The Running Game, The Lamar and The Ronnie

[rmcjacket23]

Brandon Marshall said this morning that teams haven’t figured Lamar out — they’ve figured Roman out, and I like this comment from a Ravens fan on Reddit:


“I’m 1000% on board with moving on from Roman after this season and turning this into a more traditional offense that occasionally calls old Roman running plays but mostly uses Lamar’s legs to extend plays and scramble.

If Lamar can’t succeed and grow his passing game under the tutelage of a different offensive coordinator who draws up a good passing scheme next year, then perhaps we start asking ourselves hard questions.”

Probably a combination of both.

I think they've figured out, largely, how to greatly reduce Lamar's impact with his legs, and I think they've realized that we're not as great of a run blocking unit as we used to be, so it's no longer necessarily a "pick your poison" approach (though it was yesterday).

Defenses are doing what everybody said they should... force Lamar to throw, and takeaway his first read. Its the evolution of a passer. It happens to every OC and every good who ever called plays. Teams learn your tendencies and evaluate the QB, and they'll take away what you're best at. Its up to the players and coaches (with more emphasis on the players) to adapt.

The two INT's yesterday were a perfect example of it. It was first read throw all the way, the read's no open, and rather than go through progressions and read the defense, Lamar just throws it. That's not play calling. That's poor decision making and quality defensive play.

Last year Lamar's first read was open a LOT. He rarely had to think that much. Now he has to.

 

[cdp]

Brandon Marshall said this morning that teams haven’t figured Lamar out — they’ve figured Roman out, and I like this comment from a Ravens fan on Reddit:


“I’m 1000% on board with moving on from Roman after this season and turning this into a more traditional offense that occasionally calls old Roman running plays but mostly uses Lamar’s legs to extend plays and scramble.

If Lamar can’t succeed and grow his passing game under the tutelage of a different offensive coordinator who draws up a good passing scheme next year, then perhaps we start asking ourselves hard questions.”

We're like the rams a season ago. Belichick figured them out and they couldn't do anything the following season. This season looks a bitter since McVay adapted. Now it's basically adapt or die for Roman.

 

[Militant X 1]

I think the frustration, from yesterday, is that Lamar's three critical mistakes were pretty much 100% on him. I'm not blaming play calling for two horrible INTs and a pocket fumble. Technically he put the ball on the ground at least 3 times yesterday... its just the other two were either recovered or didn't matter.

Play calling hasn't been great, the running game hasn't been great, the Oline wasn't great. But yesterday, I thought the latter two were easily good enough to win that game. What wasn't good enough to win the game was the QB.

That's one game. They didn't lose to the Chiefs because Lamar was terrible, and we didn't lose to the Titans because Lamar was terrible. I think we pretty much entirely lose yesterday because Lamar was terrible.

Again, that's just one game. Not every win or loss has to be all encompassing of all other games.

I agree! The Ravens rushing attack did more than enough to control and win that game yesterday. What was problematic was Lamar's seemingly inability to be efficient in the passing game and by keeping the ball off of the carpet and out of the hands of his foes in pressured-like or big moment-like games against the better teams (i.e. the playoffs, versus the Chiefs and now facing the Big Ben led Steelers) in my view.

 

[gtalk12]

I agree! The Ravens rushing attack did more than enough to control and win that game yesterday. What was problematic was Lamar's seemingly inability to be efficient in the passing game and by keeping the ball off of the carpet and out of the hands of his foes in pressured-like or big moment-like games against the better teams (i.e. the playoffs, versus the Chiefs and now facing the Big Ben led Steelers) in my view.

I saw improvement when he lead the offense down the field for a score at the end of the 3rd. Don't forget, not only was he almost perfect (only incompletion with the ball he threw to Hollywood in the corner of the end zone) but his big run that lead to a TD was also negated and he was still able to keep calm and play like the Lamar we saw last year. Still got us into the end zone and we took a lead.


Steelers go on to score the next drive thanks to penalties. one for 15 yards and another for 20 yards. The very next drive we just ran it down their throats and made it into the endzone where we decided to get cute. 4th and 3, would I have put the ball in Lamars hand? Absolutely, kid is a second year starter and has to get the experience. What did we do? We tried to have him run which I would not have done. If, IF, it was scripted then I don't get the play call. I'd rather give Lamar the ability to find a receiver and then take off if nothing is there. I think it is obvious that the defenses he has been seeing this year have a priority to limit HIS runs vs anything else. So, knowing that, what are we doing to take advantage of what we know the defense is doing?

