lol. Im with you! Im not for the hype neither man till i see something that impresses me! like you said we gotta see him vs some real assignments like what lattimore is doing right now..
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2018 Secondary
- Thread starter JoeyFlex5
- Start date
But he's doing something, nothing special, now after four years. Am I supposed to be impressed?
Ravensnation5220
Ravens Ring of Honor
I know we dont really need corners...but Josh Jackson is amazing...serious ball hawk
i mean would you not argue that jimmy smith is quite clearly a top 10 cb in the league for a few years now - yet not even 1 pro bowl nod...
i mean he has seen real assignments and he's looked great at what he's been asked to do - i dont know what you guys think is going on in NOLA - it's not like lattimore is being left on an island every snap - he's getting safety help too all the time
I'm really wondering, aren't all corners getting help? Aren't there always going to be safeties in the back end?
it's almost like you're either a shutdown corner who shouldnt ever have help (despite us so often playing zone) or you're garbage - like what about literally every corner in the league outside of the top 5 who at least need some help from time to time/ get some schemed their way anyway...
He may not shadow, jimmy doesn’t shadow, Sherman didn’t shadow until the last couple of years, josh Norman doesn’t shadow. Most don’t shadow and that has nothing to do with the players capability. None at all.
He could shut down everyone and when he has that one catch he gives up for a touchdown you will say. See, I told you he was a bad pick.
Pro bowls are nice but they are a popularity contest for the most part anyway.
that was kind of my point lol - like he was saying how i was suggesting he would be a future probowler/all pro and i was like if just being good was good enough to get one of those spots then jimmy would have got in 3-4 years ago
I thought it was sledge saying it until I hit the post button.
Yeah, that 2014 season he would have gotten in if he didn’t have a lisfranc. 2014 he didn’t start feeling like himself until after the first 8 games. Last year he had the screws removed and missed about 5 or 6 games.
His problem has been availability. Not his ability to shut down his side of the field. Sledge will say he doesn’t get interceptions, but that is because he doesn’t have many targets come his way. Yet he doesn’t acknowledge the two touchdowns he has scored this season.
Sledge Hammer
Pro Bowler
No not at all don't be silly. I would like for Humphrey to become shutdown. But I think he has deficiencies. Sherman may not have shadowed but once a receiver was thrown his way to him he shadowed on an island regardless who that WR is. The faster more sudden WRs Jimmy gets help accept toward the sideline. So that the WR only has one place to go to avoid double coverage. Jimmy is great at what he is asked to do. And I do think he should get some pro bowl consideration if not a pro bowler. However jimmy's job isn't as tough and risky as some of his peers. And jimmy plays cautious. His system isn't his fault. However he needs to take chances and play the ball as if he has as much right to it as the receiver. Like the top zone cover cornerbacks. Ravens have a good coverage system. It keeps completions to a minimum. It keeps the cornerbacks in non risk situations but it doesn't produce the big plays.
Carr a career solid player but not spectacular. has looked really good in ravens system cuz there isn't as much stress and risk to get beaten. Jimmy is arguably a top 10 cornerback. But it is in question if he could handle the responsibilities as his peers. He doesn't get the recognition of his peers for a reason. It would be interesting to see him truly shadow the elite WRs. The role coaches give jimmy is kinda boring cuz he is not tested like his peers(top 10 cornerbacks). If Harball and peas were fired jimmy could get his chance to be recognized as a top 5 cornerback. He has the tools.
As for Humphrey of course I would like for him to be shutdown. But can't ignore his deficiencies. One play doesn't mean he has overcome his problems with awareness. And do not forget he wouldn't be a raven if he went to any school besides Alabama. It is like the draft was best player on the board from Alabama that plays defense and doesn't have injury probs and off field drama. He has not done nearly enough to evaluate and project him to one of the best in the league. Every pick in first 3 rounds was a school connection defensive pick besides Bowser.
