Dom McRaven
Hall of Famer
Okay thanks for clarifying. Was the guy in the white suit the actual master codebreaker or was he just JAG who just happened to have that symbol on his suit?
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The Last Jedi. NO SPOILERS HIDDEN
- Thread starter K-Dog
- Start date
Dom McRaven
Hall of Famer
I realized that the chick who played Taliie was also in xXx: Return of Xander Cage (don't get me started with that movie lol). As for Paige, they definitely made that scene dramatic by getting the detonator at the last minute. But going forward, I'm eager to see what Poe does and HE BETTER NOT DIE DAMMIT!
Yeah I hope they pay off the knights of ren - the idea of them and kylo going at rey (and maybe some young Jedi she’s trained) in like a rainy desolate place sounds epic to me
I think he was supposed to be the code breaker which makes the whole benecio del toro thing annoying - I kinda hoped that he would secretly be the lapel guy and was just hiding around but the fact he was some rando who just happened to be a code breaker was annoying (sidenote as a hardcore Star Wars nerd I’m disappointed that they didn’t call code breakers slicers)
It’s testament to how much this film was already fucking with my expectations from the beginning that I genuinely thought she’d missed the detonator despite it going with the Hollywood trope
Dom McRaven
Hall of Famer
The way how that scene was set up made it look like she would've been a second or two too late. That's another "what if" right there. What if she was too late?
It’s certainly interesting to think about - one of the boons of this film for me is how much discussion it provokes
Oldfaithful
Hall of Famer
Star Wars: The Last Jedi Review.
So this is going to be long.... So brace yourselves people.
I'm doing the overall before.. Because this is going to be long.
Overall: I give this movie an 8/10. I think it's better than Rouge One and The Force Awakens. It's a bit of a slow burn with a bevy of issues, but I honestly don't think it "ruined Star Wars" or anything. It has some of the best scenes in the Star Wars canon and the film is gorgeous. Certain characters get excellent development, and overall the story progresses nicely. Go watch it.
Okay... So here are my full (spoiler filled) thoughts. Starting from bad, which there's plenty of, to good.
The bad:
Let me start off by saying that Rose is entirely uninteresting as a character, and has little to no development. I cannot really like her because of this facet. She has a few good lines here and there but almost feels somewhat pointless. She was boring.
C3P0 needs to die at some point. BB8 is honestly much better than either him or R2D2(and I like R2 a lot.... Was one of my favorite characters growing up).
Finn is basically Rose. Almost entirely useless.. But at the very least he is likeable as a character, but he somehow retains a position of importance within the rebel alliance. Why? Poe is someone I'd get holding importance: he's that good, and Rey is a Jedi. Finn's character is just a wasted story opportunity. The writers could have done so much with an ex-storm trooper turned rebel alliance member.. And in The Force Awakens they did.. Here, they could have done more, but he's useless. At least he's a likable character.
Likewise, the subplot with Rose and Finn is the worst part of the film bar-none. It was boring, predictable, and only redeemed by BB8 being an awesome piece of comic relief and Poe being a good character. At times it was.... Nonsensical. Once again, Gwendolyn Christine is wasted. The casino /planet they go to? Boring(I do not buy into the notion that Star Wars was trying to be preachy SJW garbage... They never make a big deal about Rose and Finn being minorities, they never make a big deal about them being outcasts(though in Finn's case it should work as a character), nor is the Planet itself a metaphor for any country in particular, but rather a metaphor for certain people who profit off of a war). This goes on for way too long and almost drags the movie down entirely.
Luke's death is a problem too.. But not for the reasons most people criticize it. It's actually done in a respectable way. He didn't really die, he became one with the force. He'll be back in the next movie as a force ghost. They just killed him off a movie too early. Luke's arc did not make a full circle yet. They should have saved him.
Also... While I did like the stuff with Poe on the ship while tweedle dee(Finn) and tweedle dumbass(Rose) were off fucking around in one percenter land... The Super Leia stuff was hilariously awful. That was literally the perfect moment to kill her off. Think about it.
