The Tucker, the Refs and the Fish and Chips

[rmcjacket23]

Four main takeaways I have from yesterday:
1. I think Williams needs to go on IR and be done. Like he was praised for that pass breakup, but that's an INT 100% of the time if he could lift his left arm above his head. Go back and watch him attempt to tackle Henry on the goal line TD. It was a worse attempt than anything you'll see around the league from yesterday. He can't tackle.
He wasn't a huge liability out there yesterday, but there's going to be games where he is going to be one. We lack depth a bit at Safety, but I'd rather see Hamilton and Stone play 100%, and watch Williams be a situational player. He certainly can't help in run defense.
Props to have him for gutting it out, but he's the 3rd best Safety on the roster right now, and its not close. He shouldn't be playing the snaps he is.
2. RB may be the biggest weakness on the team. Our best RBs are averaging 4.1 YPC, which is replacement level in the NFL. Tennessee is a tough team to run it, but its an every week problem. Just not going to get explosive plays in the run game with this group.
I don't usually buy into the chatter among players available for trade, but a RB with some explosion (if one becomes available) makes plenty of sense.
3. I, like most, agree that we're being too conservative in play calling on offense when we're up like two scores in the second half. I think we're pretending we have the 2019 Ravens out there and can bludgeon teams for 5-6 yards a tote even when they know its coming. We can't. We don't have the personnel on the Oline or at RB to get that done.
Think we need to continue to run our offense the way it should be, and not play so scared of turnovers.
4. I don't know what it is, but I saw a tweet from one of the beatwriters yesterday, which paraphrased... "bad things happen when we throw the ball to Bateman". I don't know what it is, but he has zero chemistry with Lamar, and he's not a better player in this offense right now than Agholor. Agholor played slightly more snaps than Bateman yesterday, and I expect that to expand further. Think he's a better option for what we want to do on offense going forward.

 

[QtR Nevermore]

I think the problem with this thinking is that he gets about 2 seconds to determine what's "proportionate", and everybody else gets the rest of eternity to think about, criticize it, and come up with some other arbitrary acceptable "proportionate" response.

I don't think a few seconds is sufficient to expect somebody to assess an appropriate level of violence. Especially somebody who has literally no training in doing so.

If I were in the same situation, I have no idea what I'd do. Would be dependent on dozens of factors, including my particular mood in that situation. And if somebody arbitrarily felt like my actions were "too harsh", so be it. I'd just not give a shit what they thought.
If the legal system felt my actions were too severe, then it'll be handled the way it should. And if the legal system doesn't think its important enough to process through, that's life too.

Why did he have 2 seconds? He was in no danger and he could have held her, or pushed her away if he wanted to buy himself more thinking time to consider whether a massive haymaker was proportionate or not.

Anyway, this issue is a side track from the Titans game. I didn't start it but I could debate it forever if I'm not careful, because I feel so strongly about this worrying recent Let's revel in violence against women internet trend.

 

[QtR Nevermore]

Four main takeaways I have from yesterday:
1. I think Williams needs to go on IR and be done. Like he was praised for that pass breakup, but that's an INT 100% of the time if he could lift his left arm above his head. Go back and watch him attempt to tackle Henry on the goal line TD. It was a worse attempt than anything you'll see around the league from yesterday. He can't tackle.
He wasn't a huge liability out there yesterday, but there's going to be games where he is going to be one. We lack depth a bit at Safety, but I'd rather see Hamilton and Stone play 100%, and watch Williams be a situational player. He certainly can't help in run defense.
Props to have him for gutting it out, but he's the 3rd best Safety on the roster right now, and its not close. He shouldn't be playing the snaps he is.
2. RB may be the biggest weakness on the team. Our best RBs are averaging 4.1 YPC, which is replacement level in the NFL. Tennessee is a tough team to run it, but its an every week problem. Just not going to get explosive plays in the run game with this group.
I don't usually buy into the chatter among players available for trade, but a RB with some explosion (if one becomes available) makes plenty of sense.
3. I, like most, agree that we're being too conservative in play calling on offense when we're up like two scores in the second half. I think we're pretending we have the 2019 Ravens out there and can bludgeon teams for 5-6 yards a tote even when they know its coming. We can't. We don't have the personnel on the Oline or at RB to get that done.
Think we need to continue to run our offense the way it should be, and not play so scared of turnovers.
4. I don't know what it is, but I saw a tweet from one of the beatwriters yesterday, which paraphrased... "bad things happen when we throw the ball to Bateman". I don't know what it is, but he has zero chemistry with Lamar, and he's not a better player in this offense right now than Agholor. Agholor played slightly more snaps than Bateman yesterday, and I expect that to expand further. Think he's a better option for what we want to do on offense going forward.

