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The Good, the Bad and the Injuries - Bengals Edition

All_black_everything

All_black_everything

Pro Bowler
Adreme said:
Because it isnt and Lamar is not close his 2nd MVP so basically everything you said was wrong. If the season ended today he probably places 3rd in voting which is not bad but certainly not "on his way to a 2nd MVP". The MVP is going to be Hurts or Mahomes barring a massive surge from one of the 2nd tier candidates. In 2019 Lamar had several measurables (4th highest QBR ever for a season, leading league in TDs,e tc.), the team was the best record in the NFL, and he had many a wow play to capture voters which helped with the story. None of that is true this year. In order to be MVP Lamar has to reach the 1 seed, put up significantly better numbers than he has so far (I think he has played great but you need some stats to say you are MVP), and Hurts/Mahomes need to fall off without any of the other 2nd tier candidates having a dominant 2nd half... so unlikely.

Meanwhile that "QBs are x-x against each other" is such a silly number. It is a dumber version of the non existent QB wins stat that know nothing football fans to sell you because at least with the "QB wins" stat you can argue the QB is a significant part of the win but the QB vs QB thing is silly because they never set on the field at the same time, save for maybe the coin flip. It was dumb when they tried to argue Lamar could not beat Mahomes. It was dumb when they tried to argue that Burrow could beat Mahomes. It is just a dumb way to argue who is the better QB.

So yes just about every GM/scout/coach will have Burrow ahead of Lamar when that list comes out next year. I can pretty much guarantee the top will be Mahomes, Hurts, and Burrow. I would not also not be shocked if Stroud quickly sneaks into the top 5 if he keeps this up just because of how insane his year has been (he is on pace for 5000 yards 30 TDs and 4 INTs throwing to nothing).
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100% agree with your first paragraph! I do not understand the whole “Lamar Jackson is winning MVP again” thing. Imo he’s not even close. It’s a stat driven accolade and he is not getting the stats this year to warrant the award.
 
Sooky

Sooky

Pro Bowler
All_black_everything said:
100% agree with your first paragraph! I do not understand the whole “Lamar Jackson is winning MVP again” thing. Imo he’s not even close. It’s a stat driven accolade and he is not getting the stats this year to warrant the award.
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I would agree in most years, but tbh most QBs outside of Hurts vulturing every touchdown with the tush push, nobody really has the stats this year. And all it takes is a 5-6 game stretch to change the entire narrative for the season.

If the season ended today, the player with the best stats might be Sam Howell, but there are reasons why you don’t hear him in the MVP conversation. Stats aren’t the entire story. Will be interesting to see how the award shapes up the second half of the season.
 
Sooky

Sooky

Pro Bowler
Bateman looks quick and fast again the past couple weeks. He needs to attack that ball. He looked like Quentin Johnston out there last Sunday.
 
OURavensFan

OURavensFan

Ravens Ring of Honor
Adreme said:
Because it isnt and Lamar is not close his 2nd MVP so basically everything you said was wrong. If the season ended today he probably places 3rd in voting which is not bad but certainly not "on his way to a 2nd MVP". The MVP is going to be Hurts or Mahomes barring a massive surge from one of the 2nd tier candidates. In 2019 Lamar had several measurables (4th highest QBR ever for a season, leading league in TDs,e tc.), the team was the best record in the NFL, and he had many a wow play to capture voters which helped with the story. None of that is true this year. In order to be MVP Lamar has to reach the 1 seed, put up significantly better numbers than he has so far (I think he has played great but you need some stats to say you are MVP), and Hurts/Mahomes need to fall off without any of the other 2nd tier candidates having a dominant 2nd half... so unlikely.

Meanwhile that "QBs are x-x against each other" is such a silly number. It is a dumber version of the non existent QB wins stat that know nothing football fans to sell you because at least with the "QB wins" stat you can argue the QB is a significant part of the win but the QB vs QB thing is silly because they never set on the field at the same time, save for maybe the coin flip. It was dumb when they tried to argue Lamar could not beat Mahomes. It was dumb when they tried to argue that Burrow could beat Mahomes. It is just a dumb way to argue who is the better QB.

So yes just about every GM/scout/coach will have Burrow ahead of Lamar when that list comes out next year. I can pretty much guarantee the top will be Mahomes, Hurts, and Burrow. I would not also not be shocked if Stroud quickly sneaks into the top 5 if he keeps this up just because of how insane his year has been (he is on pace for 5000 yards 30 TDs and 4 INTs throwing to nothing).
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That’s interesting you said you can argue that QB’s are a part of an overall wins argument because you inferred I was a dumbass for using Lamar’s career winning % as an accolade in his individual favor against Burrow
 
All_black_everything

All_black_everything

Pro Bowler
Sooky said:
I would agree in most years, but tbh most QBs outside of Hurts vulturing every touchdown with the tush push, nobody really has the stats this year. And all it takes is a 5-6 game stretch to change the entire narrative for the season.

If the season ended today, the player with the best stats might be Sam Howell, but there are reasons why you don’t hear him in the MVP conversation. Stats aren’t the entire story. Will be interesting to see how the award shapes up the second half of the season.
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Agreed, it’s not completely stat driven but a fusion of all things considered. Stats being one of those.

My point is if Lamar finishes the season with 3900-4000 passing yards and 900-1000 rushing yards with 25 passing touchdowns and 10 rushing touchdowns. We sit at the 3 seed with 12 wins. Is this enough? I honestly don’t think so.

Especially since guys are throwing for over 5000 now with 30+ TDs and a handful on the ground. (Hurts with 2 handfuls)
 
OURavensFan

OURavensFan

Ravens Ring of Honor
All_black_everything said:
Agreed, it’s not completely stat driven but a fusion of all things considered. Stats being one of those.

