ray Lewis type to rally the troops. It was never Harbaugh.

 

[rmcjacket23]

The issue with us throwing the ball isn’t with the throwing part, it’s the pass protection part, when the ravens have to air it out in 2025 it is downright scary seeing the backfield, so you need to run and then build off of that in order to slow the pass rush.

It’s a failure of the trenches, and the play designs needed to cover that weakness are inconsistent at best.

If we had a solid OL along with play design that can protect the qb against 4 and 5 man rushes, then I think airing it out 40+ times a game would work fine, but our qb is dangerously exposed in these situations

Sure, but its also not consistently bad. Pass protection was excellent last night. Probably the best Oline play, both in pass protection and in the run game, we've seen all season. Didn't matter. Still lost. Still didn't move the football in the air very well.

There are games where it's a problem, and there are games when it's not. Last night the Oline was a strength, not a weakness. And yet the outcome seemed very similar to a lot of other outcomes.

I'd also point out that we've had plenty of seasons with Lamar where we had, at a minimum, a top 10 Oline. And in many of those years, the emphasis was still on "run the ball a lot and stop the run".

 

[UKRaven1827]

Harblow needs to be gone too!! Sure, we can blame Monken (rightfully so), but Harblow is the head coach, and a bad one at that. Monkey and Harbs had the same exact after game narrative in that CHIEFS game as they did yesterday.

Point is Harbs is in charge and he should have stepped in and overruled monkey in the 4th quarter. I can't watch this team anymore in its current state.

100%.

It shouldn't be hard to work out. How many times do we lose and then Harbs says in the post game. "We should have ran the ball more" "We should have used Henry" "it didn't end how we planned it" He says the same thing every damn time.

New flash John. You are the head coach. The buck stops with you. He should seen Derrick Henry standing next to him and said, hang on, we should probably have the hall of fame running back in the game right now. He doesn't learn, this team makes the same mistakes every time. That is why he HAS to go. Position is untenable imo

 

[gtalk12]

Sure, but its also not consistently bad. Pass protection was excellent last night. Probably the best Oline play, both in pass protection and in the run game, we've seen all season. Didn't matter. Still lost. Still didn't move the football in the air very well.

There are games where it's a problem, and there are games when it's not. Last night the Oline was a strength, not a weakness. And yet the outcome seemed very similar to a lot of other outcomes.

I'd also point out that we've had plenty of seasons with Lamar where we had, at a minimum, a top 10 Oline. And in many of those years, the emphasis was still on "run the ball a lot and stop the run".

To your point, it doesn't matter what you have on the field or who is calling plays for the offense. There is an identity this team has been trying to have for a very long time. No matter what.

 

[Sandtown]

They seem to create their own adversity half the time and then can't come back from it. That first game loss seemed to set the tone, but that was like 15 games ago. They're lacking a Ray Lewis type to rally the troops. It was never Harbaugh.

Even in the Ray Lewis era there were some crazy and embarrassing losses. It's tough to find players like Ray Lewis though and truthfully the ravens aren't the only AFC team suffering due to crazy losses or unbelievable losses. Ray lewis defintely helped to keep the team focus but I think it's obvious it just takes something to happen for the players and coaching staff to be on the same page for championships wins to occur. Maybe this loss is what this team needs for that to happen but I think this season is necessary for this team because something obvious just not translating to them and heart break losses like the ravens experienced before they won their super bowl in 2013 is needed at times.