The issue with dropping Marcus W is that Hamilton might get a ban for his stupid hit, which will leave us very thin at Safety. It was a very blatant example of the kind of thing the NFL wants to remove, so I wouldn't be surprised.

I didn't put the run game struggles down to the backs yesterday so much as the O line. To me, it looked different to previous seasons where the holes were closing before the old, slow backs could get through them. It just seemed like the holes didn't exist at all so Gus' extra push and strength actually helped a bit. Judging by the distribution of carries, it seemed like the coaches thought Gus was the best bet under the circumstances too.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Why did he have 2 seconds? He was in no danger and he could have held her, or pushed her away if he wanted to buy himself more thinking time to consider whether a massive haymaker was proportionate or not.

Anyway, this issue is a side track from the Titans game. I didn't start it but I could debate it forever if I'm not careful, because I feel so strongly about this worrying recent Let's revel in violence against women internet trend.

Because he doesn't know what will happen next. You only know what happens next because you get to see the outcome.

People are people. If you don't want to get hit, don't hit somebody. The gender aspect of it gets flushed down the toilet when the first person to act clearly doesn't give up a fuck about the gender to begin with.

 

[rmcjacket23]

The issue with dropping Marcus W is that Hamilton might get a ban for his stupid hit, which will leave us very thin at Safety. It was a very blatant example of the kind of thing the NFL wants to remove, so I wouldn't be surprised.

I didn't put the run game struggles down to the backs yesterday so much as the O line. To me, it looked different to previous seasons where the holes were closing before the old, slow backs could get through them. It just seemed like the holes didn't exist at all so Gus' extra push and strength actually helped a bit. Judging by the distribution of carries, it seemed like the coaches thought Gus was the best bet under the circumstances too.

I don't think he gets suspended. If he does, then maybe Williams plays next week. But his snaps have to be cut. And Williams hamstring injury may keep him out to begin with, so it may not be a "choice" thing.

Tennessee is a tougher team to run on. Pretty stout front. So I'm not surprised we had trouble on them specifically. But this isn't a one week problem either. And I agree that our Oline is probably built a bit better for pass protection than run blocking, which is different from historically what we see. But that's also smart and consistent with an approach to having a $50M QB on the roster.

I've also been telling people for years... Gus isn't a great short yardage back. There's literally no data that says he is. It's purely based on "well he's big". That doesn't matter.
We seemingly keep finding ourselves in like these 1st and goal at the 7-8 yard line, and we always end up with like 3rd and goal at the two, because we don't have a back that can get more than like 3 yards when the defense is condensed to stop it.

 

[Dom McRaven]

The officiating was annoying at times. I'm not exactly sure what Pierce was supposed to do on that bullshit roughing the passer penalty. Nonetheless, I can't come across as a hypocrite and bitch about Hopkins crying for the flag when OBJ has done the same thing.

If that RTP penalty doesn't happen, that long Henry run doesn't happen. Minus that 63-yard run, Henry only had 11 carries for 34 yards. Defense played very well. I concur with rmcjacket23, it's time for MW to go to IR. Speaking of safeties, what a steal Stone has been. I believe he leads the team in INTs, no?

There's really nothing more to add about this offense other from the fact that once the 2nd half offense can play just as well as, if not better than, the first-half offense, look the fuck out.

 

[rmcjacket23]

The officiating was annoying at times. I'm not exactly sure what Pierce was supposed to do on that bullshit roughing the passer penalty. Nonetheless, I can't come across as a hypocrite and bitch about Hopkins crying for the flag when OBJ has done the same thing.

If that RTP penalty doesn't happen, that long Henry run doesn't happen. Minus that 63-yard run, Henry only had 11 carries for 34 yards. Defense played very well. I concur with rmcjacket23, it's time for MW to go to IR. Speaking of safeties, what a steal Stone has been. I believe he leads the team in INTs, no?

There's really nothing more to add about this offense other from the fact that once the 2nd half offense can play just as well as, if not better than, the first-half offense, look the fuck out.

Agreed on the roughing the passer. It's just a bad call.
Also see the bullshit that Hopkins pulls on the goal line. Where he just runs right into the Corner, voluntarily engages in hand fighting, then complains when he doesn't get the flag. It's just bad football. It achieved what he wanted to achieve, but its just bad football.

