The Well-Mannered Politics Thread

[Willbacker]

Contradict yourself much?

No I don't but I'm an honest person. I know what I wrote. Atheists commit rape too. Whatever.

 

[rossihunter2]

Man I will give you serious kudos. The point is man is supposed to be head of household and it also points out in the bible men cannot mistreat women unlike the Koran. The silence in church was very notable tho since I can tell you its not like that now and as a Christian I don't agree with that and its disheartening to see that.

Now you're going to have these rape stats tho. They have risen dramatically. You're not the only European country neither but I'm just pulling UK stats up. Seriously coincidence.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/283100/recorded-rape-offences-in-england-and-wales-uk-y-on-y/

As I said before take a walk in a Muslim neighborhood preferably after dark and it shouldn't be a problem. For a man it should be safe. Right? Have you been to these neighborhoods?

right so rape stats without context dont suggest anything to do with islam - im imagining that your point is the rise of islam coincides with those statistics going up but i imagine the correlation will be statistically insignificant given that muslims have been emigrating to the UK for decades

i would suggest (albeit without much analysis) that the statistical rise in rape offences partially is down to increased confidence from victims that they will get due process and not be treated with disdain and assumptions of guilt themselves - i would suggest it also comes from increased sexual liberation and a higher awareness and education of what constitutes consent given that those stats correspond to police records and not actual numbers of rapes which we know have historically been under recorded due to lack of confidence in due process from victims

i would suggest that there's a confluence of reasons that recorded rapes have increased that's got very little to do with religious populations
_____________________________________________

with regards to walking in a muslim neighbourhood i dont get what your point is - you seem to be assuming that your statement is some kind of profound argument ending point - but i have been to these neighbourhoods, lived in these neighbourhoods, visited friends in these neighbourhoods

i dont know what you envision in a "muslim neighbourhood" but in the most stereotypical sense they are just areas of low-income housing based around high streets where food markets have an emphasis on halal food and there's probably a mosque close by

in that sense they differ in no way from other council housing estates or low-income areas in the uk cities

 

[29BmoreBird22]

And you said there was 89 terror attacks when there was 35 in between 2011-15. So you didn't have your facts straight and nothing showed the race or religion of the perpetraitor.

I showed you a link of where I found my statistics, so I mean, I really wasn't wrong...

 

[Willbacker]

right so rape stats without context dont suggest anything to do with islam - im imagining that your point is the rise of islam coincides with those statistics going up but i imagine the correlation will be statistically insignificant given that muslims have been emigrating to the UK for decades

i would suggest (albeit without much analysis) that the statistical rise in rape offences partially is down to increased confidence from victims that they will get due process and not be treated with disdain and assumptions of guilt themselves - i would suggest it also comes from increased sexual liberation and a higher awareness and education of what constitutes consent given that those stats correspond to police records and not actual numbers of rapes which we know have historically been under recorded due to lack of confidence in due process from victims

i would suggest that there's a confluence of reasons that recorded rapes have increased that's got very little to do with religious populations
_____________________________________________

with regards to walking in a muslim neighbourhood i dont get what your point is - you seem to be assuming that your statement is some kind of profound argument ending point - but i have been to these neighbourhoods, lived in these neighbourhoods, visited friends in these neighbourhoods

i dont know what you envision in a "muslim neighbourhood" but in the most stereotypical sense they are just areas of low-income housing based around high streets where food markets have an emphasis on halal food and there's probably a mosque close by

in that sense they differ in no way from other council housing estates or low-income areas in the uk cities

No its been major mass immigration the last few years. Sure Muslims have been coming for awhile but lets be real. And this massive increase is due to victims speaking out more? Personally I believe a lot is not being reported (remember sharia courts). So I strongly disagree that its got very little to do with religion.

Now you said in your previous post there were strictly Muslim areas but yet you just said you've lived there and visited friends there. I have to ask if you're Muslim? Then I would understand more.

 

[Willbacker]

I showed you a link of where I found my statistics, so I mean, I really wasn't wrong...

Can you repost that please? Have to get back Weds. Gotta take off.

 

[The Raven]

Anyone else realize that the culture war is just to distract us from the fact that this is the most incompetent administration in history with the worst Congress ever elected?

 

[rossihunter2]

No its been major mass immigration the last few years. Sure Muslims have been coming for awhile but lets be real. And this massive increase is due to victims speaking out more? Personally I believe a lot is not being reported (remember sharia courts). So I strongly disagree that its got very little to do with religion.

