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Welcome to Baltimore: RB JK Dobbins (55)

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
but yeah, Taylor just pops out more out of all the RB's. True explosion.

I think dobbins has the best vision though.

taylor just has zero experience in the passing game - no pass pro, no receiving nothing... which means right now he's not viable on the most important down in football but that's not to say he can't get good at that and nyheim hines is ok enough on 3rd down for now but that's the only thing that stopped taylor from being thought of amongst the very best RBs to come out in recent classes
 

JoeyFlex5

Hall of Famer
but yeah, Taylor just pops out more out of all the RB's. True explosion.

I think dobbins has the best vision though.
Taylor is an incredible RB straight up, if he fell to 55 we probably take him over dobbins for the same bpa reasons, but dobbins isn’t worth any kind of worry just because he doesn’t have the same long speed as Taylor. He’s also a proven receiver and deeply established in the read option game
 

Sami84

Ravens Ring of Honor
Taylor is an incredible RB straight up, if he fell to 55 we probably take him over dobbins for the same bpa reasons, but dobbins isn’t worth any kind of worry just because he doesn’t have the same long speed as Taylor. He’s also a proven receiver and deeply established in the read option game

Oh I agree, Dobbins is going to be a solid running back. His vision is the best in the class and that always give you a high floor
 

Sami84

Ravens Ring of Honor
you also have to wonder if the reason for JK dobbins sophmore slump was because he didn't have a dual threat QB that year while in 2017 and 2019 he did.

Ideally, you want a running back who puts up numbers when there isn't a threat of a dual QB. Look, he'll do great here but I actually liked kenneth dixon far more as a prospect and I'll still maintain that if he wasn't injured/suspended all the time he'd have been an All Pro.

Dobbins really can't fair here but how many running backs would objectively fail? that's where you question the pick. If you get a running back that is basically a wrecking crew on his own ( ie no dual threat QB back) that's a different story
 

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
you also have to wonder if the reason for JK dobbins sophmore slump was because he didn't have a dual threat QB that year while in 2017 and 2019 he did.

Ideally, you want a running back who puts up numbers when there isn't a threat of a dual QB. Look, he'll do great here but I actually liked kenneth dixon far more as a prospect and I'll still maintain that if he wasn't injured/suspended all the time he'd have been an All Pro.

Dobbins really can't fair here but how many running backs would objectively fail? that's where you question the pick. If you get a running back that is basically a wrecking crew on his own ( ie no dual threat QB back) that's a different story

what all of his coaches (and even he himself) has attributed that down year to sharing the load and it creating a different mindset - the mindset of i have to make every play into a big play which counterintuitively meant he wasnt reading and reacting and making good decisions despite the fact he'd been good in a shared backfield the year before...

i tend to think that's a pretty reasonable answer
 
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Sami84

Ravens Ring of Honor
He's going to be great for us...
I hope harbs has the guts to choose the best 3 for the interior line rather than just go with experience
remember, orlando brown only got his start when hurst was injured for a number of weeks.
 

RavensMania

Staff Member
Administrator
He's going to be great for us...
I hope harbs has the guts to choose the best 3 for the interior line rather than just go with experience
remember, orlando brown only got his start when hurst was injured for a number of weeks.
I hated Harbs using Hurst at RT, but there were rumors that Brown didn't wasn't comfortable with our playbook by the time the season began. Not sure if they were true, but the rumors were out there. Joe D definitely has say in this as well.
 

JoeyFlex5

Hall of Famer
I hated Harbs using Hurst at RT, but there were rumors that Brown didn't wasn't comfortable with our playbook by the time the season began. Not sure if they were true, but the rumors were out there. Joe D definitely has say in this as well.
I knew hurst was gonna be the starter, I argued with quite a few here who thought there was no way he would get it over Zeus jr, but I just knew it lol, it was so typical harbs. Something he’s gotta rid himself of completely, because we can’t afford to be wasting talent the way we wasted a guy like Zeus for the first half of the year
 

allblackraven

Hall of Famer
I hated Harbs using Hurst at RT, but there were rumors that Brown didn't wasn't comfortable with our playbook by the time the season began. Not sure if they were true, but the rumors were out there. Joe D definitely has say in this as well.
What is playbook knowledge good for if you can't make the plays?
 