 

[cobrajet]

Four main takeaways I have from yesterday:
1. I think Williams needs to go on IR and be done. Like he was praised for that pass breakup, but that's an INT 100% of the time if he could lift his left arm above his head. Go back and watch him attempt to tackle Henry on the goal line TD. It was a worse attempt than anything you'll see around the league from yesterday. He can't tackle.
He wasn't a huge liability out there yesterday, but there's going to be games where he is going to be one. We lack depth a bit at Safety, but I'd rather see Hamilton and Stone play 100%, and watch Williams be a situational player. He certainly can't help in run defense.
Props to have him for gutting it out, but he's the 3rd best Safety on the roster right now, and its not close. He shouldn't be playing the snaps he is.
2. RB may be the biggest weakness on the team. Our best RBs are averaging 4.1 YPC, which is replacement level in the NFL. Tennessee is a tough team to run it, but its an every week problem. Just not going to get explosive plays in the run game with this group.
I don't usually buy into the chatter among players available for trade, but a RB with some explosion (if one becomes available) makes plenty of sense.
3. I, like most, agree that we're being too conservative in play calling on offense when we're up like two scores in the second half. I think we're pretending we have the 2019 Ravens out there and can bludgeon teams for 5-6 yards a tote even when they know its coming. We can't. We don't have the personnel on the Oline or at RB to get that done.
Think we need to continue to run our offense the way it should be, and not play so scared of turnovers.
4. I don't know what it is, but I saw a tweet from one of the beatwriters yesterday, which paraphrased... "bad things happen when we throw the ball to Bateman". I don't know what it is, but he has zero chemistry with Lamar, and he's not a better player in this offense right now than Agholor. Agholor played slightly more snaps than Bateman yesterday, and I expect that to expand further. Think he's a better option for what we want to do on offense going forward.

I agree with you on the RB situation. Would have liked to maybe see Mitchell a few times yesterday but our o-line is struggling in both run and pass rush. I know Ronnie, Moses, Tyler have been banged up and Simpson was hurt yesterday but after losing Dobbins, if an explosive back becomes available for a decent trade I wouldn’t be upset if EDC made a move. I say that because I really think Dobbins may be done after this last season ender. I am also concerned about Ronnie. I know he is not 100% but he seems to be struggling, especially with the pass rush. He was getting handled in that Steelers game and also struggled again at times yesterday. He is not playing like the Ronnie of old.

I agree with your take on Williams and Bateman.

 

[cobrajet]

Agreed on the roughing the passer. It's just a bad call.
Also see the bullshit that Hopkins pulls on the goal line. Where he just runs right into the Corner, voluntarily engages in hand fighting, then complains when he doesn't get the flag. It's just bad football. It achieved what he wanted to achieve, but its just bad football.

Spot on. I am glad to be done with this damn team. I hope they miss the playoffs!

 

[Dom McRaven]

Agreed on the roughing the passer. It's just a bad call.
Also see the bullshit that Hopkins pulls on the goal line. Where he just runs right into the Corner, voluntarily engages in hand fighting, then complains when he doesn't get the flag. It's just bad football. It achieved what he wanted to achieve, but its just bad football.

Yep. Apart from a 20-yard catch in the first half (IIRC), I don't remember him doing anything in this game apart from wanting to get a flag. Most likely frustrated with the performance of their offense this entire season.

 

[OURavensFan]

Damn it I’ve had this argument with Bengal fans so much, then I say Ray rice never played another down for us and it doesn’t matter, we have woman beater and murderer, so our no DV empty virtual signaling doesn’t even matter for other fanbases. I say get the best players, I hate when a team gets a good player for less because they don’t value character, bengals are scumbags. Browns and Chiefs and Dolphins too.

 

[Deebo813]

Why did he have 2 seconds? He was in no danger and he could have held her, or pushed her away if he wanted to buy himself more thinking time to consider whether a massive haymaker was proportionate or not.

Anyway, this issue is a side track from the Titans game. I didn't start it but I could debate it forever if I'm not careful, because I feel so strongly about this worrying recent Let's revel in violence against women internet trend.

He needed 2 seconds cause his brain doesnt register nor comprehend the situation. Most people, especially men… cant control their emotions. Ive dealt with a lot of women and never ever thought about hitting one. most dudes that hit women, wouldnt hit a man anyway so theres that but yea im happy from the south technically cause we feel like everyone else just too disrespectful

 

[Simba]

Alright let’s knock it off with the DV talk. Things like this never end well.

 

[Deebo813]

Alright let’s knock it off with the DV talk. Things like this never end well.

