• Welcome to PurpleFlock! Be sure to sign up here so that you can chat with your fellow Ravens fans.

The Offensive Line Thread

Ravensnation5220

Ravens Ring of Honor
I can't see the coaching staff changing anything unless we go on a streak of 2 losses. They arent the type to make changes to the O line unless the team is in a funk ( record wise)
Idk about that. With the way Lewis is playing and the lack of a run game. Hurst is familiar enough with the offense that i dont think thryd be too worried about messing with the chemistry. I think it will eventually happen regardless if we go on a losing streak or not. Just a matter of when it happens
 

Filmstudy

Staff Member
Moderator
Filmstudy
Writer
Lewis hasn't been as good as hoped, but he hasn't been nearly as awful as folks insinuate. He's been a C- player through 3 games. In terms of the power run game, he's not the problem, because he's made 23 of 27 pulls. In fact, that's been his strongest contribution.

He's had troubles as a pass blocker, but those are exaggerated by PFF's 1 or 0 system for pass rush events. For example, Lewis was partially responsible for the sack by Ray (Q2, 1:06). If you look at that play again with either the broadcast or all-22, you'll notice it's actually the front-side pressure from Miller that triggers the sack. Lewis is slowly beaten outside by Ray, but Flacco is taken down only after he's flushed forward in the pocket.

In terms of that play, I could see an argument to giving Hurst the entire sack, because it was his pressure that compromised the pocket, forcing Flacco to move and pull down the ball. However, since Lewis also allowed his man to get to Flacco right around the 3 second mark and Ray actually took down Flacco, I gave Lewis 2/3 and Hurst 1/3 (the same charge for just a pressure). In retrospect, I think a half charge to each would have been more fair, but I brought this up to illustrate a significant problem with PFF OL scoring...they don't have partial charges for pass rush events. That adds a big element of inadequacy to their system, since they are only able to ascribe either 1 or 0 for any player on a given event.

It's funny, because this offseason, PFF did some regression analysis to fine tune the value of various pass rush events surrendered. They posted an article with a 4-decimal place valuation of each. I applaud them for work to more accurately value events, but it won't help them much without more accurate count of events.

In mathematical terms, the result of an operation on 2 numbers A and B is only as accurate as the input with the fewest significant digits.

In common sense terms, don't tell me that sack was worth 2.0427 expected points when your enumeration of the sacks is off by 33% or 50%.
 

RavensMania

Staff Member
Administrator
Lewis hasn't been as good as hoped, but he hasn't been nearly as awful as folks insinuate. He's been a C- player through 3 games. In terms of the power run game, he's not the problem, because he's made 23 of 27 pulls. In fact, that's been his strongest contribution.

He's had troubles as a pass blocker, but those are exaggerated by PFF's 1 or 0 system for pass rush events. For example, Lewis was partially responsible for the sack by Ray (Q2, 1:06). If you look at that play again with either the broadcast or all-22, you'll notice it's actually the front-side pressure from Miller that triggers the sack. Lewis is slowly beaten outside by Ray, but Flacco is taken down only after he's flushed forward in the pocket.

In terms of that play, I could see an argument to giving Hurst the entire sack, because it was his pressure that compromised the pocket, forcing Flacco to move and pull down the ball. However, since Lewis also allowed his man to get to Flacco right around the 3 second mark and Ray actually took down Flacco, I gave Lewis 2/3 and Hurst 1/3 (the same charge for just a pressure). In retrospect, I think a half charge to each would have been more fair, but I brought this up to illustrate a significant problem with PFF OL scoring...they don't have partial charges for pass rush events. That adds a big element of inadequacy to their system, since they are only able to ascribe either 1 or 0 for any player on a given event.

It's funny, because this offseason, PFF did some regression analysis to fine tune the value of various pass rush events surrendered. They posted an article with a 4-decimal place valuation of each. I applaud them for work to more accurately value events, but it won't help them much without more accurate count of events.

In mathematical terms, the result of an operation on 2 numbers A and B is only as accurate as the input with the fewest significant digits.

In common sense terms, don't tell me that sack was worth 2.0427 expected points when your enumeration of the sacks is off by 33% or 50%.
I’ve never really liked the valuation given to either OL or DL in PFF, whether it be graced or premium statistics. Too many variables. I believe it’s better with the other positions, but again, nothing is perfect.

Appreciate the insight and thanks for posting.
 

Oldfaithful

Hall of Famer
Then, Ridley in 2018. We could have elite WR group on a cheap for 3-4 years
Moving this here.

