JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
I wanna say Cleveland is when it got really bad
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Joe Flacco
- Thread starter ThatsMyJoeTerback
- Start date
TheCity5
MVP
My wording was off there. I said he headed to Minnesota then became a HC with it being interpreted as if he became HC of the Vikings but I'm well aware that he's the Giants HC.
Grim
Ravens Ring of Honor
I figured it was a typo just wanted it to be clear if someone read it and didn’t know.
TheCity5
MVP
np.
Tank
Hall of Famer
It’s funny how when a team is going bad and a fan posts his opinions of film breakdown that somehow immediately validates others thoughts with like opinions as if there’s been some great revelation or something. lol The circumstances surrounding the squad haven’t changed, generally many of the same overall issues that have spelled failure in the past still exist including inconsistent play from Joe when there’s no rhythm or flow to the game plan. That problem has been painfully apparent as was pointed out by many including the talking heads on the post game show of the Steelers game. To again post one notable quote from Esiason about the play calling, “what are they trying to accomplish?”.
As has been said by others when there’s losses fans are angry and they have to look for someone to blame. No matter, we’ll see how things shake out as something needs to change, and maybe they find a way to play to the strengths of the personnel. Whatever happens hopefully it spells future success for the team.
As has been said by others when there’s losses fans are angry and they have to look for someone to blame. No matter, we’ll see how things shake out as something needs to change, and maybe they find a way to play to the strengths of the personnel. Whatever happens hopefully it spells future success for the team.
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So, my question would be this- how do you ever expect an offense to get into a rhythm if your quarterback is making bad reads and bad throws?
This isn't Joe playing poorly because Marty is only calling dreadful plays or Joe only playing poorly because Lamar came in and that messes up rhythm- this is just flat out playing poorly in the realm he controls.
This isn't Joe playing poorly because Marty is only calling dreadful plays or Joe only playing poorly because Lamar came in and that messes up rhythm- this is just flat out playing poorly in the realm he controls.
Grim
Ravens Ring of Honor
I think it’s funny how you and I both were calling for us to draft another QB just in case Joe didn’t return to form and just in case he regressed. We both floated around either Wentz or Goff and while neither was there we both called the need. I can’t speak for you but for me it was just that when you start having what’s been having to Joe occur you need to start thinking about what’s next. This just goes to show that opinions differ but it’s not something that people drew up due to a few bad games this year.
Grim
Ravens Ring of Honor
Hey man don’t get us wrong. I can’t speak on everyone but I myself love Joe Flacco and what he did for this team. If he turned it around tomorrow and showed he cleaned up his game I’d support him but he’s lost my trust. I’ve seen the same movie too many times now. With that said, I wouldn’t use the OC as a way to defend Flacco and here’s why:
https://www.nbcsports.com/washingto...ecision-marty-mornhinweg-came-down-joe-flacco
I remember this too. We all wanted Marty gone and we blame John but Joe wanted to keep Marty and played a big role in that decision. So if Joe wants Marty can we really say Joe doesn’t have fault then? Maybe Joe likes his play calls? To me it sounds that way and if so, then you can absolutely question Joe’s decision to keep him here if he played a big role in him staying.
Militant X 1
Hall of Famer
Awesome! Awesome! Awesome! Breakdown!
I've said this over and over and over. Joe makes inaccurate reads at times and completely stares down receivers and then misses wide open players (i.e. Lamar and Buck). Dude still plays like a "rookie" although he's been the "starting" QB for 11 years. At some damn point; you got to acknowledge the fact that this cat just isn't that good....period!
Tank
Hall of Famer
I hear you and not saying it’s just one thing, but Joe wanting Marty to stay doesn’t mean things turned out well or the way he envisioned. They did have some success the latter part of last season and I’m guessing after a revolving door of OCs any sort of continuity looked appealing.
It’s not like it’s been hidden or a mystery, Stevie Wonder could see the play selection this year has often been disjointed and bizarre, not a plan that plays to strengths or one promoting rhythm and confidence. I mean it’s also been blatantly apparent while watching certain drives in poorly played games that the offense can be on point and confident when there’s a tempo and rhythm established. It’s really frustrating to see it happen and you just kinda sit back and say why the hell couldn’t they do that during the rest of the game?
