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2018 Secondary

rossihunter2 said:
And healthy lol - and what about you?
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You know, it's a really tough question. I really was a huge fan of Sidney Jones and thought of him as being a worthy pick at 16 long before Humphrey, so for that reason, probably Jones.

The big things with Jones is that he doesn't carry long speed well, despite being a pretty fast athlete, and he's just not big. He's frail and while he has great technique from press, he can get beat up by larger receivers and boxed out.

I think what really made me fall in love was that he is so damn good with his ball skills. He's basically a smaller Marcus Peters and Peters was my number one player to get last year, so maybe that's also why I'm biased.

However, if Humphrey learns to clean up his footwork and can clean up the sloppiness on deep routes, he's got the absolute highest ceiling in the draft class, so I'm not at all disappointed with landing Humphrey.

I think Jones is more pro ready, but if Humphrey hits his ceiling, he'll be the best DB from the class.
 
And why would you have taken Kevin king over a healthy Sidney jones.

Just wondering because you would have been maybe the only person in the world who would've done that. Sidney was a top 20 lock pretty much from mid season all the way til he got injured
 
29BmoreBird22 said:
You know, it's a really tough question. I really was a huge fan of Sidney Jones and thought of him as being a worthy pick at 16 long before Humphrey, so for that reason, probably Jones.

The big things with Jones is that he doesn't carry long speed well, despite being a pretty fast athlete, and he's just not big. He's frail and while he has great technique from press, he can get beat up by larger receivers and boxed out.

I think what really made me fall in love was that he is so damn good with his ball skills. He's basically a smaller Marcus Peters and Peters was my number one player to get last year, so maybe that's also why I'm biased.

However, if Humphrey learns to clean up his footwork and can clean up the sloppiness on deep routes, he's got the absolute highest ceiling in the draft class, so I'm not at all disappointed with landing Humphrey.

I think Jones is more pro ready, but if Humphrey hits his ceiling, he'll be the best DB from the class.
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This is pretty spot on, I also loved how fluid and aware he was, he had a great feel for staying in the receivers pocket without taking his eyes off the qb.

While I'll fully agree Humphrey has a ridiculous ceiling, I think lattimore, if he stays healthy, is probably the best corner prospect I've ever seen. If he's healthy I think his floor is jimmy smith, and his ceiling is Revis in his prime or maybe higher, if that's possible
 
JoeyFlex5 said:
And why would you have taken Kevin king over a healthy Sidney jones.

Just wondering because you would have been maybe the only person in the world who would've done that. Sidney was a top 20 lock pretty much from mid season all the way til he got injured
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Im saying i wouldve taken king over humprhey not jones
 
JoeyFlex5 said:
This is pretty spot on, I also loved how fluid and aware he was, he had a great feel for staying in the receivers pocket without taking his eyes off the qb.

While I'll fully agree Humphrey has a ridiculous ceiling, I think lattimore, if he stays healthy, is probably the best corner prospect I've ever seen. If he's healthy I think his floor is jimmy smith, and his ceiling is Revis in his prime or maybe higher, if that's possible
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Yea i agree. Lattimore is just insane
 
Sledge Hammer said:
Not even close. Nobody ever used it for football b4. Not that I'm aware of. It's used as slang in every facet of science. And can be used as slang for anything. We used it to discuss muscle building and fat loss supplements many times. As well as workout protocols. We disagree quite often. But respect different opinions. We definitely don't get offended when somebody or even everybody disagrees. What works best for one. May not work best for everybody else.

Most of my friends don't talk football all that much or follow the draft. Will watch the first round to see who we got but that's pretty much it. Y u think I talk football here?? When a Matt Judon comes outa nowhere it is a big pleasant surprise for my friends. Like this dude is awesome where did he come from. Cuz outside of the first round and free agents nobody talks about anything else.
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It is used in precisely zero facets of science outside of your friend zone...
 
JoeyFlex5 said:
This is pretty spot on, I also loved how fluid and aware he was, he had a great feel for staying in the receivers pocket without taking his eyes off the qb.

While I'll fully agree Humphrey has a ridiculous ceiling, I think lattimore, if he stays healthy, is probably the best corner prospect I've ever seen. If he's healthy I think his floor is jimmy smith, and his ceiling is Revis in his prime or maybe higher, if that's possible
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With Lattimore, I think he has a pretty low floor. He's an absurdly fluid and good athlete. Like, this is the type of athlete Winchester loves.

But he only plays from press, doesn't have great route recognition, doesn't watch the quarterback or play the ball (he watches the receiver to know when to play the ball), and he's generally inexperienced.