Now you said in your previous post there were strictly Muslim areas but yet you just said you've lived there and visited friends there. I have to ask if you're Muslim? Then I would understand more.

there's been a lot of fear of muslim mass migration into the UK, but while the rest of Europe has had major influxes of refugees the Uk hasn't done its part and taken in many refugees at all - despite the fears stirred up by Brexit campaigners about mass migration into the UK that's really not been the case - if you were going to pin the stats to any particular circumstances leading to a mass influx of 'foreigners' into the country the one that would correspond better with those stats (and im not remotely saying this is accurate just saying it would be more likely correlated) would be the enlargement of the EU

and i dont know what sharia courts have to do with non-muslim rape victims or tbh muslim victims either

and no i said there were many predominantly muslim communities - i did not say they were muslim-only
im not muslim im as atheist as they come

 

[rossihunter2]

Anyone else realize that the culture war is just to distract us from the fact that this is the most incompetent administration in history with the worst Congress ever elected?

dunno about you but i havent been distracted

 

[rossihunter2]

Me neither but from the abundance of sharia law debate it seems at least one person is

i wouldn't call it a debate really...

 

[29BmoreBird22]

Can you repost that please? Have to get back Weds. Gotta take off.

https://www.google.com/amp/reason.c.../do-muslims-commit-most-us-terrorist-atta/amp

It's from Mother Jones. It sounds like there's probably a lot of discretion that goes into what is a terrorist attack, similar to what is a mass shooting.

 

[29BmoreBird22]

And this massive increase is due to victims speaking out more?

I think that's a very real possibility. Many rapes go unreported for fear or retaliation by the rapist or friends of the rapist or for fear that the courts just won't do anything.

 

[Inqui]

Anyone else realize that the culture war is just to distract us from the fact that this is the most incompetent administration in history with the worst Congress ever elected?

I'd say the culture war has been going on since the Mayflower landed, but this administration is particularly adept at controlling the topics of discussion (in the soft power manner of influencing the national headlines, in case I need to clarify what I mean).

It's a little depressing how much discussion there has (or rather hasn't) been about actual policy stuff - such as healthcare, infrastructure spending or the budget. In the past four pages or so there's been your post mentioning the budget and my post giving an opinion but that's been it. Granted there hasn't been a huge amount to work with but I'm genuinely curious to hear the thoughts of someone who thinks Trump's tax proposal is a winner.

 

[BloodRaven]

I'd say the culture war has been going on since the Mayflower landed, but this administration is particularly adept at controlling the topics of discussion (in the soft power manner of influencing the national headlines, in case I need to clarify what I mean).

It's a little depressing how much discussion there has (or rather hasn't) been about actual policy stuff - such as healthcare, infrastructure spending or the budget. In the past four pages or so there's been your post mentioning the budget and my post giving an opinion but that's been it. Granted there hasn't been a huge amount to work with but I'm genuinely curious to hear the thoughts of someone who thinks Trump's tax proposal is a winner.

I think Trump and Pences recent PR stunt at the Niners game shows how theyre encouraging division

 

[The Raven]

I'd say the culture war has been going on since the Mayflower landed, but this administration is particularly adept at controlling the topics of discussion (in the soft power manner of influencing the national headlines, in case I need to clarify what I mean).

It's a little depressing how much discussion there has (or rather hasn't) been about actual policy stuff - such as healthcare, infrastructure spending or the budget. In the past four pages or so there's been your post mentioning the budget and my post giving an opinion but that's been it. Granted there hasn't been a huge amount to work with but I'm genuinely curious to hear the thoughts of someone who thinks Trump's tax proposal is a winner.

I'd like to see more discussion of education, too. Time and time again I've heard, in my work as a journalist, from business leaders and economists who say they can't build a business because they don't have a workforce. You know why manufacturing is dead in this country? It's because our workforce doesn't have the four year university education that today's manufacturing sector requires. Today's manufacturing workers need a degree in engineering or even computer science. Or at least a certificate program from a community college. At a major military base nearby, there's over 100 cyber security jobs that are UNFILLED because we don't have enough people with those skills.

We romanticize the glory days where a high school degree could get you a 40 year career with GM or Beth Steel but we forgot to build an education system to prepare us for the jobs of the next generation. We need more engineering degrees. We need more cyber degrees. This is what's wrong with our economy: an unskilled workforce and a government that's unwilling to invest in "free" college. Christ, Republicans won't even support free community college. They extol the virtue of working in the trades but won't fund free community college, where people go to learn how to get into the trades. It's fucking moronic -- no other way to put it.

Not only do we romanticize the days where a high school degree was enough, but some conservatives even go so far as to denigrate the move to get more four year degrees. We need more engineers, cyber security experts, chemists, and computer programmers. That's where the economy's growth sectors are, yet we're not investing our educational resources there.

Montgomery County in MD is both the richest and most educated. Somerset County, no offense to anyone there, has the lowest median household income and the least educated workforce. There is a clear correlation there and making at least community college free to the student would go a long way in removing the barriers to gainful employment.

Your economic class should not determine whether you're able to receive a quality education. We're better than that, and Republicans haven't done a damn thing about it. There is no reason not to make four year universities free to the student.

I like living in a world where we have more smart people and more skilled people. Why is that a controversial opinion in this country?

 

[gtalk12]

Apparently some owners of the NFL are now cracking down on those who kneel.