Now.. The Good.
The movie is called Star WARS. This movie felt like a war. The battles were grand, and had significant casualties.. There were stakes(take notes Marvel). The characters were not relatable, but understandable. For the most part they were well developed and entirely well acted. Is it the best Star Wars movie? No... Empire was a perfect film and it will never be recaptured... But I probably have it as the third best Star Wars movie.... It's bad parts do drag the movie a little, but there's so much good that I cannot hate this movie.. The majority of the criticisms about certain characters are stupid.
Like I said earlier. An 8/10. Damn good movie that I need to see again.
So this is going to be long.... So brace yourselves people.
I'm doing the overall before.. Because this is going to be long.
Overall: I give this movie an 8/10. I think it's better than Rouge One and The Force Awakens. It's a bit of a slow burn with a bevy of issues, but I honestly don't think it "ruined Star Wars" or anything. It has some of the best scenes in the Star Wars canon and the film is gorgeous. Certain characters get excellent development, and overall the story progresses nicely. Go watch it.
Okay... So here are my full (spoiler filled) thoughts. Starting from bad, which there's plenty of, to good.
The bad:
Let me start off by saying that Rose is entirely uninteresting as a character, and has little to no development. I cannot really like her because of this facet. She has a few good lines here and there but almost feels somewhat pointless. She was boring.
C3P0 needs to die at some point. BB8 is honestly much better than either him or R2D2(and I like R2 a lot.... Was one of my favorite characters growing up).
Finn is basically Rose. Almost entirely useless.. But at the very least he is likeable as a character, but he somehow retains a position of importance within the rebel alliance. Why? Poe is someone I'd get holding importance: he's that good, and Rey is a Jedi. Finn's character is just a wasted story opportunity. The writers could have done so much with an ex-storm trooper turned rebel alliance member.. And in The Force Awakens they did.. Here, they could have done more, but he's useless. At least he's a likable character.
Likewise, the subplot with Rose and Finn is the worst part of the film bar-none. It was boring, predictable, and only redeemed by BB8 being an awesome piece of comic relief and Poe being a good character. At times it was.... Nonsensical. Once again, Gwendolyn Christine is wasted. The casino /planet they go to? Boring(I do not buy into the notion that Star Wars was trying to be preachy SJW garbage... They never make a big deal about Rose and Finn being minorities, they never make a big deal about them being outcasts(though in Finn's case it should work as a character), nor is the Planet itself a metaphor for any country in particular, but rather a metaphor for certain people who profit off of a war). This goes on for way too long and almost drags the movie down entirely.
Luke's death is a problem too.. But not for the reasons most people criticize it. It's actually done in a respectable way. He didn't really die, he became one with the force. He'll be back in the next movie as a force ghost. They just killed him off a movie too early. Luke's arc did not make a full circle yet. They should have saved him.
Also... While I did like the stuff with Poe on the ship while tweedle dee(Finn) and tweedle dumbass(Rose) were off fucking around in one percenter land... The Super Leia stuff was hilariously awful. That was literally the perfect moment to kill her off. Think about it.
- Kylo Ren literally refused to shoot a scene earlier. His mother dying only makes the conflict inside stronger .
- I know it's bad to speak ill of the dead.. But she was going to die in the trilogy at some point anyway, even if Carrie Fisher were to have survived. It'd actually be a respectable death.
Now.. The Good.
- This is the best opening a Star Wars movie ever had. After the first few minutes you knew that this was going to be a good movie.
- Luke Skywalker... Acts like himself. People criticizing his characterization in this movie either didn't recently watch the original trilogy or are just angry because they had unreasonably high expectations. People are mad that he had the moment of weakness when confronting Kylo Ren about his turn to the Dark Side... That's completely in character for who Luke Skywalker is as a person. In the original trilogy he was whiny, he complained a lot, and while he grew as a person, he never really became a confident badass. Even he admitted that he made a mistake. The way that scene was shot it shows that their isn't necessarily a definitive black or white person in that scenario. Luke knew he was in the wrong, but in actuality he was not going to do anything. Kyle wakes up to his uncle having drawn his weapon. He's going to feel betrayed.