 

[SepticeyePoe]

Did we find out how long Phillips is going to be out?

 

[Militant X 1]

I saw improvement when he lead the offense down the field for a score at the end of the 3rd. Don't forget, not only was he almost perfect (only incompletion with the ball he threw to Hollywood in the corner of the end zone) but his big run that lead to a TD was also negated and he was still able to keep calm and play like the Lamar we saw last year. Still got us into the end zone and we took a lead.


Steelers go on to score the next drive thanks to penalties. one for 15 yards and another for 20 yards. The very next drive we just ran it down their throats and made it into the endzone where we decided to get cute. 4th and 3, would I have put the ball in Lamars hand? Absolutely, kid is a second year starter and has to get the experience. What did we do? We tried to have him run which I would not have done. If, IF, it was scripted then I don't get the play call. I'd rather give Lamar the ability to find a receiver and then take off if nothing is there. I think it is obvious that the defenses he has been seeing this year have a priority to limit HIS runs vs anything else. So, knowing that, what are we doing to take advantage of what we know the defense is doing?

I agree that there were some good things from yesterdays game. I am actually rewatching it now (as I do every Monday). My issue is your last question. My answer and personal view of it is apparently nothing! The Ravens opponent's defensive scheme and gameplans are extremely simple and easy and seemingly works at the moment: eliminate Lamar's ability to break off huge runs with his legs and FORCE HIM to beat you by going through his progressions, making the right reads and then passing the ball through the air to various targets. He hasn't been able to do that effectively and consistently yet especially, in the seemingly big moments such as yesterday's rivalry game. It's becoming a plaguing issue and his Achilles heel.

 

[gtalk12]

I agree that there were some good things from yesterdays game. I am actually rewatching it now (as I do every Monday). My issue is your last question. My answer and personal view of it is apparently nothing! The Ravens opponent's defensive scheme and gameplans are extremely simple and easy and seemingly works at the moment: eliminate Lamar's ability to break off huge runs with his legs and FORCE HIM to beat you by going through his progressions, making the right reads and then passing the ball through the air to various targets. He hasn't been able to do that effectively and consistently yet especially, in the seemingly big moments such as yesterday's rivalry game. It's becoming a plaguing issue and his Achilles heel.

And its pissing me off. It's like we are trying to forcibly do what we did last year. How exactly is that going to work? Lamar most times is running back there for his life where as last year he was using it to extend plays. Where are the short easy throws for YAC? Did we not see what Hollywood did against the Dolphins with short routes?

 

[Simba]

I agree that there were some good things from yesterdays game. I am actually rewatching it now (as I do every Monday). My issue is your last question. My answer and personal view of it is apparently nothing! The Ravens opponent's defensive scheme and gameplans are extremely simple and easy and seemingly works at the moment: eliminate Lamar's ability to break off huge runs with his legs and FORCE HIM to beat you by going through his progressions, making the right reads and then passing the ball through the air to various targets. He hasn't been able to do that effectively and consistently yet especially, in the seemingly big moments such as yesterday's rivalry game. It's becoming a plaguing issue and his Achilles heel.

Lamar has 0 trust in his OL right now and that's a problem. You could see how much work he had put in and how often he was able to read defenses and progress through his reads last year. This year? Not so much. His internal clock is moving much faster and he's panicking, which is leading to poor decisions and just straight up misses.

If there's one thing to take solace in, it's that. He's shown the ability to do this previously and it's mental right now, not physical. I don't think anyone here is expecting him to be Mahomes throwing for 5000 yards, but if we can get him some more comfort, I think we know we've got a good QB. He just doesn't have that trust in his protection right now.

 

[Militant X 1]

Lamar has 0 trust in his OL right now and that's a problem. You could see how much work he had put in and how often he was able to read defenses and progress through his reads last year. This year? Not so much. His internal clock is moving much faster and he's panicking, which is leading to poor decisions and just straight up misses.

If there's one thing to take solace in, it's that. He's shown the ability to do this previously and it's mental right now, not physical. I don't think anyone here is expecting him to be Mahomes throwing for 5000 yards, but if we can get him some more comfort, I think we know we've got a good QB. He just doesn't have that trust in his protection right now.

We don't need Lamar to be Mahomes, Brees, Rodgers, Brady or any other QB. We need him to be LAMAR! That cat that we saw last season that was BEING HIMSELF and playing relaxed and having fun. As he used to always say; "We're just playing ball!" He doesn't seem to be having as much fun this season.