RavensMania

Staff Member
Administrator
What is playbook knowledge good for if you can't make the plays?
agree. I didn't say it was right, just what the rumor was at the time. That being said, as I recall, I do remember Hurst doing well in the early part of the season against some pretty darn good pass rushers.
 

Sami84

Ravens Ring of Honor
agree. I didn't say it was right, just what the rumor was at the time. That being said, as I recall, I do remember Hurst doing well in the early part of the season against some pretty darn good pass rushers.

Sometimes you gotta be brave and put the player with the higher ceiling in. on the job training ( actual game time) is the only way a player gets better even if he's not as well versed in a playbook as the lesser player
 

Edgar

Ravens Ring of Honor
Ive been watching more Dobbins of late.
I am a half full kind of guy generally and a 3/4 full guy when it comes to The ravens. But, I'll say what I'm seeing.

His two best attributes to me are outside zone runs and pass protection. pass protection might not be a top priority for some but Id say he is well ahead of any other rookie back and ready to go. I am quite impressed by him in this department. He is also an effective lead blocker for QB keeps.

Good decision making on stretch runs.. makes up his mind, foot in ground and hits it. Between the tackles he is patient but you better have zero penetration. I don't think he is special in his make you miss or his ability to break tackles at all. I don't think he is particularly creative and at times he does not read the second level LB angles well.

He reminds me of a two progression read QB in some sense. 1) designed hole
if thats not there he will take the next crease and hit it. In other words he will take whats there which is mostly a good thing. he tends to gain what is there. Most of his big runs between the tackles are by virtue of a giant hole.

Goes down on first contact often.

He's good. he'll be productive. He is a double. I think a lot rides on him as a second round pick given who we might have taken. We were able to get him but we gave up hurst to do it. That second round still bothers me in all honesty. If Dobbins production two years down the road is comparable to say, Lamichael Perine (4th round) then I'll be bothered by the pick for certain.
 

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
Ive been watching more Dobbins of late.
I am a half full kind of guy generally and a 3/4 full guy when it comes to The ravens. But, I'll say what I'm seeing.

His two best attributes to me are outside zone runs and pass protection. pass protection might not be a top priority for some but Id say he is well ahead of any other rookie back and ready to go. I am quite impressed by him in this department. He is also an effective lead blocker for QB keeps.

Good decision making on stretch runs.. makes up his mind, foot in ground and hits it. Between the tackles he is patient but you better have zero penetration. I don't think he is special in his make you miss or his ability to break tackles at all. I don't think he is particularly creative and at times he does not read the second level LB angles well.

He reminds me of a two progression read QB in some sense. 1) designed hole
if thats not there he will take the next crease and hit it. In other words he will take whats there which is mostly a good thing. he tends to gain what is there. Most of his big runs between the tackles are by virtue of a giant hole.

Goes down on first contact often.

He's good. he'll be productive. He is a double. I think a lot rides on him as a second round pick given who we might have taken. We were able to get him but we gave up hurst to do it. That second round still bothers me in all honesty. If Dobbins production two years down the road is comparable to say, Lamichael Perine (4th round) then I'll be bothered by the pick for certain.