Agreed but thats how you know we all fucked up..not putting your hands on a woman is something every single man should be able to agree with, especially in a situation as simple as a push….thats all

 

[OURavensFan]

J

Four main takeaways I have from yesterday:
1. I think Williams needs to go on IR and be done. Like he was praised for that pass breakup, but that's an INT 100% of the time if he could lift his left arm above his head. Go back and watch him attempt to tackle Henry on the goal line TD. It was a worse attempt than anything you'll see around the league from yesterday. He can't tackle.
He wasn't a huge liability out there yesterday, but there's going to be games where he is going to be one. We lack depth a bit at Safety, but I'd rather see Hamilton and Stone play 100%, and watch Williams be a situational player. He certainly can't help in run defense.
Props to have him for gutting it out, but he's the 3rd best Safety on the roster right now, and its not close. He shouldn't be playing the snaps he is.
2. RB may be the biggest weakness on the team. Our best RBs are averaging 4.1 YPC, which is replacement level in the NFL. Tennessee is a tough team to run it, but its an every week problem. Just not going to get explosive plays in the run game with this group.
I don't usually buy into the chatter among players available for trade, but a RB with some explosion (if one becomes available) makes plenty of sense.
3. I, like most, agree that we're being too conservative in play calling on offense when we're up like two scores in the second half. I think we're pretending we have the 2019 Ravens out there and can bludgeon teams for 5-6 yards a tote even when they know its coming. We can't. We don't have the personnel on the Oline or at RB to get that done.
Think we need to continue to run our offense the way it should be, and not play so scared of turnovers.
4. I don't know what it is, but I saw a tweet from one of the beatwriters yesterday, which paraphrased... "bad things happen when we throw the ball to Bateman". I don't know what it is, but he has zero chemistry with Lamar, and he's not a better player in this offense right now than Agholor. Agholor played slightly more snaps than Bateman yesterday, and I expect that to expand further. Think he's a better option for what we want to do on offense going forward.

Just truly a shame Dobbins got hurt for the year

 

[BoredMarine13]

Lol y’all getting into it for a Monday , i like it

 

[RavensMania]

Agreed on the roughing the passer. It's just a bad call.
Also see the bullshit that Hopkins pulls on the goal line. Where he just runs right into the Corner, voluntarily engages in hand fighting, then complains when he doesn't get the flag. It's just bad football. It achieved what he wanted to achieve, but its just bad football.

that was absolutely ridiculous.

 

[gtalk12]

I don't think he gets suspended. If he does, then maybe Williams plays next week. But his snaps have to be cut. And Williams hamstring injury may keep him out to begin with, so it may not be a "choice" thing.

Tennessee is a tougher team to run on. Pretty stout front. So I'm not surprised we had trouble on them specifically. But this isn't a one week problem either. And I agree that our Oline is probably built a bit better for pass protection than run blocking, which is different from historically what we see. But that's also smart and consistent with an approach to having a $50M QB on the roster.

I've also been telling people for years... Gus isn't a great short yardage back. There's literally no data that says he is. It's purely based on "well he's big". That doesn't matter.
We seemingly keep finding ourselves in like these 1st and goal at the 7-8 yard line, and we always end up with like 3rd and goal at the two, because we don't have a back that can get more than like 3 yards when the defense is condensed to stop it.

Is there a version of the Ravens that make a trade this year for a RB by the deadline?

And IF we did, I just don't see who is available that would actually be worth it

 

[rmcjacket23]

Is there a version of the Ravens that make a trade this year for a RB by the deadline?

And IF we did, I just don't see who is available that would actually be worth it

I think this team could make a trade or two for a lot of different groups, and I don't see why RB would be excluded from it.
But agreed, lack of available players is a whole different story. Obviously the internet would tell you that Saquon Barkley makes some sense, but you're pretty much narrowed down to RBs who are good on teams that aren't post-season bound. And there aren't many.

If I were to dart throw some names:
Barkley, Henry, Jacobs are all UFAs after this season and its questionable whether they're in the long term plans of those teams. Also three teams that could find themselves falling out of the playoff hunt by the trade deadline. But still early on that one.

Also would look at three other guys... Conner in Arizona, Jones in GB, and Gibson in WAS. Gibson is a UFA next year and has seemingly fallen out of favor in WAS, though not sure he's a chain mover. Conner and Jones (specifically) are at the tail end of their contracts and could easily not be part of those teams plans for '24. If GB falls out of the playoff hunt, I think trading some assets for picks makes sense.

Totally speculative though. Have no idea if even one of these guys would ever be available.

 

[ravenslord]

Ill trade Bateman for Derrick Henry straight up !