 

[Simba]

We don't need Lamar to be Mahomes, Brees, Rodgers, Brady or any other QB. We need him to be LAMAR! That cat that we saw last season that was BEING HIMSELF and playing relaxed and having fun. As he used to always say; "We're just playing ball!" He doesn't seem to be having as much fun this season.

I wouldn't be having that much fun either if I had a pass rusher in my face by time I finish my drop. But yeah, it's not all on him but he's not absolved either. Total team failure on the offensive side of the ball right now.

 

[cdp]

Re: Hollywood's tweet. Obviously Lamar is only a part of the problem

 

[JoeyFlex5]

harbaughs press conference from BR was interesting... he got really pissed about a question, responded with a very long rambling detailed story about some shit with his grandparents and it was awkward as fuck, and then finished with a brilliant response to the elephant in the room with hollywoods tweet, like he gave an ultimate harbaugh response and it was a really good one.

 

[UPennChem]

HE DID SAY HE HAD A DREAM FERGUSON BEAT UP THE REF! Please tell me someone here stepped in and said “that sounds more like something Judon would do”

LOL I'm an idiot for my subconscious to not have assumed it would be Judon

 

[RavensFan419]

harbaughs press conference from BR was interesting... he got really pissed about a question, responded with a very long rambling detailed story about some shit with his grandparents and it was awkward as fuck, and then finished with a brilliant response to the elephant in the room with hollywoods tweet, like he gave an ultimate harbaugh response and it was a really good one.

After reading your comment I went and watched the press conference I agree with the story that was weird but he gave more info on the Hollywood situation then I would've guessed

 

[D1City55]

I would bet he's open more than his numbers show. It almost feels like we're trying not to throw to him. It makes no sense that he's not more involved.

It really doesn't. He's by far and away your best WR. We had our best games last year when him and Hollywood connected.

 

[RavensMania]

I saw improvement when he lead the offense down the field for a score at the end of the 3rd. Don't forget, not only was he almost perfect (only incompletion with the ball he threw to Hollywood in the corner of the end zone) but his big run that lead to a TD was also negated and he was still able to keep calm and play like the Lamar we saw last year. Still got us into the end zone and we took a lead.


Steelers go on to score the next drive thanks to penalties. one for 15 yards and another for 20 yards. The very next drive we just ran it down their throats and made it into the endzone where we decided to get cute. 4th and 3, would I have put the ball in Lamars hand? Absolutely, kid is a second year starter and has to get the experience. What did we do? We tried to have him run which I would not have done. If, IF, it was scripted then I don't get the play call. I'd rather give Lamar the ability to find a receiver and then take off if nothing is there. I think it is obvious that the defenses he has been seeing this year have a priority to limit HIS runs vs anything else. So, knowing that, what are we doing to take advantage of what we know the defense is doing?

Yes, even though we lost due to many turnovers, this game showed a lot of improvement in the running game. We need to continue doing that throughout the season, but without the turnovers. However, we still need to utilize Duvernay more.

 

[cdp]

I didn't know whether I should post this here or in Lamar's thread.
I could buy in as to why Lamar regressed to a certain extent when our OL lacks Yanda and a healthy Skura - and now Stanley.
But this stat is brutal, we don't do much even from a clean pocket.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

Yes, even though we lost due to many turnovers, this game showed a lot of improvement in the running game. We need to continue doing that throughout the season, but without the turnovers. However, we still need to utilize Duvernay more.

I’m more concerned with what we have long term with Lamar than encouraged with our run game, honestly I find Lamar’s performance totally inexcusable, he absolutely cannot be triple clutching in the pocket, staring down first reads on shallow outs against zone drops, and just forcing throws in general. He was so reckless I can’t understand it, that’s never been his game and suddenly it feels like that’s all we’re seeing. It seems like he’s legit afraid to run because he doesn’t wanna be labeled

 

[rossihunter2]

Another unheralded guy that has really put together a solid season amongst a unit that has been overall shit, Bozeman continues to be dominant when pulling. So many of his blocks are sealing those holes in the run game. He's not the biggest or strongest guy but he's pretty technically sound. One highlight on what I expect to be a pretty poor OL going forward. He's turning into a really solid option for us in the middle.

it's a shame the rest of the OL is falling to pieces around him

 

[rossihunter2]

Because that worked so well for Crabtree and Maclin. Absolutely cannot bank on over the hill guys coming here and making a difference. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. Young WRs in their prime really don't make it to FA. You have to trade huge amounts of draft capital for them.

drafting's likely the only way we'll get talented guys here anyway lol