Next Up: vs Steelers

[cdp]

Im talking about in space lol, i doubt anyone thinks safeties can play 1vs1 cvg like cbs can so idk why you brung up “ 1vs1 cvg”You know you always getting a lil aggressive whenever you wanna prove a point like you in your feelings or something lol.. just relax young cub, everything gonna be alright.

I know what your preference for S is and I really feel like getting a true FS would improve our defense.

 

[cdp]

Why would Koch not be back? Also wouldn't bet against Jimmy and Young being back either.

They can always go younger and i wrote will and not going to.
Harbs can also find a punter in the draft. He has brought in many special teams gems.
Cox was also released once they felt Moore's ready.

 

[ChainedBird]

Thats why i want new safeties. If we had a playing making S along with clark it wouldnt be as bad but both our S, are basically box guys.

It depends how it plays out, if Kyle Hamilton somehow drops then I'd be on board with it, that guys looking crazy good. I've mock drafted Daxton Hill in the secound round a couple of times.

There's the opportunity cost though when we have a solid set of starters and other positions with more need. Definitely on board with S depth/developmental prospects that are lower rounds because they might take a bit longer to get there.

 

[rmcjacket23]

They can always go younger and i wrote will and not going to.
Harbs can also find a punter in the draft. He has brought in many special teams gems.
Cox was also released once they felt Moore's ready.

I mean sure he can find a Punter in the draft. Can he find a better one? And is that a good use of draft capital when you have somebody on the roster who's still pretty good at it?
I'm not overly concerned about getting younger at the Punter position. It's one of the few areas where I think age is virtually no relevance. I'm more concerned about getting younger on the Dline and in the Secondary, upgrading the Oline, and adding several pass rushers.

 

[RL52TheGreatest]

Thats why i want new safeties. If we had a playing making S along with clark it wouldnt be as bad but both our S, are basically box guys.

This defense needs more playmakers, period. I'm so tired of watching us drop easy ass interceptions lol

 

[RavensMania]

It depends how it plays out, if Kyle Hamilton somehow drops then I'd be on board with it, that guys looking crazy good. I've mock drafted Daxton Hill in the secound round a couple of times.

There's the opportunity cost though when we have a solid set of starters and other positions with more need. Definitely on board with S depth/developmental prospects that are lower rounds because they might take a bit longer to get there.

I'd love Daxton Hill in the 2nd, but we have so many higher priority needs. However if he is bpa at that point I wouldn't be upset if we went that direction.

 

[rossihunter2]

I know what your preference for S is and I really feel like getting a true FS would improve our defense.

i just think our experiences with Ed Reed have really spoilt us in terms of what we expect safety play to look like

not saying we shouldnt expect more from our safety tandem and i would love to add some range and athleticism (and ball-skills) to our safety tandem and i think stephens has a chance to develop that way for sure - i think it's tough to find ball-hawks at the safety position with the range, physicality and man coverage skills to force their way onto the field - justin simmons is a great example of what that looks like - so is quandre diggs

id love to add a playmaker to the safety position - i just dont think it's as obvious as just targeting a " true FS"

 

[JoeyFlex5]

i just think our experiences with Ed Reed have really spoilt us in terms of what we expect safety play to look like

not saying we shouldnt expect more from our safety tandem and i would love to add some range and athleticism (and ball-skills) to our safety tandem and i think stephens has a chance to develop that way for sure - i think it's tough to find ball-hawks at the safety position with the range, physicality and man coverage skills to force their way onto the field - justin simmons is a great example of what that looks like - so is quandre diggs

id love to add a playmaker to the safety position - i just dont think it's as obvious as just targeting a " true FS"

First sentence nails it. The reality is that the vast majority of the absolute best “free” safeties in the nfl are guys who are aware enough to see the routes developing and read the qbs eyes, and have the range to meet the receiver at the catch point. That’s a playmaking free safety. Ed Reed was another tier of football player, he is what Peyton manning would’ve been if he played defense, there never has been and never will be another safety like Ed Reed.

if we get a safety that can take half of these long TDs and turn them into incompletions, then we’re talking about a guy who’s playing at an elite level, but some people will complain that they don’t generate enough interceptions.

