The Nightmare, the Turnovers and the Season's Over

[Adreme]

and I was watching football before you were born as many games as you have. I saw that first hail mary that Roger Staubach through also.

I didnt pick 20 years to "measure" our knowledge of football. I picked that timeframe because it was about when the NFL started to shift the rules about what you can and cannot do to WRs.

Even in the modern NFL there are 2 times when you will almost never see PI called. One is when there are a bunch of bodies all going for the ball, which is most commonly in a hail mary but also occurs when you throw it up into triple coverage and all of them are around the ball. The second, though not relevant here, is when you can argue both the WR and defender were committing PI. You almost never see offsetting PI. Generally when both sides are shoving each other they will just let the play go.

Now the second obviously does not apply but in both cases nowhere in the rulebook is that stated but yet in both cases you know that those are the rules.

 

[29BmoreBird22]

I didnt pick 20 years to "measure" our knowledge of football. I picked that timeframe because it was about when the NFL started to shift the rules about what you can and cannot do to WRs.

Even in the modern NFL there are 2 times when you will almost never see PI called. One is when there are a bunch of bodies all going for the ball, which is most commonly in a hail mary but also occurs when you throw it up into triple coverage and all of them are around the ball. The second, though not relevant here, is when you can argue both the WR and defender were committing PI. You almost never see offsetting PI. Generally when both sides are shoving each other they will just let the play go.

Now the second obviously does not apply but in both cases nowhere in the rulebook is that stated but yet in both cases you know that those are the rules.

Well there's the issue- the two primary defenders on Likely were absolutely not playing the ball, so it doesn't fit that criteria.

 

[Adreme]

Well there's the issue- the two primary defenders on Likely were absolutely not playing the ball, so it doesn't fit that criteria.

So there were not a bunch of bodies around the ball within a yard of it? That is the first criteria. The second one does not apply but the first one clearly does. They played it exactly like a Hail Mary because if I showed you a clip of a Hail Mary and a clip of that play you would probably think they are the same clip (except for the jersey's changing color/number of course).

 

[29BmoreBird22]

So there were not a bunch of bodies around the ball within a yard of it? That is the first criteria. The second one does not apply but the first one clearly does. They played it exactly like a Hail Mary because if I showed you a clip of a Hail Mary and a clip of that play you would probably think they are the same clip (except for the jersey's changing color/number of course).

"One is when there are a bunch of bodies all going for the ball."

This is what you said. Two defenders were not going for the ball. One was outright tackling Likely and the other likely interferes if Likely isn't going down.

Ha, no, I wouldn't think that throw to Likely was a hail mary in the slightest.

 

[RavensMania]

I didnt pick 20 years to "measure" our knowledge of football. I picked that timeframe because it was about when the NFL started to shift the rules about what you can and cannot do to WRs.

Even in the modern NFL there are 2 times when you will almost never see PI called. One is when there are a bunch of bodies all going for the ball, which is most commonly in a hail mary but also occurs when you throw it up into triple coverage and all of them are around the ball. The second, though not relevant here, is when you can argue both the WR and defender were committing PI. You almost never see offsetting PI. Generally when both sides are shoving each other they will just let the play go.

Now the second obviously does not apply but in both cases nowhere in the rulebook is that stated but yet in both cases you know that those are the rules.

I didn't say they call pass interference during hail marys because they don't. However that wasn't a hail mary.....not even close. They tackled Likely...it was a penalty that wasn't called. I'll let you have the last word if you'd like to respond.

 

[OURavensFan]

Man chiefs fans talking shit at the airport. Thanks Ravens, I’m sure I’ll be greeted by happy AFCN rivals too when I land

 

[Adreme]

"One is when there are a bunch of bodies all going for the ball."

This is what you said. Two defenders were not going for the ball. One was outright tackling Likely and the other likely interferes if Likely isn't going down.

Ha, no, I wouldn't think that throw to Likely was a hail mary in the slightest.

Let me be clearer then. When you have a bunch of bodies within arms reach of the ball because similar to a Hail Mary half the players are not really going for the ball.

But lets play then. If you say that is nothing like a Hail Mary in the slightest, then find me the distinction because the ball was thrown up in a pile of bodies which when that happens you do not see PI.

 

[Tank]

agree and as Adreme is suggesting that no dpi's are called on hail mary's. This was not a hail mary.

It was an uncatchable ball, no DPI. I look at it as if it were our opponent, would I think it should be a DPI. If you do the same I’m pretty sure you would agree.

I just can’t wrap my head around throwing that pass, especially on 2nd down just outside the red zone with 7 minutes left in the game. Our defense was playing lights out at that point. The win was there for the taking, just be smart, methodical and get some points. In reality you wouldn’t expect any NFL QB to make such a dumb decision. Like WTF was Lamar thinking there?

 

[rmcjacket23]

I didn't say they call pass interference during hail marys because they don't. However that wasn't a hail mary.....not even close. They tackled Likely...it was a penalty that wasn't called. I'll let you have the last word if you'd like to respond.

Well, I'll say this... the boards are living up to "the brand" today. I stayed off of here intentionally all day yesterday, and at no point in time during or after the game did I think whining about officiating was going to be the topic of the day. But alas, here we are.

Of all of the many, many, many ways we didn't execute that would easily be discussed today, it's really clownish to be harping on some bail out DPI that wasn't called, or harping on officiating really at any level.

