The Random Thought Thread

[Simba]

i mean this is just one of may scandals around this WC
and the engineering of the next WC hosts to pave the way for Saudi Arabia to host the one after is equally scandalous

gianni infantino is one of the most gutless horrible losers in sports
so corrupt that he's getting called out by sepp blatter, who was his incredibly corrupt predecessor

the way this tournament has been handled by FIFA has been outrageous - almost every decision has been gutless, corrupt and seemingly made on a whim and not with the rulebook in hand

All about the money. I would have loved to have gotten to a game but the price gouging was ridiculous. And that's to make more money on all of the under the table money they had already gotten.

It's a real shame it's gotten so bad.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Half the penalties in football are because someone might get hurt doing it. Pretty much every RTP falls under that category as do most of the rules about tackling. Every sport has a penalty for dangerous plays and for soccer getting the cleats at the back of the leg is one of the more dangerous plays.

Right, but they're penalties. Not ejections. A red card isn't a penalty. It's an ejection and basically a multi-game suspension.

 

[rossihunter2]

Best thing the US can do is develop a pipeline for the young talent to flow into Europe at a young age. Playing in MLS academies and against CONCACAF teams on a national level at a young age isn't doing enough for development when it really counts.

this is right
for US football to develop there's a lot of work to do:
1) they have to start moving away from the college sports model and have the MLS have proper academies that start at pre-teen ages
2) they have to invest money into making grassroots football cheaper - it's bizarre that it's so inaccessible given that you can play it with a couple of jumpers for goalposts and any ball shaped object
3) they have to start introducing elements of jeopardy to MLS - without relegation what are some of those teams and players playing for - it might not be good for spectators but it will be good generally for the translation from club to pro football if US players are used to fighting for their lives in defensive slugfests to scrape a point in a relegation battle vs having no jeopardy and being able to play a style of football with no repercussions

 

[rossihunter2]

All about the money. I would have loved to have gotten to a game but the price gouging was ridiculous. And that's to make more money on all of the under the table money they had already gotten.

It's a real shame it's gotten so bad.

honestly that's been the main scandal of this WC
the way that in some cases, people who have spent thousands on flights/accommodation etc. are somehow not even getting tickets that they've paid for or are having to fork out thousands for tickets that shouldn't be as expensive as they are

and all of this without even enforcing some of the key FIFA tenets about WC hosts that they have e.g. public transport and lasting infrastructure legacies, the idea that everyone's welcome (which is clearly not the case given what the Iran national team had to put up with, and the fact the Somalian referee wasn't allowed in) - those things in particular would not have been allowed with any other hosts in the history of the world cup

 

[Simba]

this is right
for US football to develop there's a lot of work to do:
1) they have to start moving away from the college sports model and have the MLS have proper academies that start at pre-teen ages
2) they have to invest money into making grassroots football cheaper - it's bizarre that it's so inaccessible given that you can play it with a couple of jumpers for goalposts and any ball shaped object
3) they have to start introducing elements of jeopardy to MLS - without relegation what are some of those teams and players playing for - it might not be good for spectators but it will be good generally for the translation from club to pro football if US players are used to fighting for their lives in defensive slugfests to scrape a point in a relegation battle vs having no jeopardy and being able to play a style of football with no repercussions

Issue is that the US doesn't want to see the talent escape from the US. They want it here, but then that brings up your point 3 where there's really nothing to play for. No incentive to win - whether that be for relegation or for some of those more extensive tournaments a la Champions League. Obviously I don't think an MLS team will ever be playing in the Champions League, but they literally just play games amongst themselves. No way to grow if you're keeping it all in house.

And then obviously, the draft aspect. Yes transfers are a thing and we usually get the talent at the tail end of their careers, but the initial entry for most of the league is the draft. It's very American and they need to be more European and beyond.

 

[Simba]

honestly that's been the main scandal of this WC
the way that in some cases, people who have spent thousands on flights/accommodation etc. are somehow not even getting tickets that they've paid for or are having to fork out thousands for tickets that shouldn't be as expensive as they are

and all of this without even enforcing some of the key FIFA tenets about WC hosts that they have e.g. public transport and lasting infrastructure legacies, the idea that everyone's welcome (which is clearly not the case given what the Iran national team had to put up with, and the fact the Somalian referee wasn't allowed in) - those things in particular would not have been allowed with any other hosts in the history of the world cup

You ain't kidding. Still think it's hilarious that the DC/Maryland bid didn't win because of the poor transportation yet teams are playing in KC with a stadium literally in the middle of nowhere with no meaningful public transport.