I’m not going to further debate anyone’s opinion on Joe at this point because it’s always a circle. I hope whatever happens in the future improves the performance of the team and makes them successful. I would just hate to see futile attempts to improve that don’t address the roots of the problem.
Oh yeah, I wanted Goff something fierce if he started to slip. Wentz would have also been a really nice pickup.
I'm just really glad the FO had the guts to trade up for a quarterback. Even if Lamar doesn't pan out, and I certainly think he can if he continues to refine his mechanics (which admittedly is SUPER difficult at the NFL level), I'm glad the FO the Ravens didn't just sit pat with the pile of garbage they've been putting out offensively lately.
I would LOVE for Joe Flacco to do well. I would take 2010-2012 Joe back in a heartbeat because while that Joe didn't have the pretty stats, he was at least pretty damn good and I'd argue a top 10 quarterback in the NFL.
I figured Tank would brush off Marty in favor of his lord and savior, like any free agent wide receiver that doesn't work out, but the fact of the matter is that he's calling out the play calling, but as Edgar just showed, and as MANY people point out in the game day threads, the play calling isn't necessarily an issue. Joe is flat out missing reads and wide open throws. If Joe had a wide open player on every single drive and missed it in favor of the two yard check down every single play, Tank would come in here lamenting how the play calling is so bad. Meanwhile, there's someone running open and Joe just missed him.
And as I said before, Tank likes to talk all about the rhythm and the flow of the game, but Flacco plays just as large a part in this. He needs to hit the open reads and make better decisions or the offense will always sputter along and have no flow because there will be no consistency. The fact of the matter is that the rhythm and flow start up front.
I also find it quite "pot meet kettle" that Tank is saying people want a scapegoat, so they blame Joe, but here he is ignoring all issues that Joe creates in favor of blaming the play calling and Lamar Jackson for Joe doing poorly.
Militant X 1
Hall of Famer
There is a lot of merit to what you are saying here @Tank.
And to be honest, that is one of the major things that pisses me off about the Ravens and the offense (the defense stinks up the joint as well lol) in particular as well. Why not go into a game with the gameplan of playing to the "strengths" of your personnel for an entire 60 mins?
Although Flacco isn't nor ever will be my cup of tea as a QB, the one thing that I give him his props for is that the dude can flat out ball when playing from the Gun, uptempo, no-huddle flow and from play-action. Flacco seems to love playing fast so why slow him down? Let the stallion run!
ravenslord
Ravens Ring of Honor
I agree that Joe plays best during the hurry up as he is a rhythm QB. He is at his best in this scenario.
The problem is the Ravens coaching staff wants to slow it down when we are playing against elite QB's like Brees. We want to keep
elite Qb's off the field as much as possible and our D is overrated.
Catch -22 here.
Grim
Ravens Ring of Honor
Maybe it doesn’t mean the offense is turning out how he hoped but this is kind of who Marty is. I don’t know what the real root of the problem is but what I do know is pretty simple: our run game sucks, Joe needs a strong run game to be effective, Joe continues to either not hit guys in stride or over/underthrows them and fails to recognize coverage and adjust his guys. That Kubiak Flacco was the best I’ve seen and I thought Flacco was coming back this year; however the same old problems persist. I have no choice but to put it on Hoe now. That’s why I say he’s lost my trust and even if he kills it and wins another SB I would still want him gone.
You want to know who Flacco is to me now? He’s that ex or spouse or whatever you used to love and they cheated on you numerous times and now the relationship is fractured and you know it’s time to move on but you’re waiting for the right moment. I wish him well but he’s dead to me now. That doesn’t mean I want him to play bad—I hope he kills it.
We both said it then but even if we don’t need a new starting QB we desperately need a good backup QB. I felt and still feel that was the right decision. You can’t trust Flacco to be healthy as we saw last year and you can’t trust him to do well as we’ve seen for many years. He’s too hit and miss. With this WR corps he should be killing it especially with how pass happy Marty is. I’m not bragging here by saying we predicted this years ago because we were both lambasted for suggesting drafting a QB high then but I think we’d look a lot different if we got Wentz or Goff then but who knows if they would’ve developed the same here but still.
I do think Lamar can actually develop. I had a lot of doubts when we drafted him but I’ve seen progression so I am very hopeful.
