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Richard Sherman

29BmoreBird22

Staff Member
Moderator
Writer
Common sense. Both were considered early draft picks. Some I'm sure rated Humph higher while some rated Lamp higher. But let me guess you once again think management made the best choice in keeping the pick that yielded Humph than taking the multiple picks?
So wait- you make this assertion that many GM's preferred Lamp to Humphrey (a claim that you can easily backup with a quote or two), but then say it's common sense, even though Lamp went 22 picks later, was the fourth lineman taken, and went behind several DB's.

Makes sense.

And considering I had mocked Humphrey to the Ravens and talked him up as the Ravens pick since February, yes, I liked the pick and the move to stay put.
 

Sledge Hammer

Pro Bowler
Common sense. Both were considered early draft picks. Some I'm sure rated Humph higher while some rated Lamp higher. But let me guess you once again think management made the best choice in keeping the pick that yielded Humph than taking the multiple picks? I guess we will have to bookmark this thread and track their play. Then to consider we coulda got 2 more picks on top of Lamp and that is runaway a better haul of talent for the team than Humph alone
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So wait- you make this assertion that many GM's preferred Lamp to Humphrey (a claim that you can easily backup with a quote or two), but then say it's common sense, even though Lamp went 22 picks later, was the fourth lineman taken, and went behind several DB's.

Makes sense.

And considering I had mocked Humphrey to the Ravens and talked him up as the Ravens pick since February, yes, I liked the pick and the move to stay put.

Do you know for sure that A team woulda taken Humph in round 1 if ravens didn't?? And I actually preferred Robinson but peeps around here like Lamp. So all that means is when Humph gets roasted in coverage I get to point that out this season when Lamp and Cam flourish. So the play will decide how your mock woulda played out ;)
 

29BmoreBird22

Staff Member
Moderator
Writer
[doublepost=1495930245,1495930078][/doublepost]

Do you know for sure that A team woulda taken Humph in round 1 if ravens didn't?? And I actually preferred Robinson but peeps around here like Lamp. So all that means is when Humph gets roasted in coverage I get to point that out this season when Lamp and Cam flourish. So the play will decide how your mock woulda played out ;)
Considering that 6 DBs went ahead of Lamp, I can confidently say that he was going before Lamp and confidently say a team like Seattle takes him.

Sure, you can point it out, but let's remember this is a three year deal for every pick.
 

Sledge Hammer

Pro Bowler
Considering that 6 DBs went ahead of Lamp, I can confidently say that he was going before Lamp and confidently say a team like Seattle takes him.

Sure, you can point it out, but let's remember this is a three year deal for every pick.

Sometimes it takes that long but often u can see when a player has it or Doesn't. So you have your excuse prepared that he needs 2 more years to make a judgement? Cuz my call is his issues won't get much better in the NFL. And he will end up at SS.
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Sometimes it takes that long but often u can see when a player has it or Doesn't. So you have your excuse prepared that he needs 2 more years to make a judgement? Cuz my call is his issues won't get much better in the NFL. And he will end up at SS. And I say excuse cuz he is your guy and you should have confidence in him. Even if he is a bust be proud of your judgement. I liked Marqise Lee and was proud of my call on him even when he fell behind 2 talented WRs. When many of my friends family and mates around here strongly disagreed. And I like him to finish his breakout this yr.

On side note my system for evaluation of cornerbacks and FS is a little different. Good so far however. I called Darby to be top 2 cornerback from his class. And Reshard Robinson to be the best last year in his class as well as eventually a borderline allpro.
 
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29BmoreBird22

Staff Member
Moderator
Writer
Sometimes it takes that long but often u can see when a player has it or Doesn't. So you have your excuse prepared that he needs 2 more years to make a judgement? Cuz my call is his issues won't get much better in the NFL. And he will end up at SS.
Any quality talent evaluator will give three years to judge a draft class, but I am talking to you.
 