- Luke and Rey's scenes are excellent. Luke is understandably unwilling to help her out. He feels terrible for how he handled the stuff with Kylo Ren. He's a terrible teacher... And he knows it. He knows that everything the Jedi have ever done was a total failure. Which is why he wants to end it, which is understandable. The scenes for them together grow both as characters. Luke learns that whilst the Jedi were failures, Rey could be the one to change that. A cycle could be broken. Rey begins to question her morals and goes through some conflict herself. But learns to accept herself for who she is.
- Poe is probably the most likeable of the new characters and goes through some natural, and significant development. The mutiny... Well done. The demotion, makes a lot of sense. The decision he made was impulsive and cost the rebellion their bomber squad. At the end of the movie, he learns his lesson... And it feels natural.
- Kylo Ren is a powerhouse of a villain for a completely different reason than Darth Vader. He's arguably superior to Vader(though it's a tough one). He's not intimidating in the slightest: he's tortured. Vader was an all powerful badass, while Kylo Ren is an immature screwup. But that makes him incredibly interesting. He has temper tantrums, he's indecisive, he's very powerful but is prone to making mistakes. But they make his turn to the Dark Side sympathetic. It's far more justifiable than Annakin turning to the Dark Side in the prequels. He's whiny, but for good reason. Nothing has really ever gone right for him. He had to kill his father, he thinks his Uncle tried to kill him, Snoak abused him, no one in the first order really respects him. Him and Rey have believable chemistry. Kylo Ren is a damn good villain. Perfect? Hell no. I'd still say Vader is better. But there's an argument to be made.
- Rey is still one of the greatest female lead characters of all time. She's not really a Mary Sue. Her being able to do all of the things she did in the last movie makes sense. Homeless and had nothing, so she taught herself how to fight, hotwire electronics, and has likely stolen a few ships in her lifetime for scrap metal. In her situation she was meant to be adaptable. Hence her ability to adapt to the force so quickly. Not like she's pulling the stuff Luke and Lea were pulling in the movie, or even snoke. But here, she's even better. The conflict that she goes through is believable, and her parents being nobody was brilliant. She's hopeful, but understands that she does have flaws. She's powerful, but barely has an idea of how to keep hold of her powers. She's smart, but naive. She's the furthest thing from perfect and if she had turned to the Dark Side, no one would've blamed her. It wouldn't have been totally out of character from her. Like Kylo, she's someone who's gotten the shorter end of the stick in life. No parents, was dirt poor, constantly underestimated in life. She's just the perfect foil. She chooses to make the most of her situation and not lash out, while he does the opposite.
- The action scenes are probably the best of any Star Wars movies. The space battles were epic, the finale was epic. One scene in particular stands out from an action scene perspective.
- The scene where Kylo Ren and Rey team up to take on the elite guards was easily the best scene in the movie and arguably the best action setpiece in any Star Wars movie. The scene is exquisitely paced. You don't know whether Kylo Ren is going to definitively turn or not. Snoak literally narrates his thoughts to the guard, but is arrogant enough not to notice that he is making a fatal mistake. Ren kills Snoak and the guard surrounds him and Rey. They temporarily put their differences aside and kick their asses. The pacing? Brilliant, so much tension. The action itself? Excellent. Just a kickass moment.
- The scene where the ship sacrifices itself and goes lightspeed to break the rebel army.. Awesome. Badass sacrifice.
- Finally.. This movie felt like an epic. This movie is less Empire Strikes Back and more of Lord of the Rings: Two Towers. Only real parallel between this movie and empire is that the First Order has definitively gained the upper hand. Only this time, it's on a grander scale. They've reduced the rebel forces into the hundreds, possibly dozens. There are HEAVY casualties on the rebel side, whereas the biggest dent upon the First Order is done by Kylo Ren... Not by a member of the rebellion. The empire has them cornered where they have to retreat into a nigh impenetrable stronghold(much like Two Towers). All hope seems lost until Skywalker shows up..