I will admit I thought the Jackson stuff was stupid early and disrupted Flacco’s “rhythm” but the more I watched the less I could believe that. I was in denial and maybe others are in the same boat. I can’t blame anyone for not seeing it because I was frankly there too. It’s really hard to admit but Flacco just isn’t playing well and hasn’t for years—years. He’s like an estranged family member—I know he exists but I don’t see him much if at all. I don’t think he can make it happen unless he has a run game to take away pressure. I think Flacco gets easily ratted and mentally beats himself so he makes this erratic throws even when there is no pressure. I’m not going to speak much on Tank because I don’t know what he’s thinking but I know what I was thinking and I’ve had to wash my hands of Joe now. I’m ready to move on from him.
Militant X 1
Hall of Famer
Oh, I agree with that assessment as well @ravenslord. But the reality is, how often do the Ravens play a QB like Brees? The Saints never "change" who they are to accommodate their opponent. Naw! They are going to come in and be who they are and light your ass up through the air mixed in with a few runs here and there....period! Their personnel and scheme are built that way. Not the Ravens though!
The Ravens are too predictable and lethargic in their offensive approach! Listen, I'm old school and absolutely love the ground and pound game. I love it! And yet, I also know that you got to have that "balanced" attack and the threat of taking the top off of the defense through the air. But to do that; you need a stout O-line, fierce RB/TE's and a QB who can make the proper reads and hit the open receivers and those said receivers must know how to make plays for that QB (ala Moore's crazy catch last week).
I say; IF, IF your "franchise" QB is more comfortable running a no-huddle, quick and uptempo flow from the Gun and play action; BUILD A SCHEME AROUND HIM AND HIS SKILL SET! Bring in the personnel that fit that type of style and flow and STOP trying to fit square pegged players into a round hole scheme.
Grim
Ravens Ring of Honor
That’s the Flacco I would love to see and it is maddening that we don’t see him more. I don’t think we do a good job on the coaching aspect of playing players to their strengths and often fit them to what we want them to do. Bill is a mastermind at this and it’s why he can mask less talented players and make them look like ballers. NE just knows how to get the best out of what they have.
Joe does do well during hurry up but I’m not sure I agree on the catch 22. Not that I can’t be persuaded to agree just saying I don’t see it right now. I say that because when we do play ball control and try to run out the clock because we’re up we typically win. It’s the games where we are playing close or getting beat that we can’t catch up or secure the win. I do agree the defense is overrated.
Tank
Hall of Famer
lol......All QBs and offenses work best when in a rhythm. Watch the Pats, Saints, Steelers, Eagles, etc., etc., etc.. And you can’t slow the game down if you don’t have a run game. I mean damn, we can’t get enough run production to get to 2nd and 6 much less enough to take the air out of the ball.
Slowing the game down, being conservative has produced losses. Playing not to lose is for losers. You play to your strengths, try to win and if you lose at least you have played with what should be your best effort. I don’t care if you are winning by 3 scores, keep the foot on the pedal and do what you do best.
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Militant X 1
Hall of Famer
The Ravens coaching staff seems as though they have no clue as to utilizing the strengths of a player. I get so pissed off when watching a few other teams and their coaching staff's seemingly abilities to bring out the best in their offensive roster personnel (i.e. Bill).
TheCity5
MVP
I don’t think you can absolve either side of blame. I definitely think Joe is really playing poorly at the moment and playing himself out of Baltimore, but you cannot ignore just how poorly of a job the OC is doing. There is more to a OC then calling the plays, it’s gameplanning, creativity or taking what the defense gives you. This is most obviously seen in the Lamar Jackson plays where I’m just dumbfounded by some of the calls. I mean against the Saints we’re at their 18 and you call a 5 yard pass play to John Brown short of the 1st down? You’re in Tucker’s range anyways why not make a play for the 1st? Why play for the FG there? Why on Earth would you run that play play when you weren’t backed up all that much? Also the runs with Lamar has been incredibly predictable and that falls on Marty more then anyone else. It’s been a lot of outside zone and the defense sees it coming from a mile away. I don’t think you need to look at Joe himself to see that Marty has been eerily predictable and has lacked creativity in his play calling because we’re seeing it with Lamar at QB. I think the issues at OC are just as bad if not worse then QB.