The Well-Mannered Politics Thread

[flynismo]

The best way to combat the illegal immigration is for us to do our jobs and go after the employers who are hiring these people. No jobs = much less illegals

Beyond that, I think it is time to move to a merit based system.

Additionally, build that damn wall.

 

[Willbacker]

Donald Trump could walk outside and do something unspeakable with 100% proof and schmucks like Hannity would find a way to blame the Democrats.

I remember after Sandy how right wing media kept trying to push it as "Obama's Katrina". I find that kinda funny since these same people downplayed Katrina as the aftermath played out and made people out like they were blaming Bush for the hurricane. Did the same thing with the mess that is Maria. Finally got funding through to help recovery efforts there and with Harvey and Michael after Republicans tried to hold it hostage for border wall money. Remember how under Obama those unemployment numbers were all fudged and now if anything they are saying too many people are unemployed? Or should we go back to how they kept pushing for war in Iraq(sorry, meant "Operation Iraqi Freedom")? None of them will have any accountability for that, will just blame the democrats. Now they are trying to push a war with Iran. But of course this is all the "No spin zone" "real news" right? Give me a break.

Rant over.

General post for everyone below

I think a lot of this thread is us going back and forth trying to convince each other which party is worse than the other. I don't vote for not as bad as the other side and voted 3rd party in 2016 for this exact reason. Let's make this a place where we can discuss our own ideas instead of which party is slightly less worse than the other. So without further ado, what would you all do to solve this current illegal immigration problem? Are you happy with how things currently are? Or do you have an idea that can be a long term solution or at least provide help?

You know whats really funny. Clinton was gonna win Texas and Georgia and become prez ( lost by double digits in both states ). Trump was gonna start world war 3 and the market was gonna crash. The Covington kids were racist Maga hat wearers cussing out native americans and blocking their way. Kavanaugh was a rapist. Manufactured crisises. Walls are closing in. Russia Russia Russia. Yep some real news there folks. only reason why I'm saying this is cuz I'm tired of hearing what is "real" news.

Lets also see. 93 billion given to PR. Higher labor participation rate. Way higher than Obama. And idk but it seems like Iran is picking the fight cuz the sanctions are choking them. Also "Obams Katrina"?!? Never heard that one before. Did the schmuck Hannity report that?

Edit: I knew Obama golfed thru something. Couldn't remember what it was

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/aug/18/obamas-golf-vacation-amid-louisiana-flooding-stirs/

Rant over.

To your question. 1st thing if you don't show up for your court hearing you're an instant criminal and your rights to citizenship have been revoked. 2nd build the wall. Its too easy right now. No its not 100% foolproof but its a major deterrent. Look how well it worked for Israel. 3rd I would approve DACA to the 2.5 million. Its been long enough.

 

[Willbacker]

The best way to combat the illegal immigration is for us to do our jobs and go after the employers who are hiring these people. No jobs = much less illegals

Beyond that, I think it is time to move to a merit based system.

Additionally, build that damn wall.

Yes the employers. This is major. We need e verify

 

[gtalk12]

You keep talking about the way he talks. How about the way he is portrayed or how about any minorities that sides with Trump is called a prop. This is not a one way street. Building a wall is for the security of our country and no it shouldn't be used as any sort of chant against minorities. This is not being dismissive. This is supporting my president who has turned over rocks which has exposed all the snakes that are crawling underneath. Its called the swamp. This includes both sides of the aisle but its one side that keeps calling the other racist. This is why I have to keep bringing up the democrats. You think I do it for no damn reason?

Have a happy fathers day too gtalk. I can tell you're a good man but a step back is needed to get the big picture.

I'm not a dad but thank you lol.

Building a wall for our protection is not what I am talking to you about. How he is portrayed by one side of the media vs the other is not what I am talking to you about either. I hold no political allegiance and I can assure you that whoever is in office, no matter the side, the opposite side will make sure to tear down. Why? Because America, that's why. That part, I am not debating at all.