And then you have NY where a $12 train ride was jumped to $150. $25-50 parking in Philly jumping to $125-500. Ridiculous.

Like most things, money and politics reigned supreme. It was never about the game.

 

[UKRaven1827]

I don't really have a dog in this fight. But as an American, who also has a son who plays competitive Soccer, that red card is precisely the reason why most people in the US think professional soccer players are just massive, massive, massive pussys.

Its bad enough that ever two minutes somebody is writhing in pain on the ground like they just got sniped from 200 yards away in the leg, but then miraculously recover to full sprint mode seconds later when they don't hear a whistle. It's definitely being a pussy, but we've become accustomed to that.

The only basis for a red card in that spot is "he MIGHT have hurt somebody". Didn't actually hurt them. Just "MIGHT" have. That's why soccer gets viewed so poorly domestically among large scale fans.

Best thing the coaches for my son's teams have done... if you're down writhing in pain for more than about 5 seconds, you're off the field. You get subbed out. Maybe you come back on, maybe you don't. So either you're actually hurt, and you need to come off, or you're exaggerating a boo boo in an attempt to goad the ref into calling something. And in youth sports, they call virtually nothing, which is refreshing.

I dont think that view is exclusive to Americans as someone who has played the game my whole life and now spends wayyyy too much money following my team all around the country every Saturday. I hate it, I think it takes away from what is superb spectator sport as just highlighted beautifully by Argentina vs Egypt.

Outside the professional level nobody is taught to go down like you have been shot when you feel a slight bit of contact, at the professional level you are. It has become a tactic, it gives players a rest, it gives time for mangers to get instructions across to players, it stops momentum for the other team and they need to do more to stop it and to credit the Premier League it look like they are. Some new rule changes for the upcoming season to stop this, including players having to go off for an extended period if they receive treatment on the pitch. Obviously implementation is important but it's certainly a start.

 

[UKRaven1827]

the problem at professional level is that referees don't referee contact avoidance, and the game is played at such pace that minor contacts to cause major differences where they wouldnt necessarily do so at kid or amateur level - and small advantages are going to be manipulated either way (if you give defenders more leeway to be physical they will push those boundaries as far as they can)

an attacker has no incentive to avoid a tackle going through on goal because in the act of doing so he might trip or fall or make a tougher chance and he won't get any benefit from the referee for doing so - if a defender slides in, misses the ball and the attack jumps over the tackle but then falls over, it's play on even though that jump is forced by an illegal tackle

he's incentivised by the way those situations are refereed to take the contact which is why you see so many going to ground on soft contact - to force the referee to make the decision they wouldnt give if you tried to avoid the contact

the only way to fix it is to play advantage and punish defenders for challenges that would otherwise be fouls even when attackers try and avoid them - and then you bring in a whole extra level of judgement to the referee's decision making which given the current level of refereeing in the game is probably not a good thing

Yep. How many times do you hear "If he goes down there he probably gets the decision" No reward to stay on your feet.

 

[Raven y de Velez]

Gee, you are a savant. lol

Youre welcome, this is our sport after all, we prove it minutes ago

And on the subject, what a bunch of bullshit that post about how you lads see football players as pussies and thats why the sport is not popular in the US, and thats the reason you suck

Nah, you will never be good because futbol requires a level of technique, skill and coordination that no American sport, except maybe basketball can reach. You need to spend hours and hours with a ball, everyday, not running in a straight line or push the guy in front of you, being the strongest or the fastest guy on the field mean absolutely nothing. You also need an intrinsic understanding of tactics, you can grab 11 random guys here in Argentina, put them in a fútbol field and form a coherent and coordinated team, is in our dna

Oh and just to dismantle the notion that they are pussies, this guy played the 86 world cup final with a dislocated shoulder

 

[JoeyFlex5]

this is right
for US football to develop there's a lot of work to do:
1) they have to start moving away from the college sports model and have the MLS have proper academies that start at pre-teen ages
2) they have to invest money into making grassroots football cheaper - it's bizarre that it's so inaccessible given that you can play it with a couple of jumpers for goalposts and any ball shaped object
3) they have to start introducing elements of jeopardy to MLS - without relegation what are some of those teams and players playing for - it might not be good for spectators but it will be good generally for the translation from club to pro football if US players are used to fighting for their lives in defensive slugfests to scrape a point in a relegation battle vs having no jeopardy and being able to play a style of football with no repercussions

They do have academies from childhood, but you’re right that they’re pretty inaccessible. my nephew has been with private clubs year round for his whole childhood and teen years and it has absolutely crushed my brother-in-laws bank accounts and free time, think he stopped doing it sophomore year when he made HS varsity.