 

[rossihunter2]

First sentence nails it. The reality is that the vast majority of the absolute best “free” safeties in the nfl are guys who are aware enough to see the routes developing and read the qbs eyes, and have the range to meet the receiver at the catch point. That’s a playmaking free safety. Ed Reed was another tier of football player, he is what Peyton manning would’ve been if he played defense, there never has been and never will be another safety like Ed Reed.

if we get a safety that can take half of these long TDs and turn them into incompletions, then we’re talking about a guy who’s playing at an elite level, but some people will complain that they don’t generate enough interceptions.

it's why the best safeties in the league right now are versatile, physical, athletic and intelligent - they make plays in all sorts of different ways because banking on INTs is not a solid defensive strategy because so much of what goes into INTs is luck - obviously good instincts and good ball skills and taking some risks (and having that natural playmaking instinct) will lead you to more picks but it's not as repeatable as qualities like mirroring in man coverage, tackling, blitz disguise

im absolutely not saying to ignore guys who make plays but a great example is to look at in the 2021 nfl draft - andre cisco vs jevon holland - cisco had range and length and lots of INTs and Jevon holland played a lot of nickel and split-safety... jevon holland's been awesome in the NFL (and has been making plays including on the back-end) and has helped turn miami's secondary into a lockdown group while cisco's hardly been able to get on the field on a piss-poor jags team

even if we go back to malik hooker - yes he's been injured a lot but he looked like the closest thing ive seen to an ed reed type coming out of college and that has not translated at all

 

[Simba]

it's why the best safeties in the league right now are versatile, physical, athletic and intelligent - they make plays in all sorts of different ways because banking on INTs is not a solid defensive strategy because so much of what goes into INTs is luck - obviously good instincts and good ball skills and taking some risks (and having that natural playmaking instinct) will lead you to more picks but it's not as repeatable as qualities like mirroring in man coverage, tackling, blitz disguise

im absolutely not saying to ignore guys who make plays but a great example is to look at in the 2021 nfl draft - andre cisco vs jevon holland - cisco had range and length and lots of INTs and Jevon holland played a lot of nickel and split-safety... jevon holland's been awesome in the NFL (and has been making plays including on the back-end) and has helped turn miami's secondary into a lockdown group while cisco's hardly been able to get on the field on a piss-poor jags team

even if we go back to malik hooker - yes he's been injured a lot but he looked like the closest thing ive seen to an ed reed type coming out of college and that has not translated at all

Jessie Bates is one of a few that have bucked the trend, but he also started off really rough and has developed really well.

 

[rossihunter2]

Jessie Bates is one of a few that have bucked the trend, but he also started off really rough and has developed really well.

that's a good shout - i forgot about bates - and i should have mentioned kevin byard too

eddie jackson looked like he could be that guy back in 2018 but has been nothing close to that level since

but it's interesting that most lists of the best safeties in football right now would be made up not of those free safety kind of guys...

simmons
harrison smith
john johnson
minkah
derwin james
tyrann mathieu
budda baker

 

[RavensMania]

i just think our experiences with Ed Reed have really spoilt us in terms of what we expect safety play to look like

not saying we shouldnt expect more from our safety tandem and i would love to add some range and athleticism (and ball-skills) to our safety tandem and i think stephens has a chance to develop that way for sure - i think it's tough to find ball-hawks at the safety position with the range, physicality and man coverage skills to force their way onto the field - justin simmons is a great example of what that looks like - so is quandre diggs

id love to add a playmaker to the safety position - i just dont think it's as obvious as just targeting a " true FS"

That player could be Marcus Peters one day.

 

[RavensMania]

First sentence nails it. The reality is that the vast majority of the absolute best “free” safeties in the nfl are guys who are aware enough to see the routes developing and read the qbs eyes, and have the range to meet the receiver at the catch point. That’s a playmaking free safety. Ed Reed was another tier of football player, he is what Peyton manning would’ve been if he played defense, there never has been and never will be another safety like Ed Reed.

if we get a safety that can take half of these long TDs and turn them into incompletions, then we’re talking about a guy who’s playing at an elite level, but some people will complain that they don’t generate enough interceptions.