My point is if Lamar finishes the season with 3900-4000 passing yards and 900-1000 rushing yards with 25 passing touchdowns and 10 rushing touchdowns. We sit at the 3 seed with 12 wins. Is this enough? I honestly don’t think so.

Especially since guys are throwing for over 5000 now with 30+ TDs and a handful on the ground. (Hurts with 2 handfuls)
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That’s pretty damn good
 
Sooky

Sooky

Pro Bowler
All_black_everything said:
Agreed, it’s not completely stat driven but a fusion of all things considered. Stats being one of those.

My point is if Lamar finishes the season with 3900-4000 passing yards and 900-1000 rushing yards with 25 passing touchdowns and 10 rushing touchdowns. We sit at the 3 seed with 12 wins. Is this enough? I honestly don’t think so.

Especially since guys are throwing for over 5000 now with 30+ TDs and a handful on the ground. (Hurts with 2 handfuls)
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It may be though. Let’s be honest, Lamar’s MVP season didn’t even have the numbers for MVP for most seasons, most years it’s a 5000 yard passer with 40+ touchdowns.

At the end of the day they may look at Hurts rushing touchdowns, but what Hurts and Tua have going against them is their WR1s are also technically in the MVP race. A WR won’t win MVP but it cannibalizes some votes going towards the same team.

Idk how Mahomes is #1 in MVP voting, other than he’s good every year. Hurts currently has less rushing and passing yards than Lamar and has AJ on the team. Tua cant beat a .500 team and he’s still heavily criticized for it. Allen is losing games for his teams.

Obviously it all comes down to how these QBs play in the second half of the season. In most years, the first half of the season is forgotten about for the award. It may come down to team wins for Lamar and Hurts. And even if the eagles have a game on the Ravens come playoff time it can be argued that currently they have a higher point differential, Gus gets all the carries in the red zone, and Lamar lost his top target.

I can’t remember a MVP race so wide open before. So much bad QB play in the league it probably should go to a skill position. It will likely come down to which team performs the best in December and that even could be Stroud at his crazy pace.
 
JAAM

JAAM

Hall of Famer
Do we have any info about Mark’s rehab? I’ve been seeing he could come back for a deep playoff run but I’m not believing it
 
Tank

Tank

Hall of Famer
Sooky said:
It may be though. Let’s be honest, Lamar’s MVP season didn’t even have the numbers for MVP for most seasons, most years it’s a 5000 yard passer with 40+ touchdowns.

At the end of the day they may look at Hurts rushing touchdowns, but what Hurts and Tua have going against them is their WR1s are also technically in the MVP race. A WR won’t win MVP but it cannibalizes some votes going towards the same team.

Idk how Mahomes is #1 in MVP voting, other than he’s good every year. Hurts currently has less rushing and passing yards than Lamar and has AJ on the team. Tua cant beat a .500 team and he’s still heavily criticized for it. Allen is losing games for his teams.

Obviously it all comes down to how these QBs play in the second half of the season. In most years, the first half of the season is forgotten about for the award. It may come down to team wins for Lamar and Hurts. And even if the eagles have a game on the Ravens come playoff time it can be argued that currently they have a higher point differential, Gus gets all the carries in the red zone, and Lamar lost his top target.

I can’t remember a MVP race so wide open before. So much bad QB play in the league it probably should go to a skill position. It will likely come down to which team performs the best in December and that even could be Stroud at his crazy pace.
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1200 yards rushing is what separated LJ from the pack in 2019.
 
JAAM

JAAM

Hall of Famer
RavensMania

RavensMania

Staff Member
Administrator
allblackraven said:
Cracked fibula + ligaments. I wouldn't hold my breath.
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although we most likely won't see him until hopefully the offseason, I keep remembering T.O.

Terrell Owens never had the opportunity to win a Super Bowl in his illustrious career — but he'll always be known for having the most heroic performance in the big game. Seven weeks before Super Bowl XXXIX, Owens broke his leg and and tore a ligament in his right ankle.F
 
JAAM

JAAM

Hall of Famer
RavensMania said:
although we most likely won't see him until hopefully the offseason, I keep remembering T.O.

Terrell Owens never had the opportunity to win a Super Bowl in his illustrious career — but he'll always be known for having the most heroic performance in the big game. Seven weeks before Super Bowl XXXIX, Owens broke his leg and and tore a ligament in his right ankle.F
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Holy shit I remember that. So you’re saying there’s a chance with Mark, though I wonder if his diabetes affects his ability to heal quicker
 
R

ravenslord

Ravens Ring of Honor
Burrow not being in the injury report is causing lawsuits from people who bet on the game :

www.yahoo.com

Dave Portnoy Says He's Suing the NFL for Bengals' Joe Burrow Injury Report Controversy

The Cincinnati Bengals suffered a setback during their Nov. 16 match against the Baltimore Ravens when quarterback Joe Burrow had a wrist injury that eventually took him out of the game. The Bengals stirred up controversy after a video was posted and quickly deleted from the team's social media ...
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
 
OURavensFan

OURavensFan

Ravens Ring of Honor
ravenslord said:
Burrow not being in the injury report is causing lawsuits from people who bet on the game :

www.yahoo.com

Dave Portnoy Says He's Suing the NFL for Bengals' Joe Burrow Injury Report Controversy

The Cincinnati Bengals suffered a setback during their Nov. 16 match against the Baltimore Ravens when quarterback Joe Burrow had a wrist injury that eventually took him out of the game. The Bengals stirred up controversy after a video was posted and quickly deleted from the team's social media ...
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
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I think this is a dangerous precedent, but also screw Portnay, Raven hater and a few weeks ago tweeted Bengals as the top 5 teams in the NFL. He would have made the bet anyway, he hates the Ravens
 
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