Private soccer clubs for kids and teens has been on a big upswing here lately.

 

[JAAM]

Youre welcome, this is our sport after all, we prove it minutes ago

And on the subject, what a bunch of bullshit that post about how you lads see football players as pussies and thats why the sport is not popular in the US, and thats the reason you suck

Nah, you will never be good because futbol requires a level of technique, skill and coordination that no American sport, except maybe basketball can reach. You need to spend hours and hours with a ball, everyday, not running in a straight line or push the guy in front of you, being the strongest or the fastest guy on the field mean absolutely nothing. You also need an intrinsic understanding of tactics, you can grab 11 random guys here in Argentina, put them in a fútbol field and form a coherent and coordinated team, is in our dna

Oh and just to dismantle the notion that they are pussies, this guy played the 86 world cup final with a dislocated shoulder

View attachment 8290

The Argentina team ain’t gon let you hit man

 

[JoeyFlex5]

You ain't kidding. Still think it's hilarious that the DC/Maryland bid didn't win because of the poor transportation yet teams are playing in KC with a stadium literally in the middle of nowhere with no meaningful public transport.

And then you have NY where a $12 train ride was jumped to $150. $25-50 parking in Philly jumping to $125-500. Ridiculous.

Like most things, money and politics reigned supreme. It was never about the game.

I’m sure all of the pro-America hype coming from the huge wave of first time tourists is going to die down really quick when they feel the effects of good ole american price gouging

 

[Tank]

Youre welcome, this is our sport after all, we prove it minutes ago

And on the subject, what a bunch of bullshit that post about how you lads see football players as pussies and thats why the sport is not popular in the US, and thats the reason you suck

Nah, you will never be good because futbol requires a level of technique, skill and coordination that no American sport, except maybe basketball can reach. You need to spend hours and hours with a ball, everyday, not running in a straight line or push the guy in front of you, being the strongest or the fastest guy on the field mean absolutely nothing. You also need an intrinsic understanding of tactics, you can grab 11 random guys here in Argentina, put them in a fútbol field and form a coherent and coordinated team, is in our dna

Oh and just to dismantle the notion that they are pussies, this guy played the 86 world cup final with a dislocated shoulder

View attachment 8290

Youre welcome, this is our sport after all, we prove it minutes ago

And on the subject, what a bunch of bullshit that post about how you lads see football players as pussies and thats why the sport is not popular in the US, and thats the reason you suck

Nah, you will never be good because futbol requires a level of technique, skill and coordination that no American sport, except maybe basketball can reach. You need to spend hours and hours with a ball, everyday, not running in a straight line or push the guy in front of you, being the strongest or the fastest guy on the field mean absolutely nothing. You also need an intrinsic understanding of tactics, you can grab 11 random guys here in Argentina, put them in a fútbol field and form a coherent and coordinated team, is in our dna

Oh and just to dismantle the notion that they are pussies, this guy played the 86 world cup final with a dislocated shoulder

View attachment 8290

Think you got the wrong dude professor. lol

 

[redrum52]

Youre welcome, this is our sport after all, we prove it minutes ago

And on the subject, what a bunch of bullshit that post about how you lads see football players as pussies and thats why the sport is not popular in the US, and thats the reason you suck

Nah, you will never be good because futbol requires a level of technique, skill and coordination that no American sport, except maybe basketball can reach. You need to spend hours and hours with a ball, everyday, not running in a straight line or push the guy in front of you, being the strongest or the fastest guy on the field mean absolutely nothing. You also need an intrinsic understanding of tactics, you can grab 11 random guys here in Argentina, put them in a fútbol field and form a coherent and coordinated team, is in our dna

Oh and just to dismantle the notion that they are pussies, this guy played the 86 world cup final with a dislocated shoulder