Our WRs corps right now is cheap and pretty good. It’d be nice to have JuJu but the massive misconception by ravens fans is that it’s necessary to have an elite corps. Not it’s not. We need guys who are good enough. We have three now plus two good TEs. Our primary concern moving forward is the oline and the FS position(I personally think that with how rangy Elliot looked in the pre season he has starter upside though. We might’ve already found it which is exciting since athleticism was his weakness), and especially the interior oline.
 

allblackraven

Hall of Famer
Moving this here.

Our WRs corps right now is cheap and pretty good. It’d be nice to have JuJu but the massive misconception by ravens fans is that it’s necessary to have an elite corps. Not it’s not. We need guys who are good enough. We have three now plus two good TEs. Our primary concern moving forward is the oline and the FS position(I personally think that with how rangy Elliot looked in the pre season he has starter upside though. We might’ve already found it which is exciting since athleticism was his weakness), and especially the interior oline.
Stop.
Nobody said necessary.
JJSS_Ridley would make all the Ravens fans much happier than Bowser+Hurst, I'm sure.
 

DeVito52

Ravens Ring of Honor
let's not throw hurst under the bus for ridley yet

but definitely juju for bowser - lets hold off on the ridley for hurst stuff til hurst actually gets on the field but i dont think there'd be a ravens fan unhappy about ridley
Hurst has much more upside than Ridley. Hurst can be an all pro if he lives up to the hype.

Ridley is in the absolute perfect situation as is JuJu, the guys opposite of them are drawing all the attention and it makes their jobs much easier. They’re both good WRs but their crazy stats as of right now are also a product of their environment.
 

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
Hurst has much more upside than Ridley. Hurst can be an all pro if he lives up to the hype.

Ridley is in the absolute perfect situation as is JuJu, the guys opposite of them are drawing all the attention and it makes their jobs much easier. They’re both good WRs but their crazy stats as of right now are also a product of their environment.

to be fair to both juju and ridley they both have qualities that were always going to transfer well into the NFL
 
I take back what I said about Hurst he didnt have a good game he had an average game, Skura had a good game, Collins is getting next to nothing from our line
 

rossihunter2

Staff Member
Moderator
I take back what I said about Hurst he didnt have a good game he had an average game, Skura had a good game, Collins is getting next to nothing from our line

collins is facing more 8 man boxes than any other back in the league - teams are daring us to throw the ball and in 2/3 games we've made them pay for it

but Alex Lewis has been the weakest link on the OL so far - Skura had 1 bad game but has had 2 pretty good games
 

DeVito52

Ravens Ring of Honor
to be fair to both juju and ridley they both have qualities that were always going to transfer well into the NFL
Of course, I liked JuJu coming out and everyone likes Ridley basically. Like I said they’re both good receivers in their own right but they are also huge benefactors of the guys lined up on the other side of the field.
 

allblackraven

Hall of Famer
Of course, I liked JuJu coming out and everyone likes Ridley basically. Like I said they’re both good receivers in their own right but they are also huge benefactors of the guys lined up on the other side of the field.
Why wouldn't they be benefactors of each other on the same team? And remember, we'd still have at least one of Crabtree/Brown/Snead AND Andrews.
 
collins is facing more 8 man boxes than any other back in the league - teams are daring us to throw the ball and in 2/3 games we've made them pay for it

but Alex Lewis has been the weakest link on the OL so far - Skura had 1 bad game but has had 2 pretty good games

We're lucky that Collins can get yards on his own, hes the reason our play action has been lethal
 

Oldfaithful

Hall of Famer
Honestly. I think Bozeman is going to start somewhere next year. He’s already good as a run blocker and he has a lot to work on but he’s got time to learn and the football IQ to be a starting C in this league. He will never be anything amazing but it isn’t unheard of to find good centers this late.

If we are going to address the oline next year I’m starting to the we start to find our replacement for Yanda and maybe some interior depth.
 

RavensMania

Staff Member
Administrator
Honestly. I think Bozeman is going to start somewhere next year. He’s already good as a run blocker and he has a lot to work on but he’s got time to learn and the football IQ to be a starting C in this league. He will never be anything amazing but it isn’t unheard of to find good centers this late.

If we are going to address the oline next year I’m starting to the we start to find our replacement for Yanda and maybe some interior depth.
Finding a replacement for Yanda is exactly what we need to do as I’ve mentioned before and why I wanted Nelson this year. I also agree Bozeman will be our starting center next season.
There will be competition next offseason between Hurst, Siragusa, Lewis as any additional drafted players.
 

allblackraven

Hall of Famer
Finding a replacement for Yanda is exactly what we need to do as I’ve mentioned before and why I wanted Nelson this year. I also agree Bozeman will be our starting center next season.
There will be competition next offseason between Hurst, Siragusa, Lewis as any additional drafted players.
Nelson's been pretty disappointing every time I watched them. Few times at the receiving end of a proper, embarrassing pancake.
 
Top