Sledge Hammer

Pro Bowler
Any quality talent evaluator will give three years to judge a draft class, but I am talking to you.
Yeah an entire class takes couple yrs.. But when a single player shows nothing for 2 years and everybody says he is trash. You will be the blind one that maintains you think he will show something year 3?? Some players show enough to go any way. Like Jernigan coulda went good or bust. But some players show nothing and are clearly busts or great after one year. Every viable talent evaluator knows every player is different.you can't say it takes 3 yrs to evaluate every player
 

29BmoreBird22

Staff Member
Moderator
Writer
Yeah an entire class takes couple yrs.. But when a single player shows nothing for 2 years and everybody says he is trash. You will be the blind one that maintains you think he will show something year 3?? Some players show enough to go any way. Like Jernigan coulda went good or bust. But some players show nothing and are clearly busts or great after one year. Every viable talent evaluator knows every player is different.you can't say it takes 3 yrs to evaluate every player
If it didn't take three years, Jimmy Smith wouldn't be a Raven. Darelle Revis wouldn't be the best corner of this decade. Chris Harris Jr. wouldn't be the best slot corner in the NFL. Xavier Rhodes wouldn't be considered one of the young elite corners in this league. Trumaine Johnson wouldn't be next year's top DB available. AJ Bouye would still be a fourth stringer.

Do you kinda see where this is going?
 

The Raven

Veteran
If it didn't take three years, Jimmy Smith wouldn't be a Raven. Darelle Revis wouldn't be the best corner of this decade. Chris Harris Jr. wouldn't be the best slot corner in the NFL. Xavier Rhodes wouldn't be considered one of the young elite corners in this league. Trumaine Johnson wouldn't be next year's top DB available. AJ Bouye would still be a fourth stringer.

Do you kinda see where this is going?
Corner is one in a small handful of positions that definitely requires three years to see some return on the investment. Almost always. Struggling to think of any real outliers.
 

29BmoreBird22

Staff Member
Moderator
Writer
Corner is one in a small handful of positions that definitely requires three years to see some return on the investment. Almost always. Struggling to think of any real outliers.
Only three in recent memory I can think of are Jalen Ramsey at the end of the season, Desmond Trufant, and Tyrann Mathieu, who has fallen off hard.
 

The Raven

Veteran
Only three in recent memory I can think of are Jalen Ramsey at the end of the season, Desmond Trufant, and Tyrann Mathieu, who has fallen off hard.
Webb kinda showed up before year three if memory serves, but he didn't really come into this own until 2011. He was looking hella good as a rookie in 09 until the first ACL.
 

29BmoreBird22

Staff Member
Moderator
Writer
Webb kinda showed up before year three if memory serves, but he didn't really come into this own until 2011. He was looking hella good as a rookie in 09 until the first ACL.
It's not unheard of, but it's rare. For every Webb or Trufant, you get 10 Jimmy Smith's.

Webb was one that was showing up really well early on.
 

The Raven

Veteran
It's not unheard of, but it's rare. For every Webb or Trufant, you get 10 Jimmy Smith's.

Webb was one that was showing up really well early on.
which makes no sense considering he came from a school nobody heard of. That really underscores how much of a crap shoot player development can be. Some guys are just special and have it.
 

wrongbaldy

Practice Squad
Corner is one in a small handful of positions that definitely requires three years to see some return on the investment. Almost always. Struggling to think of any real outliers.
peters
[doublepost=1495940762,1495940598][/doublepost]not selecting a wr before 6th round in 2014 will hunt this team for long time
 

jdynamite

Ravens Ring of Honor
Billick actually did a good job keeping those teams on same page for most part. I mean in all seriousness the defense shoulda carried the team. That is where all the money and most of high picks were invested. Outside of Jamal Lewis only time an offensive player was picked or compensated with a big contract is when the their back was to the wall. Which usually resulted in a reach.

Management would take best wr available as opposed to putting resources into obtaining somebody legit. We shoulda traded up for plaxico in 2000. As opposed to wasting a first rounder on whatever trash(Travis Taylor) is available. Shoulda traded up for plaxico or went bpa or traded down. Same song different dance with Perriman. No speed at WR and took best wr left on board as opposed trading up for Amari Cooper and taking a wr in the loaded 2014 class. No, management waited until there wasn't really a choice and WR was a major need with no speed at the position once Torrey signed elsewhere.