View attachment 8290

This what yall get for acting like you care about that trash ass sport lol

 

[rmcjacket23]

Youre welcome, this is our sport after all, we prove it minutes ago

And on the subject, what a bunch of bullshit that post about how you lads see football players as pussies and thats why the sport is not popular in the US, and thats the reason you suck

Nah, you will never be good because futbol requires a level of technique, skill and coordination that no American sport, except maybe basketball can reach. You need to spend hours and hours with a ball, everyday, not running in a straight line or push the guy in front of you, being the strongest or the fastest guy on the field mean absolutely nothing. You also need an intrinsic understanding of tactics, you can grab 11 random guys here in Argentina, put them in a fútbol field and form a coherent and coordinated team, is in our dna

Oh and just to dismantle the notion that they are pussies, this guy played the 86 world cup final with a dislocated shoulder

View attachment 8290

Cool. It's a shoulder. He plays soccer. He's literally not allowed to use his shoulder for anything. The only thing he needs a shoulder for is to push himself up off the ground from the rug burn he suffered when he fell to the ground, untouched, trying to gag on the ref's cock to get a free kick. Show me the list of guys playing with a broken leg.

Wake me when they stop rolling around on the ground writhing in pain from their menstrual cycles. Are these pussies living such a impoverished lifestyle that they can't afford a tampon for the match?

Soccer requires technical skill. It requires conditioning. It requires coordination. And if you want to play it professionally, it also requires you to be a massive, gaping, pussy. Being skilled doesn't take away from the requirements to be a pussy. It's still there.

 

[rossihunter2]

Yep. How many times do you hear "If he goes down there he probably gets the decision" No reward to stay on your feet.

and the annoying thing is there's not an obvious fix to change that risk/reward equation

 

[allblackraven]

Also thought the US played terribly from whistle to whistle. Not a lot of redeeming qualities in that performance. True showing of what a quality opponent can do, because the skill gap was massive. We always knew Ream and Freese were going to be problems, but it was just a matter of when. The attack was putrid. They thought they could just dribble through the defense like they were playing against Bosnia again, but Belgium was calm cool and collected and it resulted in nothing. US had no answers once their bread and butter of beating up on lesser opponents was taken away.

Best thing the US can do is develop a pipeline for the young talent to flow into Europe at a young age. Playing in MLS academies and against CONCACAF teams on a national level at a young age isn't doing enough for development when it really counts.

That would be tough to do. A lot of competing young talent in South America, Africa, Europe, Asia - all over the world. Ideally, you need a strong domestic competition to develop young players. That takes years of persistence and a lot of money invested to build a wider interest.

 

[rossihunter2]

They do have academies from childhood, but you’re right that they’re pretty inaccessible. my nephew has been with private clubs year round for his whole childhood and teen years and it has absolutely crushed my brother-in-laws bank accounts and free time, think he stopped doing it sophomore year when he made HS varsity.

Private soccer clubs for kids and teens has been on a big upswing here lately.

it's wild to me that it can be expensive

literally a sport that requires zero equipment or set-up
can be played on the street with scrunched up leftover tin foil if that's all you've got - you don't even necessarily need a goal either, but if you do you just put 2 rocks or t-shirts or literally anything to make a goal

 

[JO_75]

i mean this is just one of may scandals around this WC
and the engineering of the next WC hosts to pave the way for Saudi Arabia to host the one after is equally scandalous

Saudi Arabia is getting way to involved in Sports. All this sportswashing just to make them look good. Im hoping WWE changes their mind about Wrestlemania being in Saudi next year. The fact WWE hasn't confirmed any dates yet is giving me hope that it's possible they move it away from Saudi.

Let's just hope the NFL doesn't even think about putting a Super Bowl in Saudi at any point.

 

[Tank]

it's wild to me that it can be expensive

literally a sport that requires zero equipment or set-up
can be played on the street with scrunched up leftover tin foil if that's all you've got - you don't even necessarily need a goal either, but if you do you just put 2 rocks or t-shirts or literally anything to make a goal

When I was in grade school we played on asphalt with a crushed soda can, two rocks made each goal. lol
But there were 5 baseball diamonds I could walk to, baseball was the hot lick then.

A lot of the expense in youth advanced club soccer(usually referred to as travel team) here is in the travel and administration of the leagues.