I am really curious as to how this plays out, it is going to look very bad on the NFL and its owners if they do something to the players...

 

[cobrajet]

I'd like to see more discussion of education, too. Time and time again I've heard, in my work as a journalist, from business leaders and economists who say they can't build a business because they don't have a workforce. You know why manufacturing is dead in this country? It's because our workforce doesn't have the four year university education that today's manufacturing sector requires. Today's manufacturing workers need a degree in engineering or even computer science. Or at least a certificate program from a community college. At a major military base nearby, there's over 100 cyber security jobs that are UNFILLED because we don't have enough people with those skills.

We romanticize the glory days where a high school degree could get you a 40 year career with GM or Beth Steel but we forgot to build an education system to prepare us for the jobs of the next generation. We need more engineering degrees. We need more cyber degrees. This is what's wrong with our economy: an unskilled workforce and a government that's unwilling to invest in "free" college. Christ, Republicans won't even support free community college. They extol the virtue of working in the trades but won't fund free community college, where people go to learn how to get into the trades. It's fucking moronic -- no other way to put it.

Not only do we romanticize the days where a high school degree was enough, but some conservatives even go so far as to denigrate the move to get more four year degrees. We need more engineers, cyber security experts, chemists, and computer programmers. That's where the economy's growth sectors are, yet we're not investing our educational resources there.

Montgomery County in MD is both the richest and most educated. Somerset County, no offense to anyone there, has the lowest median household income and the least educated workforce. There is a clear correlation there and making at least community college free to the student would go a long way in removing the barriers to gainful employment.

Your economic class should not determine whether you're able to receive a quality education. We're better than that, and Republicans haven't done a damn thing about it. There is no reason not to make four year universities free to the student.

I like living in a world where we have more smart people and more skilled people. Why is that a controversial opinion in this country?

Now we have to pay for a free four year university education? Get a student loan and pay for it yourself, we have too much other free stuff we are already paying for! I will pay for that if they stop funding planned parenthood and welfare. The Baltimore Police Department is hiring if anyone needs a career and all you need is a GED.

 

[The Raven]

Now we have to pay for a free four year university education? Get a student loan and pay for it yourself, we have too much other free stuff we are already paying for! I will pay for that when they stop funding planned parenthood and welfare, how about that? The Baltimore Police Department is hiring if anyone needs a career and all you need is a GED.

What you're telling me is that you don't want to live in a more skilled, smarter country with a workforce that attracts new businesses. Good luck with that.

The cost of higher ed has increased more than doubled the cost of inflation since the 90s. In the 1960s, you could put yourself through college working 10 hours a week at minimum wage. Now, you'd have to work 44 hours a week at minimum wage just to pay for college, let alone rent. That's not reasonable.

Student loan debt is so exceedingly high it's actually draining the economy. Most of us can't afford homes because of student loans. And past that, we don't have disposable income that drives the rest of the economy.

Anything else? Do you like living in a world that's not as smart and skilled as it could be? God forbid we invest in the future.

The skills gap is killing job creation. Any take on that? Probably not, right? Do you not see that a lack of skilled workers is hurting our economy? Not your problem, right?

Yet again, @K-Dog shows up with a passive aggressive reaction and no substance.

 

[allblackraven]

Now we have to pay for a free four year university education? Get a student loan and pay for it yourself, we have too much other free stuff we are already paying for! I will pay for that when they stop funding planned parenthood and welfare, how about that? The Baltimore Police Department is hiring if anyone needs a career and all you need is a GED.

You say that like everybody's desire is to become a cop in Baltimore.

 

[29BmoreBird22]

What you're telling me is that you don't want to live in a more skilled, smarter country with a workforce that attracts new businesses. Good luck with that.

The cost of higher ed has increased more than doubled the cost of inflation since the 90s. In the 1960s, you could put yourself through college working 10 hours a week at minimum wage. Now, you'd have to work 44 hours a week at minimum wage just to pay for college, let alone rent. That's not reasonable.

Student loan debt is so exceedingly high it's actually draining the economy. Most of us can't afford homes because of student loans. And past that, we don't have disposable income that drives the rest of the economy.

Anything else? Do you like living in a world that's not as smart and skilled as it could be? God forbid we invest in the future.

The skills gap is killing job creation. Any take on that? Probably not, right? Do you not see that a lack of skilled workers is hurting our economy? Not your problem, right?

Yet again, @K-Dog shows up with a passive aggressive reaction and no substance.

I remember reading that closing just a fraction of the tax loopholes on the top 1% would actually pay for public education across the country. Imagine that- if the top percenters actually paid their share, we could have nice things.

 

[The Raven]

I remember reading that closing just a fraction of the tax loopholes on the top 1% would actually pay for public education across the country. Imagine that- if the top percenters actually paid their share, we could have nice things.

Yup, and the middle class wouldn't pay a dime for it.

I have no idea how this nation is so fucked up that education is a partisan issue, but here we are. Who the hell wants nice schools and an educated workforce?