cdp
Ravens Ring of Honor
Rivers played at least well despite questionable OL, backfield (mr IR matthew, oliver etc) and Allen was injured a lot in the past 5 seasons.
Btw isn't this Lamars thread?
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Lamar Jackson
- Thread starter Ice Bowl
- Start date
Btw isn't this Lamars thread?
allblackraven
Hall of Famer
And that's the entire truth about Flacco and has been since he got drafted. Instead, he constantly demands great O line play, great running game and great play calling to play well.
of course there are. we didn't say they were going to the hof, it was just mentioned that they were here to stay.
Militant X 1
Hall of Famer
Let me help you bring it back to Lamar.
I just finished watching this Youtube clip of all of his runs and passes. Of course, there were more runs than passes. Lamar brings tons of energy and athleticism to the QB position and I love it but IMO he still has major work to do in his ability to be a more effective passer. Sure, the gameplan was for him to use his athleticism and he ran the ball an unprecedented 27x vs the Bengals and we won the game. I get that!
I don't personally feel that we can expect him to sustain that type of performance week after week. At some point, he's got to learn how to settle down in the pocket, make his reads quickly and then launch missiles and darts to his open WR's/TE's and let them eat as well. To see him win a few games by throwing a few TD passes as well as using his legs would be a beautiful thing to see.
JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
Hasn’t rivers led multiple #1 offenses despite having a shit OL and no run game for most of his career?
JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
I personally don’t see any indication that he needs to settle down in the pocket and no indication that he can’t be a relatively solid passer. His vision, anticipation, and pocket poise is already miles ahead of joes, his motions and reads are all lightning quick and should allow for effective timing based concepts which is something that has always been a huge problem for joe, he’s never been able to make quality reads and move in a quick enough manner to execute timing routes, it’s why we’ve failed terribly as a screen team all these years.
There’s a stigma that lamar is totally incapable of throwing the ball and I understand from his preseason, but this past game should have alleviated a lot of that concern as he showed a lot of VERY promising qualities as a passer
ive also watched the lamar stuff a few times through now...
we ran a ton of RPOs in that game and almost every time we called one the bengals let us run - a notable exception off the top of my head was the quick short pass to nick boyle over the middle where he was falling over the whole way
i think after being gashed for 500 yards in 3 games in a row that they just didnt want to get beat through the air so they always gave us the run - and Lamar read it and took the run
i think we'll run a similar number of RPOs in this game vs the raiders and i think the raiders are gonna go after the run a bit more which will mean if lamar reads it right that we should see him passing more
in terms of pocket passing though i have no real issue outside of just not seeing him get the opportunity to truly launch it to the outside or deep yet - but he stood in the pocket and manipulated the pocket around him well and then he stood there and delivered a few times - the 17 yard completion to snead on 2nd and 17 sticks in my mind
so i agree with you that we shouldnt expect to see him run that much again - and it would be bad if he did run that much again week after week - but i will say that i dont think the gameplan moving forward will be to see him run that much
and remember within those runs are 3 kneels but also a handful of plays where he was looking downfield and nothing was open so he got out of bounds for a short gain (i remember one specific instance where he got flushed right and could have run for 5-6 but in stead kept his eyes downfield to look for the receiver and eventually ran out of room so dashed out of bounds for a quick 2 yard gain
3-4ravdef509
Practice Squad
Here’s a good breakdown of Lamar I think.
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Militant X 1
Hall of Famer
While I enjoyed watching Lamar bring the excitement and freshness in Sunday's game, I wouldn't say that it alleviated that concern for me. Personally, I have never said that Lamar is "incapable" of throwing the ball, however, IMO he still needs further work and development as a passer who can also be a threat from the pocket as well as with his legs. Hopefully, he can show us that side of his game and dot up those Raiders.
DeVito52
Ravens Ring of Honor
You wouldn’t rank Cam Newton or Matt Stafford above Joe Flacco? Really? You sir are going hardcore homer on us. Not even to mention that Andrew Luck is probably a top 5 QB.
SepticeyePoe
Hall of Famer
You know it's a Ravens QB thread when it gets sidetracked for 3-4 pages.
MARLON HUMPHREY
Militant X 1
Hall of Famer
Lamar played well for his first start. I'm not taking anything away from him. For me, it's personal preference. We are pretty much saying the same thing from the standpoint that like you, I too would have loved to see Lamar stand in the pocket and "launch" it to the outside or deep for huge gains.
Again, I'm not saying that he can't throw but in this first body of work of his; he mostly ran and the few short passes were nice but IMO his mechanics (i.e. sidearming) with a few of them needs improvement and I'm pretty sure he will. Here's a nice video I watched about Lamar and his decision making with the RPO's to either run or pass....
3-4ravdef509
Practice Squad
Luck might be a top 5 one day.
No I wouldn’t take either over Joe. Stafford is garbage. I like Newton, overall maybe he’d edge Joe out but as a pure passer Joe is better.
JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
But what I’m saying is that lamar didn’t show anything to suggest he won’t be a decent passer. Sidearm passes aren’t some mechanical flaw, it’s an adlib to hit a passing lane that he wouldn’t be able to without adjusting the release point, it’s how you avoid balls getting batted by the front seven, hitting lewis’ helmet was a coincidence and I’m really tired of seeing it brought up, I get it, it was funny, but it’s far from a reason to bash him or downgrade him. And he chose the run so much because the bengals gave him the run for some inexplicable reason, he took what the defense gave him and made exceptional plays and he and Gus carried this team on their legs and lamar made the passes that had to be made in key moments. His decision making was fine aside from maybe 4 plays, the int, the one that was almost picked by the LB, the one where he took the read while the nickel corner was blitzing, and the one where he cut upfield in the red zone instead of scrambling a little wider and got tripped up by geno. I legitimately cannot think of another poor decision made by him.
JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
Stafford on those 08-12 ravens squads are SB winners every year lmao, and cam isn’t the greatest passer but I’ll take his passing ability over joes as of late, no question.
You seem very deluded about what joe is. I was joes biggest supporter and after free agency I said if he fails again this year then the excuses are done and he is what he is and I’ll look like an ass. He failed again and made all his staunch supporters look like an ass.
3-4ravdef509
Practice Squad
Yeah...that's just not logical. You can't just crystallize the truth in such reductionist methods.
Stafford is pretty inconsistent with poor decision making. Idk why you are so high on him. I think you're missing some of the nuance of the way passing works, it takes more than just accurate throwing : timing, route running, chemistry and balance on the offensive side of the ball. It seems like you and everyone on this board has decided that because we are losing games, and Joe misses some throws, therefore Joe sucks. On a play by play basis you have to examine what's going on, and some misses passes are Joe's fault, some are the receivers fault, some are wind, etc. For example I'm pretty sure one of Joe's misses passes early on in the Steelers game was a miscue between Crabtree and Joe where Joe thought he'd break his route at the 1st down marker and Crabtree went like a yard or so further - Joe was trying to do what people here want him to , which is throw the ball before the receiver is open. Thing is, that's not as easy as it sounds especially with receivers you don't have tons of experience playing with. Of course there are other instances where Joe throws a bad ball or just misses a little bit because he isn't the most accurate quarterback in the league. There's also the factor that without a decent running game defenses have adjusted and have been playing the pass, knowing our line is a weakness as well. I agree that Lamar can do things with the quality of offensive line we have that Joe can't. But Lamar has his own limitations.