I mean the offense plays to Lamar's skillset. If this were a standard drop back and pass first offense like most of the NFL the team would have the success it has had.
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I mean the offense plays to Lamar's skillset. If this were a standard drop back and pass first offense like most of the NFL the team would have the success it has had.
Lamar can also pass the ball and Roman is very basic in his passing schemes but genius in his running and blocking schemes.
I think it generally be universally agreed that Lamar is not a top 15 NFL passer which is why the offense plays to what he does better than anyone and gives the Ravens a top 5 offense. Hollywood does not seem to like the run first nature of the Ravens offense but that is how it is going to be regardless of whoever they put at coordinator for the next 5+ years. It is how the Ravens have won and will continue to do so. Meanwhile for those who want a modern passing attack a team like Arizona is ideal.
SepticeyePoe
Hall of Famer
Can I get a list of these top 15 passers?
Sure. For the obvious we have Allen, Burrow, Watson, Wilson, Herbert, Mahomes, Stafford, Murray, Brady, Rodgers, and Prescott. Then because I know arguments are about to occur we have again qualify purely in passing (because Lamar is a better QB then everyone about to listed and several who already were) we have Cousins, Carr, Ryan, and Tannehill to round out 15 and I did not even have to make a single controversial pick about it (in fact there are a few I suspect people would want me to put on the list ahead of those 15 who are not Lamar).
Now note as I already Lamar is a much better QB than more than half this list because his mobility both adds extra yards while opening up coverage in a way that almost no one else on this list can claim. However if you ran a traditional pass first offense and largely took that away then what do you really have? The Ravens offense works because Lamar in the right system is a top 5 QB. However that system is not going to appeal to everyone, especially WRs who like to get the ball.
Okay universally agreed outside of the Ravens bubble where fans try to argue Lamar can pass as well as Mahomes. Outside of that bubble for people who have spent their lives getting paid to analyze this it is agreed. I have him as a top 5 QB (and I know some of those same experts have him lower but I think the other stuff he does is that impressive) because of everything else. Because his ability to run compensates for the fact that he is not a top tier passer. He does not have to be because the fear of running creates openings that other QBs simply do not get because teams do not have to gameplan for them the same way.
you're gonna have to define what you mean by passer
because lamar's definitely a better passer than the last 4 you mentioned and kyler... that's not even a question for me
and you can make arguments for him over dak, burrow, stafford and herbert as a pure passer too
so you're gonna have to be a hell of a lot more specific about what you mean by passer...
Ellicottraven
Ravens Ring of Honor
I could not agree more with you. He has a laser for an arm, that people choose to ignore either deliberately or because they have a pre-conceived perception about him not being a good passer. Either option is infuriating.
Ellicottraven
Ravens Ring of Honor
Disagree vehemently. Lamar Jackson to me is top 5 QB in any system. He is literally lethal and the best QB in the system the Ravens have designed around him.
Ellicottraven
Ravens Ring of Honor
By universally, you mean what exactly? The hateful pundits or envious and hateful fans of other teams that are petrified of Lamar? They are not in a reality-based universe in my view. They live in a universe that fits the narrative that gives them the most clicks or in the universe of their own making that satisfies their own prejudices and feelings.
it's ridiculous - what about our offence is in any way different to the complex dangerous passing offences of other teams? literally the only thing we dont do is go under center and run boots and stuff like that
purely as QB passers, id say the only guys id definitely take ahead of lamar would be mahomes, allen, rodgers, brady
and Proche showed he can play well in the slot.
i think that's their hope with duvernay - EDC said he thought he took a step last year, and they hope he takes another
but we've been here before, hoping and waiting for guys to step up and it's not happened - i get that we have to trust the 2 coaches we brought in to help this group but also... we cant risk not having these guys step up and being stuck with bateman and no one else
Tandon Doss says hello somewhere
What do you think is more likely that there is a near universal conspiracy amongst NFL experts and coaches and pundits who have decades of experience analyzing football that they are going to intentionally pretend Lamar is worse than he is for no good reason (there really is not one as he is great for NFL ratings) or that the people who have spent decades analyzing players managed to look at a player and go "here is what he does great, here is what he does poorly".
The problem with conspiracy theories is that they never really hold up to scrutiny. I get it though. Lamar is our QB so anyone who thinks he isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread has to have some nebulous agenda. If a large group think he has weaknesses they must be part of some vast conspiracy. The problem is that this assertion does not make sense. He is a top 5 QB in the Ravens system. He is not in other systems.
going to disagree with this. Lamar can play in any system, whether it be vertical, EP or west cost offense. I think he would arguably do better in a system that past the ball more often and he proved that before injury this past season.
Ellicottraven
Ravens Ring of Honor
All I know is there is a 'monkey see, monkey copy' attitude that is extremely prevalent among coaches and pundits that don't have direct access to certain players or are too lazy to do independent research. Even the supposed experienced ones do that and once it becomes a trend, it becomes a fashionable trend especially if they have a posse of copycat pundits regurgitating the same garbage over and over again. That perception (completely false) becomes their reality. Even, when they see evidence contrary to their imagined narrative, they tend to dig deeper because these idiots are not conditioned to accept their irrational and terrible takes. That gives them license to dig deeper into their narrated constructs. This isn't any big conspiracy theory, but the lazy dogma practiced by most of these morons that have supposedly spent decades making money off of terrible takes with no accountability. If they could realistically be held accountable for their takes, they wouldn't be analysts that would be employed to be meting out garbage and unfounded takes for decades in the first place! Lamar is a unicorn the likes of which these moron pundits haven't seen before. When you see a unicorn that is going to upend your entire analytical ability, then your only course is to own up to your idiocy or take cover with the same take dogmatically, even if you begin to look like an idiot. Sorry, I don't see the Lamar hate as any conspiracy. I see it as the majority of analysts being so wrong on Lamar (like they were on MJ in the 80s'), that it hurts their made-up brand to admit they were wrong! More importantly, in this age of the 24-hour social media cycles, click-baiting pays and keeps people employed. They've found out that not only are these takes by them not held to account, but they can also, in fact, expand their brand. So, they perpetuate the same nonsense over and over again, till even innocent fans of the Ravens fall prey to it.