If he reaches his ceiling, he'll be a Patrick Peterson type. Uber athlete that can follow in press man. If he doesn't, he's a year 2 Jimmy who's lack of route recognition hinders him and leaves you desiring more because you know he can do more.
 
29BmoreBird22 said:
With Lattimore, I think he has a pretty low floor. He's an absurdly fluid and good athlete. Like, this is the type of athlete Winchester loves.

But he only plays from press, doesn't have great route recognition, doesn't watch the quarterback or play the ball (he watches the receiver to know when to play the ball), and he's generally inexperienced.

If he reaches his ceiling, he'll be a Patrick Peterson type. Uber athlete that can follow in press man. If he doesn't, he's a year 2 Jimmy who's lack of route recognition hinders him and leaves you desiring more because you know he can do more.
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I just feel his man coverage is so incredibly good that none of that matters. Let him jam and mirror and he should be blanking receivers simply doing that. He might be the only corner I've ever seen that somehow doesn't need route anticipation because he mirrors step for step what the receiver does and alters his mans direction with the most subtle of actions. He's just always there. And he doesn't keep his eye on the qb that's for sure but he doesn't seem to lack ball awareness either.

Then again, you are hands down the most knowledgeable secondary person I've ever talked to, so maybe you see things that I can't lol
 
29BmoreBird22 said:
With Lattimore, I think he has a pretty low floor. He's an absurdly fluid and good athlete. Like, this is the type of athlete Winchester loves.

But he only plays from press, doesn't have great route recognition, doesn't watch the quarterback or play the ball (he watches the receiver to know when to play the ball), and he's generally inexperienced.

If he reaches his ceiling, he'll be a Patrick Peterson type. Uber athlete that can follow in press man. If he doesn't, he's a year 2 Jimmy who's lack of route recognition hinders him and leaves you desiring more because you know he can do more.
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Year 2 Jimmy is a really good comp, imo.

Bc while the size/athleticism combo is there to be much better, the lack of route recognition and watching the receiver as opposed to being in position to see both the WR and QB will leave him susceptible to getting smoked by double moves.... like Jimmy used to. His raw ability will allow him to look very good in certain situations, a la Jimmy in the SB goal line stand; but until that stuff gets cleaned up hes not a guy you can count on to lock down a good WR or a side of the field. More just a situation, matchup guy.

We'll find out too, bc hes going to start day 1.
 
JoeyFlex5 said:
I just feel his man coverage is so incredibly good that none of that matters. Let him jam and mirror and he should be blanking receivers simply doing that. He might be the only corner I've ever seen that somehow doesn't need route anticipation because he mirrors step for step what the receiver does and alters his mans direction with the most subtle of actions. He's just always there. And he doesn't keep his eye on the qb that's for sure but he doesn't seem to lack ball awareness either.

Then again, you are hands down the most knowledgeable secondary person I've ever talked to, so maybe you see things that I can't lol
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Well, think of it this way-

He's in the same division as Kelvin Benjamin, Julio Jones, and Mike Evans. Do I want him in press all day long right out of the gate? I do not. Evans and Benjamin are big enough to shrug off the press and Julio is... don't even try.

So, he needs to be adept at off man to a degree which means learning some route combinations and recognition. He's got the fluidity, burst, and change of direction to make a play on any route, so this just comes down to repeated reps and studying of film.

As far as not watching the quarterback, it works with less savvy receivers because they'll let their head show where the ball is or put their arms up well before the ball is incoming and that lets Lattimore know tp watch for the ball. Someone like Julio will never tip his hand early.

I think Lattimore should be able to play effectively in off or press man and he shows reliable ball skills if he learns to watch the quarterback.

The reason I like Peterson as a comp is just the level of athleticism and mirror ability in press they share. Peterson is a much better play maker and Lattimore is closer to the size of Revis, but I don't want to compare anyone to one of the greatest shutdown corners ever. That's unfair.

I wouldn't be shocked, though, to see an early struggle like Peterson or Revis and them really turn it on.
 
Deebo813 said:
Im fine with that. ive seen humphrey play and in no way is he impressive to me. Hope hew proves me wrong though
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I'm not doubting that you've seen him play, but I question if you know what you're looking at. I also get the feeling that you would trash anyone we drafted at 16
 
JoeyFlex5 said:
I'm not doubting that you've seen him play, but I question if you know what you're looking at. I also get the feeling that you would trash anyone we drafted at 16
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Lol naw. Im just salty that we took humprey, but at the same time i know our staff does some good shit at developing cbs so hopefully he becomes a stud unlike every other cb to come out of bama.
 
I wish we could've at least seen Tavon for 3 games before he went down. Him back in the slot with an upgraded secondary and pass rush would have had him looking like an all pro.
 
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