Then why was it being reported on the day of the draft that most teams had Humphrey as the number 2 CB prospect in the draft. They don't all have Alabama connections. I get buying into the ESPN ratings and being shocked when they don't fall that way, but ESPN is wrong a lot about drafts.
having read all this i dont think you've ever watched richard sherman play in your life - you really telling me that the safeties leave sherman on an island on every play? if anything jimmy is left on an island more than sherman - so often we send safety help to the other side of the field because we trust jimmy that much - and no jimmy isnt risky - he doesnt take risks where he might give up a play because he doesnt need to take risks... because throwing in his direction is risky enough for the qb and hes that good - not sure how he plays cautious either... especially this year
jimmy shadows "elite" receivers the exact same way sherman does except he doesnt get as much safety help so cant take as many gambles - not sure how a system change would change anything - and this idea that sherman now follows receivers is a little weird given that he doesnt really do that anymore - it was literally just for a couple of years when they had garbage at the other corner spot
and on marlon, you're right one play doesnt me he has overcome his problems - but what about all the plays he's stacked together... surely the trend is good and is far more relevant than what he did in college (which was pretty damn good to start with)
and this idea that he wouldnt be a raven if he didnt go to bama is ridiculous - here is a list of the potential BPAs and alternative likely possible picks when we picked: OJ Howard, Jonathan Allen, Reuben Foster, Cam Robinson - notice that they also went to a school called alabama (dont know if you've heard of it...) - not sure how humphrey being a bama player has any bearing on why he was picked given where the other players rated highly on other team's boards came from - like who would you have realistically picked in stead of one of those bama guys at 16 - and tell me how, even in hindsight, they would be a better player on this team than humphrey has been - and im not saying humphrey is the best at his position or even close to that yet but what im saying is that he has shown nothing so far in his pro career that tells me otherwise - and all signs are promising
dude if anything the more you argue the more i go back into the breakdown and stats and film and end up liking marlon even more - like initially this debate made me defend marlon as a decent rookie cb but going back in im finding it hard to say he's not already a top starter level cb in the league
also in terms of school bias wormley did seem like a weird pick for me at the time but tell me that you werent excited about timmy williams in the 3rd round...
in terms of humphrey the bama connection is also ridiculous given that the next guys the cognoscenti thought were on the boards were also all bama - jonathan allen, oj howard, reuben foster for example
Sledge Hammer
Pro Bowler
Who said every play Sherman is on an island?? All I implied is he gets that trust that jimmy doesn't. Keep liking marlon.if he is your dude enjoy it for now. Don't let me or anybody change your mind. I don't like him at least not til he proves a top cornerback. Which he could but I don't believe he will. But I could be wrong. Enjoy your player. Everybody everywhere I went hated the Stanley pick mostly. Co workers, clients, coworkers in different states, friends family. All I do is laugh and gloat.
I know bama was sending a lot of talent to pick from. But A. I have reason to believe it was gonna be defense unless something unrealistic happened like one of the WRs or RB falling. And Humphrey as a cornerback got points for being Bama. I woulda loved Howard or Foster!! Mostly Howard. And if possible trading down and picking up Robinson and a round
2 was probably my favorite move. Again bama I get it. Loaded. Anyways in this order.
HOOKER!!
Howard
Trade up Latts.
Trade back Foster
Barnett
Didn't like Marlon much accept as SS and didn't like Allen at the least. Quite maybe the most overrated player ever!! BTW didn't like the WR Mike Williams. Would take Humphrey over him as much as I would prefer a WR
right so trading up obviously didnt happen once we got to 16 because evidently the teams asked for too much to move up to get those players - so that means lattimore, barnett and hooker literally were all unavailable - which leaves you with trading back for foster or getting howard... or marlon humphrey
foster has been ok but obviously had the off field concerns and also some injury concerns - has to be said a lot of teams had him high (49ers had him as their 3rd best player in the draft behind garrett and solomon thomas) but i guess we had marlon higher (cant be a bama bias given that they both went there) - and OJ hasnt really shown anything in year 1 that suggests he would have been a better pick (or even as good a pick) as humphrey
Sledge Hammer
Pro Bowler
Winston is a moron
And I left out next tohooker Trade back Robinson was my fav draft move