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Joe Flacco
- Thread starter ThatsMyJoeTerback
- Start date
I mean, these are multi-million dollar athletes with the best orthopedic doctors in the world. They aren't being put out in absurdly clunky braces that aren't fit for the player. I'm sure these are incredibly expensive, fit for the body, and give minimal issues with movement.
I CAN believe it stops him from running because it generally gets caught when he slides, but as far as throwing? No, I don't buy this affecting him.
Tank
Hall of Famer
Not taking the bait. Carry on and enjoy! lol
K-Dog
MVP
Okay the " Flacco is the best player on our offence. " line.
It's coach speak. I get it. He doesn't really believe that. Yes I am sure of it.
That said, I am not sure he is all that far off. Think about it.
CURRENT ROSTER [/i] Collins, Stanley, Jensen. Sure. Perriman? Hell no. Wallace ? *shrugs* I don't know...
I mean saying Joe is "the best we have on offence" really isnt saying much. Our offence as a whole, pretty much sucks.
It's coach speak. I get it. He doesn't really believe that. Yes I am sure of it.
That said, I am not sure he is all that far off. Think about it.
CURRENT ROSTER [/i] Collins, Stanley, Jensen. Sure. Perriman? Hell no. Wallace ? *shrugs* I don't know...
I mean saying Joe is "the best we have on offence" really isnt saying much. Our offence as a whole, pretty much sucks.
Just trying to remind you to stay cool because in every instance, it was someone making a level headed comment that you blew up to.
I don’t know - if it was medically required I’d agree but the fact that he doesn’t need one and had to be persuaded to get a smaller one last offseason just to make him change it a little bit suggests to me that maybe it does affect him at least a little bit - I’m not saying it is affecting him but I am suggesting that it’s not out of the bounds of realism or possibility
I don't know... He really may knowing Harbaugh... this is the same guy that rode Cameron for five years.
allblackraven
Hall of Famer
Yeah, he can go on and on talking how it doesn't bother him but it has clearly affected him. It messes up his feet placement and if you're not confident you have the posture right, all you can do is to try and compensate with the arm (subconsciously even), which seldom works because the arms, and this is not the case with QBs only - ask any other athlete who uses arms, have mind of their own.
Okay, let's say it does affect him a little bit. That still does not explain this drastic of a regression. I mean, really- go the Dick's or somewhere and buy a brace and throw with it on. Plenty of quarterbacks have done it and done just fine. It won't affect you. Now, consider that the quality of brace that Joe has is going to be exponentially better than any you could ever buy and it starts to just become a myth to me.
It feels like Flacco fans are reaching for every excuse under the sun instead of accepting that Flacco may be done and may have seen his best days already.
Like I keep saying, I am forever grateful to Joe for five straight years of playoffs and six in seven years. Shoot, we may make the playoffs this year. I have no shame in saying that he was the best quarterback Baltimore ever had and bringing a Super Bowl to the Charm City will always be a special memory for me.
But you can't hold on because of past production.
K-Dog
MVP
In his defense Cam was great for 2-3 of those five years. Plus as I have said 2,345,783 times. We don't know what takes place behind closed doors.
Harbs is a lot of things. I don't think a blind idiot is one of them.
I think Harbaugh can genuinely believe it and puts a lot more faith in the potential than other coaches would, if that makes sense.
allblackraven
Hall of Famer
I know. He truly believes it. Harbaugh is out of his mind.
Harbaugh is in the same boat as Joe for me. I am forever grateful for his presence here in Baltimore and he did so much for the team. He turned this franchise around from what could have very well been the beginning of a Cleveland-esque era.
But much like Cameron- he got it on the right track and really put Baltimore in a prime position, but now that the going is tough (with the cap), he's just not the right man for the job anymore, in my opinion.
My way of thinking is that we need a support network for our “future” qb anyway and we are stuck with flacco for at least 1 and likely 2 more years whatever happens so there’s no point assuming hopelessness in terms of flacco because it doesn’t really affect the team building process unless a bpa 1st round qb falls into your lap
This is not me saying flacco will make the most of any new weapons but worst comes to the worst we end up looking like the jags of this year next year and we go get a qb next year who can come in with wrs and an oline to support them and a defence who will give them the ball back with better field position
And while the evidence for flacco’s regression being unreversable is mounting there are still throws he makes that give me pause and things behind the scenes that give me a little bit of hope that it’s not all on him too
Of course flacco could have just started declining already but given that we are stuck with him I do look for indicators that this might not be the case
That being said I’m a realist and am not gonna reject the evidence which so far is pretty damning on most counts
Tank
Hall of Famer
Right. Flacco has played poorly, no doubt. What is silly is to think anyone could be doing much of anything with this group the way they have been performing. If you listen to all of the interview there is a subtle reference to “the situation with the offense”. Drawing finite conclusions about the QB using the performance of the squad the way it sits now is just plain dumb.