During that Draft Process Travis Taylor was rated highly, he ended up not panning out but he joins a long list of 1st Round WRs that either were busts or didn't live up to their draft status:
If you take a look at the WR classes for several years it will give you snapshot of all the failures or guys that might have had one or two years of success.
In 2000 Warrick, Burress, Taylor, S.Morris, & RJ Soward all were first rounders only Burress had a decent career nothing spectacular hell L.Coles had similar numbers from the same draft.
2001- D.Terrell, R.Gardner, K.Robinson, S.Moss, F.Mitchell, & R.Wayne all 1st rounders Wayne HOF career, Moss a solid career other 4 garbage.
That trend continues for many more drafts.

I mean for them to move from 10th ( where Travis Taylor was picked ) to 7th the pick before Steelers nabbed Burress, the team would have to trade the 10th and 3rd rounder or 10th + 4th+5th rounders ( from looking at Draft Trade Chart ).

Unless you wanted them to pick Burress at number 5 and bypass Jamal Lewis, not much else they could have did. And again it's not like Plaxico Burress was Andre Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald caliber.
For what it's worth Taylor and Burress had identical rookie years but then Burress continued his progression while Taylor didn't.

Looking back at the WRs in those drafts, I remember being so mad the Bengals got Peter Warrick because I thought he was going to be star.
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Only three in recent memory I can think of are Jalen Ramsey at the end of the season, Desmond Trufant, and Tyrann Mathieu, who has fallen off hard.

Kyle Fuller had a solid rookie year but he's been pretty much been injured since then so he's honorable mention for quick start.

Ronald Darby played extremely well in Buffalo his first 2 years. He doesn't get a bunch of ints but good coverage and tackling.

Xavier Rhodes also has been very good at the start of his career.

Marcus Peters is a lot like J.Jenkins he makes a lot of ints, but sometimes his gambles lead to TDs but both paid early dividends at corner lol.

Tavon Young played similar to young Webb last year, undersized, good tackling thrown in to start a few a games outside. Wasn't perfect but was damn dependable I'd say.
 

29BmoreBird22

Staff Member
Moderator
Writer
@jdynamite I knew I was forgetting Ronald Darby. I remember Matt Miller talked to several scouts on numerous occasions that said Darby should go top 10 because teams just flat out avoided him. He was stellar in his rookie year.

Of rookie corners (or corners within the first three years) that came out and flat out excelled from day one, we have Darby and Trufant, really.

There are really so few corners that can come in and actually just play well from day one.

With guys like Ramsey and Peters, they got better as the season wore on, but then we have guys like Rhodes, Jimmy, Webb, Revis that took a few years to really crack into that upper echelon of the elite guys.
[doublepost=1495999362,1495999137][/doublepost]
https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-5-players-who-shouldnt-have-made-the-pro-bowl/

Then there's also this from PFF.
[doublepost=1495999477][/doublepost]Even so, I still wanted Marcus Peters more than anyone in 2015.
 

Willbacker

Ravens Ring of Honor
@jdynamite I knew I was forgetting Ronald Darby. I remember Matt Miller talked to several scouts on numerous occasions that said Darby should go top 10 because teams just flat out avoided him. He was stellar in his rookie year.

Of rookie corners (or corners within the first three years) that came out and flat out excelled from day one, we have Darby and Trufant, really.

There are really so few corners that can come in and actually just play well from day one.

With guys like Ramsey and Peters, they got better as the season wore on, but then we have guys like Rhodes, Jimmy, Webb, Revis that took a few years to really crack into that upper echelon of the elite guys.

.
[doublepost=1495999477][/doublepost]Even so, I still wanted Marcus Peters more than anyone in 2015.

No doubt corner is the hardest position besides QB imo to transfer to coming from college to the pros. Humphrey will be eased in gradually and hopefully play well enough to earn more playing time. Good call also on your last mock.
 
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