The movie is called Star WARS. This movie felt like a war. The battles were grand, and had significant casualties.. There were stakes(take notes Marvel). The characters were not relatable, but understandable. For the most part they were well developed and entirely well acted. Is it the best Star Wars movie? No... Empire was a perfect film and it will never be recaptured... But I probably have it as the third best Star Wars movie.... It's bad parts do drag the movie a little, but there's so much good that I cannot hate this movie.. The majority of the criticisms about certain characters are stupid.
Like I said earlier. An 8/10. Damn good movie that I need to see again.
SepticeyePoe
Hall of Famer
I'm seeing The Last Jedi again today.
Nice one - I still think I wanna see it again soon
i saw this on twitter and thought some of you might enjoy it:
"ppl are hung up on who rey's dad is & meanwhile chewie is right there. driving her to jedi practice. keeping the engine running. dropping her off to meet the new boyfriend he doesn't exactly approve of, but just tells her to get home safe. her search for a father figure is OVER"
"ppl are hung up on who rey's dad is & meanwhile chewie is right there. driving her to jedi practice. keeping the engine running. dropping her off to meet the new boyfriend he doesn't exactly approve of, but just tells her to get home safe. her search for a father figure is OVER"
SepticeyePoe
Hall of Famer
Whoa, deja vu.
hahahaha - give me some slack it's 4:30 am here lol - didnt realise id already posted it
SepticeyePoe
Hall of Famer
You need to get some sleep, rossi.
NYE last night none of us went to sleep until about 10am this morning
Ludy51
Hall of Famer
i saw this on twitter and thought some of you might enjoy it:
"ppl are hung up on who rey's dad is & meanwhile chewie is right there. driving her to jedi practice. keeping the engine running. dropping her off to meet the new boyfriend he doesn't exactly approve of, but just tells her to get home safe. her search for a father figure is OVER"
"ppl are hung up on who rey's dad is & meanwhile chewie is right there. driving her to jedi practice. keeping the engine running. dropping her off to meet the new boyfriend he doesn't exactly approve of, but just tells her to get home safe. her search for a father figure is OVER"
Dom McRaven
Hall of Famer
redrum52
Hall of Famer
I HATED the casino section and that's probably my biggest beef with the movie.
View attachment 447
there's so much intense hatred of this film from a very loud and unreasonable minority (not saying disliking the film and negative criticism is illegitimate just that the main (and loudest) negative narrative around this film is based on unreasonable grounds) - a lot of it seems to based around the idea that rian johnson threw away all the set ups from the force awakens and all the character development including things like who rey's parents were and who snoke is etc. and i think for the most part its illegitimate and stupid criticism and in fact the last jedi only enhances the force awakens with extra wonderful layers of depth
the above "meme" is a great example of a subtle thing i hadnt noticed while watching the last jedi but going back to the force awakens stands out as another moment of really added gravity and depth - a potentially cheesy moment suddenly has weight
it's credit to the last jedi that the more i watch/read about/think about it the better it becomes and the better it makes the force awakens too
people are certainly entitled not to like it but not for a lot of the reasons that are most prevalent
there's so much intense hatred of this film from a very loud and unreasonable minority (not saying disliking the film and negative criticism is illegitimate just that the main (and loudest) negative narrative around this film is based on unreasonable grounds) - a lot of it seems to based around the idea that rian johnson threw away all the set ups from the force awakens and all the character development including things like who rey's parents were and who snoke is etc. and i think for the most part its illegitimate and stupid criticism and in fact the last jedi only enhances the force awakens with extra wonderful layers of depth
the above "meme" is a great example of a subtle thing i hadnt noticed while watching the last jedi but going back to the force awakens stands out as another moment of really added gravity and depth - a potentially cheesy moment suddenly has weight
it's credit to the last jedi that the more i watch/read about/think about it the better it becomes and the better it makes the force awakens too
people are certainly entitled not to like it but not for a lot of the reasons that are most prevalent