Totally agree. I know I have issues sometimes when people bring up players from the 2000s on and claim they are the best ever due to recency bias, but Ed Reed was absolutely the best ever. I loved Ronnie Lott and saw him play live back in the day when they came to town. Lott was tough as nails, no pun intended, but Ed Reed is in a tier of his own.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

it's why the best safeties in the league right now are versatile, physical, athletic and intelligent - they make plays in all sorts of different ways because banking on INTs is not a solid defensive strategy because so much of what goes into INTs is luck - obviously good instincts and good ball skills and taking some risks (and having that natural playmaking instinct) will lead you to more picks but it's not as repeatable as qualities like mirroring in man coverage, tackling, blitz disguise

im absolutely not saying to ignore guys who make plays but a great example is to look at in the 2021 nfl draft - andre cisco vs jevon holland - cisco had range and length and lots of INTs and Jevon holland played a lot of nickel and split-safety... jevon holland's been awesome in the NFL (and has been making plays including on the back-end) and has helped turn miami's secondary into a lockdown group while cisco's hardly been able to get on the field on a piss-poor jags team

even if we go back to malik hooker - yes he's been injured a lot but he looked like the closest thing ive seen to an ed reed type coming out of college and that has not translated at all

Ftr I hated Andre Cisco lol I didn’t think his skill set would translate because he was the epitome of a gambling safety, his position title shouldn’t be called safety because nothing he does is safe nor does it prevent touchdowns.

 

[rossihunter2]

Ftr I hated Andre Cisco lol I didn’t think his skill set would translate because he was the epitome of a gambling safety, his position title shouldn’t be called safety because nothing he does is safe nor does it prevent touchdowns.

oh i know - you and i both - was just pointing out that INTs and rangy plays like that arent necessarily an indicator of a play-making free safety in the pros

 

[Deebo813]

that's a good shout - i forgot about bates - and i should have mentioned kevin byard too

eddie jackson looked like he could be that guy back in 2018 but has been nothing close to that level since

but it's interesting that most lists of the best safeties in football right now would be made up not of those free safety kind of guys...

simmons
harrison smith
john johnson
minkah
derwin james
tyrann mathieu
budda baker

All of those guys can play well in cvg though.they arent liabilities in the backend. Like lets be honest, we teams air us out you dnt ever see our S in position to make a play. Im not even counting this year, we can count from the day elliot and clark became starters lol. Those two just arent good in the back.. devin mccourty isnt a top playmaker but he plays well in the backend, shit thats all we need.

 

[Deebo813]

it's why the best safeties in the league right now are versatile, physical, athletic and intelligent - they make plays in all sorts of different ways because banking on INTs is not a solid defensive strategy because so much of what goes into INTs is luck - obviously good instincts and good ball skills and taking some risks (and having that natural playmaking instinct) will lead you to more picks but it's not as repeatable as qualities like mirroring in man coverage, tackling, blitz disguise

im absolutely not saying to ignore guys who make plays but a great example is to look at in the 2021 nfl draft - andre cisco vs jevon holland - cisco had range and length and lots of INTs and Jevon holland played a lot of nickel and split-safety... jevon holland's been awesome in the NFL (and has been making plays including on the back-end) and has helped turn miami's secondary into a lockdown group while cisco's hardly been able to get on the field on a piss-poor jags team

even if we go back to malik hooker - yes he's been injured a lot but he looked like the closest thing ive seen to an ed reed type coming out of college and that has not translated at all

Naw you lost me with ints and luck lol.. it was going great till i seen luck lol.

 

[rossihunter2]

All of those guys can play well in cvg though.they arent liabilities in the backend. Like lets be honest, we teams air us out you dnt ever see our S in position to make a play. Im not even counting this year, we can count from the day elliot and clark became starters lol. Those two just arent good in the back.. devin mccourty isnt a top playmaker but he plays well in the backend, shit thats all we need.

i mean elliott was pretty good in man coverage and is pretty good using his range on the backend to make plays across the field
chuck's more of a traditional strong-safety type (hence why we like him in the box) but people see elliott with the hits and assume he's the same when in fact he's much more rangy and decent in coverage

like look at the INT he had vs the chargers - beautifully played coverage

so for me to take anything you say about our safeties being liabilities in coverage you're going to have to show me some evidence - i dont think they're amazing but they're certainly not liabilities

you're talking about chuck like he's daniel sorensen

 

[Tank]

So Ricard is now IR. Just couldn’t go 1 last week without losing someone.
And Boyle is on the Covid list.

 

[rossihunter2]

So Ricard is now IR. Just couldn’t go 1 last week without losing someone.
And Boyle is on the Covid list.

well i guess it's gonna be 11, 10 and 01 personnel all day then - and that's fine by me lol