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In my opinion, the offensive line is already there. I think the Ravens have actually done really well to build up a solid young core and even if you have to rotate in a vet here or there for the next few years, this line is good.
The weapons? I think they're decent. I'd want another receiver because I think Maclin and Wallace are better off as two's (although, I doubt Wallace re-signs here) and I think that Boyle and Williams are really solid options if the Ravens can find a field stretcher at tight end. Can't really be upset with how well Collins has done and Woodhead is an amazing safety valve for any quarterback, new or old.
I think the core is really coming together and with the upcoming draft, I think the Ravens have every opportunity to really push the offensive pieces over the top.
Oldfaithful
Hall of Famer
Okay, so there's not a lot of examples but I can give you a notable one.
How about Kurt Warner?
Yeah. His situation was a little different. Hell of a lot better in his prime, but he did have a significant fall from grace that was arguably worse that this. Sure, injuries played a part in it, but still. He struggles starting in 2002. Gets hurt. 2003 has a horrid game to start the season. Bulger replaces him and does a great job. Kurt Warner gets released with three years left on his deal, goes to the New York Giants on a cheap contract. Is TERRIBLE for them after starting out strong, to get benched for Eli Manning. Opts out of deal becoming a free agent again, not a hot commodity(a massive fall from grace alone from a former NFL MVP/ Super Bowl MVP) on the open market. Signs on to Arizona. Initially starts out decently, but is then benched for Matt Leonard on an on and off basis until Wisenhunt realizes that Leonard sucks and then Warner FINALLY returns to star QB form in 2008 and then 2009.
Yeah, he was better than Flacco is his prime, but also had a significant fall from grace. He went from being a 2 time NFL MVP and a super bowl MVP to a guy who was benched repeatedly throughout several seasons(sure, the first time was due to injury, but the other times he was healthy and just started slumping) for poor/inconsistent play. That's a bigger fall from grace than what Flacco is going through now which is a significant regression.
Again, we need to prepare for the future, and while Kurt Warner is an outlier example it does show there's a possibility for a turnaround. He does still flash traits that show he could be good. I'm admittantly a Flacco fan, but I'm not denying he's a massive part of the problem. I'm simply stating that I don't think he's the main or sole reason we suck right now on offense. A significant reason? Yes. But this offense is a clusterfuck. Outside of Rodgers, Brady, Brees, and a few others, I don't see too many QBs who would totally thrive here with how bad some of our investments have been/luck with injuries has been.
Flacco may beyond his best days and a turnaround may be unlikely if downright impossible, but we might be able to salvage that contract of his with better drafting and a better overall situation.
Again, unless it's Rosen I don't want a QB early. They'd get killed here. We're stuck with the contract, we'd be foolish if we just sat on our hands and didn't try to maximize it. On the off chance that he can return to at least being a decent QB(and honestly, there's nowhere to go but up), if we have a good skeleton here we could be a super bowl team that's more run first if anything.
I rest my case. I disagree with parts of what others are saying on other mediums besides the forum(he's not entirely responsible. Literally everyone involved holds some share of the blame imho), but he's undoubtedly part of the problem.
allblackraven
Hall of Famer
But it's not this season only. He wasn't much better last year either - same kind of play only more short passes made because he had Pitta.
I don't count Steve Smith, I can throw to him.
I mean I thought the oline was there but it really doesn’t hold up against quality opponents often - they’ve played well at times and at others have been porous - the line has/had lots of potential but injuries have nullified its ceiling to a large extent so while its a positive thing for the future, right now I wouldn’t say that the oline is a harmonious element of this offence at all
And I think the points you made about weapons are actually pretty crucial - we’ve got decent parts but they don’t work together well - our receivers don’t complement each other nor do our tight ends - there’s a lot of similarity in skill sets in all cases and none of them have dominant characteristics whereby they can take a game away from the defence - Collins and woodhead are the exception in the sense that they both offer strong acumen with different but complementary skill sets
And I 100% agree that this offence is not as far away from marked improvement as its plight suggests but that doesn’t mean that the pieces in place now are supportive elements for flacco or a qb coming in - while only 2/3 players coming in might change this offence drastically we are still missing those 2/3 crucial additional elements
The offensive line is giving up a pressure like 25% of the time and ranks in the top 10 according to Football Outsiders. They gave Flacco a clean pocket on 30 of 36 drop backs. Can't really complain with that. Shoot, we all saw how well Stanley locked up Clowney when Stanley came back in after the injury scare. This offensive line is much better than they're given credit for.
Maclin being similar to Wallace was a big reason that I wanted Decker instead and I think that the Ravens will likely look to avoid a Deion Cain type receiver in the draft, but I think Courtland Sutton will absolutely be in play for the Ravens.