there are a lot of things dobbins does well but im most impressed by his ability to read blocks and be patient and when he gets into the secondary he's so good at setting up DBs to turn 20 yds into 50 - in this offence with lamar drawing so much attention that'll be a major positive impact

he's not consistently great at making penetration miss but i saw evidence of him turning TFLs into gains - not miraculous type plays in the backfield that edwards-helaire might make but showed an adequate ability to make people miss when they should have him dead to rights

one of my bigger concerns is the fact that the majority of his major splash plays come on those stretch zones where he's often getting outside the tackles and then downhill fast - that's not a major part of the ravens running scheme so far

i think a lot of your concerns are valid but i think he's shown enough good examples of things he hasnt done consistently that they wont hold him back - e.g. ive seen enough flashy plays where he's kept his balance through contact to break tackles etc. that the fact it's not a marquee element of his game doesnt worry me majorly

im excited about the possibilities of jk dobbins - especially when he's in space - i love how he reads blocks
 

Edgar

Ravens Ring of Honor
there are a lot of things dobbins does well but im most impressed by his ability to read blocks and be patient and when he gets into the secondary he's so good at setting up DBs to turn 20 yds into 50 - in this offence with lamar drawing so much attention that'll be a major positive impact

he's not consistently great at making penetration miss but i saw evidence of him turning TFLs into gains - not miraculous type plays in the backfield that edwards-helaire might make but showed an adequate ability to make people miss when they should have him dead to rights

one of my bigger concerns is the fact that the majority of his major splash plays come on those stretch zones where he's often getting outside the tackles and then downhill fast - that's not a major part of the ravens running scheme so far

i think a lot of your concerns are valid but i think he's shown enough good examples of things he hasnt done consistently that they wont hold him back - e.g. ive seen enough flashy plays where he's kept his balance through contact to break tackles etc. that the fact it's not a marquee element of his game doesnt worry me majorly

im excited about the possibilities of jk dobbins - especially when he's in space - i love how he reads blocks
I think we will see more wide zone and more screens to accentuate what he does best. Id probably say the same for Hill. I don't have the numbers but Id say we did our share of OZ particularly with Ends at 4i or against any kind of solid front .

I am a little concerned that he lacks that sort of play making electricity and burst...that ability to make something out of nothing considering where we took him.
 

JoeyFlex5

Hall of Famer
i need an explanation of how dobbins developed the reputation of a slow and steady type who just did a good job following great blockers...

his film shows that hes nothing shy of a spectacular athlete and extremely talented and skilled runner. his explosiveness and decisiveness and ability to make defenders look stupid in so many situations are things he has in spades. i just dont get it with this reputation of his lol. he has SO MANY plays where its him vs multiple DBs with angles as hes turning the corner on an outside zone, and he absolutely destroys their angles within 3 steps, sure they may catch up down the sideline later on, but he takes a lot of 10 yard runs and turns them into 20-30s because hes breaking angles so badly. and some of his open field jukes look pretty standard but the results are spectacular and thats because the actual jukes themselves are super efficient and effective and they are timed perfectly. he has quite a few stiff arms that make touchdowns out of what would be tackles inside the 10. he has a few goal line collisions where he just absolutely bowls dudes over around the 1-2 and punches it in in impressive fashion. hes one spectacular play after another on film, for real, and thats in 2/3 facets because hes also about as good in pass pro as youll see from a prospect, hes not the most sure handed and he needs work as a route runner but hes definitely got the tools to become every bit as good a receiver as ray rice was.

i really cant understand how he tends to be spoken of as everything but a "playmaker" of a rb. ill admit i wasnt that big on dobbins but i also didnt watch much of him at all, i was too enamored with taylor and CEH and zack moss and just wasnt watching him, but drafting him forced me to watch him and basically everything i thought about him wasnt true, i think hes going to be an elite back from the day he steps on the field, like im kinda expecting a 1000 yard season from him but only assuming the covid situation doesnt just crush him as a rookie. if we can put an asterisk on year 1 and look right ahead to year 2 for dobbins, i think were talking about a pro bowl back, i really think that highly of him. hes going to dominate a lot of defenders with his acceleration, change of direction, and just overall explosiveness. i think hes going to end up a SPECIAL player for us.
 
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