I expected the fire Harbaugh discussions. I expected the fire Monken discussions. I even expected the "we should cut Lamar" discussions. But you guys went to flow blown weird mode early.

Hats off to you all.

 

[29BmoreBird22]

Let me be clearer then. When you have a bunch of bodies within arms reach of the ball because similar to a Hail Mary half the players are not really going for the ball.

But lets play then. If you say that is nothing like a Hail Mary in the slightest, then find me the distinction because the ball was thrown up in a pile of bodies which when that happens you do not see PI.

Find me a hail mary where the ball is thrown with a low arc with a singular receiver running deep. Find me a hail mary where the primary defenders are playing the receiver, not the ball.

That wasn't a hail mary and your insistence is laughable.

 

[Adreme]

I didn't say they call pass interference during hail marys because they don't. However that wasn't a hail mary.....not even close. They tackled Likely...it was a penalty that wasn't called. I'll let you have the last word if you'd like to respond.

Then I will ask the same question to you: taking the time left out, because that is not relevant here, what in the execution of that play separates it from every other hail mary style throw, which we have seen at many points in games, where it is thrown up into a pile of bodies, a bunch of players hit each other, clearly early, and someone comes down with it or intercepts it? I cannot spot difference between that throw and how a hail mary is thrown or how the coverage on a hail mary would look. If there is one I would welcome the distinction .

 

[29BmoreBird22]

It was an uncatchable ball, no DPI. I look at it as if it were our opponent, would I think it should be a DPI. If you do the same I’m pretty sure you would agree.

I'd be pissed a Raven tackled the receiver and committed DPI when he didn't need to.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Man chiefs fans talking shit at the airport. Thanks Ravens, I’m sure I’ll be greeted by happy AFCN rivals too when I land

They earned the right to talk shit. They talked it all game long, they baited us into penalties, and they backed it up. We didn't.

We talk shit too. Sometimes we back it up. Sometimes we don't.

 

[Grim]

I think ultimately our guys need to grow up. They were beaten mentally before this game started. It’s clear to me Chiefs lived rent free in our heads. We were supposedly very healthy and mentally hardened yet we come into the game with a shit game plan to beat the Chiefs at their own game. Why did we not make them play our form of football? Why did we not run the ball? Why did we not run Lamar? Why didn’t we force them to not contain Lamar? Why did we have very bad decisions like that stupid triple coverage interception? This was discipline free football. The referees were definitely biased and gtfoh if you say they called a clean game. With that said there was no smoking gun decision that fucked us outside our own piss poor execution.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

by this logic, next playoff run we're losing in the superbowl
and we'll have to wait for the playoff run after that for a glory year

Nah we need 2 injury marred seasons in between

 

[Adreme]

Well, I'll say this... the boards are living up to "the brand" today. I stayed off of here intentionally all day yesterday, and at no point in time during or after the game did I think whining about officiating was going to be the topic of the day. But alas, here we are.

Of all of the many, many, many ways we didn't execute that would easily be discussed today, it's really clownish to be harping on some bail out DPI that wasn't called, or harping on officiating really at any level.

I expected the fire Harbaugh discussions. I expected the fire Monken discussions. I even expected the "we should cut Lamar" discussions. But you guys went to flow blown weird mode early.

Hats off to you all.

Has there honestly been "cut Lamar" talk. I have been pretty harsh on how he played but that is because when you are a 2x MVP the standard is higher than it is for say Brock Purdy. You have to be the difference maker when that is what you are and he did not have a good game by any standard. However I cannot imagine any serious talk about cutting him because of one bad game when he has been solid to great all year in every other game.

 

[RavensMania]

Then I will ask the same question to you: taking the time left out, because that is not relevant here, what in the execution of that play separates it from every other hail mary style throw, which we have seen at many points in games, where it is thrown up into a pile of bodies, a bunch of players hit each other, clearly early, and someone comes down with it or intercepts it? I cannot spot difference between that throw and how a hail mary is thrown or how the coverage on a hail mary would look. If there is one I would welcome the distinction .

time left is the desperation aspect of a hail mary, but you also have multiple offensive and defensive players positioning themselves. You had Likely and a few defensive players. Every pass into triple coverage isn't a hail mary and yes, pass interference does get called in non hail mary situations when it is absolutely obvious. Likely was tackled on that play. He could have gotten back to the ball. Just watch the replay.

 

[Grim]

You don’t cut Lamar Jackson that’s obviously tongue in cheek but he has to play better. Mahomes did and it’s clear for us the Chiefs are our boogeyman.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

If Lamar doesn’t under throw that ball by about 4 yards the flag might get thrown, if you want PI there throw a catchable ball instead of throwing it to the shallowest of 3 defenders

 

[OURavensFan]

Well, I'll say this... the boards are living up to "the brand" today. I stayed off of here intentionally all day yesterday, and at no point in time during or after the game did I think whining about officiating was going to be the topic of the day. But alas, here we are.

Of all of the many, many, many ways we didn't execute that would easily be discussed today, it's really clownish to be harping on some bail out DPI that wasn't called, or harping on officiating really at any level.

I expected the fire Harbaugh discussions. I expected the fire Monken discussions. I even expected the "we should cut Lamar" discussions. But you guys went to flow blown weird mode early.

Hats off to you all.

Flowers fumble and play calling was the main reason but the refs were pretty bad with the personal fouls and blatant PI on Likely x2, but if you don’t want to concede the first the second one was definitely a flag