All I am saying is, having children chant that to other American children is not ok. That is what happens when you don't watch what you say and how you say it. Nothing wrong with being courteous and respectful. That part is where I sort of want a politician.

 

[Willbacker]

I'm not a dad but thank you lol.

Building a wall for our protection is not what I am talking to you about. How he is portrayed by one side of the media vs the other is not what I am talking to you about either. I hold no political allegiance and I can assure you that whoever is in office, no matter the side, the opposite side will make sure to tear down. Why? Because America, that's why. That part, I am not debating at all.


All I am saying is, having children chant that to other American children is not ok. That is what happens when you don't watch what you say and how you say it. Nothing wrong with being courteous and respectful. That part is where I sort of want a politician.

Well remember Donald Trump is not a politician. That's critical to know. He's not well spoken.

I 100% agree with you about the chant. This also happened in a basketball game. Both acts were despicable and hopefully the children that did this realized they were wrong.

 

[gtalk12]

Well remember Donald Trump is not a politician. That's critical to know. He's not well spoken.

I 100% agree with you about the chant. This also happened in a basketball game. Both acts were despicable and hopefully the children that did this realized they were wrong.

I doubt it, and trust me I know there are real racists hiding in the democratic party. Recently one was in black face when he was younger. I remember that came out.

In fact, I PERSONALLY know a democrat that was in black face when he was younger and did not understand the significance of that.

 

[Willbacker]

I doubt it, and trust me I know there are real racists hiding in the democratic party. Recently one was in black face when he was younger. I remember that came out.

In fact, I PERSONALLY know a democrat that was in black face when he was younger and did not understand the significance of that.

This is why I don't trust MSM. Its not only the governor but the lt governor is accused by 2 women of rape. Not talked about. Thing is with the blackface they may not have known they was wrong but the KKK character also in the photo kinda tells me maybe they did.

 

[gtalk12]

This is why I don't trust MSM. Its not only the governor but the lt governor is accused by 2 women of rape. Not talked about. Thing is with the blackface they may not have known they was wrong but the KKK character also in the photo kinda tells me maybe they did.

Blackface, as cringy as that is for me, is one thing. To have a noose AND friends dressed up as KKK members? Yea I am out on that. Disgusting.

 

[cobrajet]

Blackface, as cringy as that is for me, is one thing. To have a noose AND friends dressed up as KKK members? Yea I am out on that. Disgusting.

Absolutely, no excuse for that....ever!

 

[52520Andrew]

You know whats really funny. Clinton was gonna win Texas and Georgia and become prez ( lost by double digits in both states ). Trump was gonna start world war 3 and the market was gonna crash. The Covington kids were racist Maga hat wearers cussing out native americans and blocking their way. Kavanaugh was a rapist. Manufactured crisises. Walls are closing in. Russia Russia Russia. Yep some real news there folks. only reason why I'm saying this is cuz I'm tired of hearing what is "real" news.

Lets also see. 93 billion given to PR. Higher labor participation rate. Way higher than Obama. And idk but it seems like Iran is picking the fight cuz the sanctions are choking them. Also "Obams Katrina"?!? Never heard that one before. Did the schmuck Hannity report that?

Rant over.

To your question. 1st thing if you don't show up for your court hearing you're an instant criminal and your rights to citizenship have been revoked. 2nd build the wall. Its too easy right now. No its not 100% foolproof but its a major deterrent. Look how well it worked for Israel. 3rd I would approve DACA to the 2.5 million. Its been long enough.

You seem to be getting annoyed every time I say something bad about the right because I get attacks about the left even when not quoting you. But you rarely defend the right. I ain't trying to defend the left. If you wanna argue slightly less worse, good for you but I don't vote for that. I think both parties are two sides of the same coin and are ultimately controlled by the same group of people. As for the issues you have

• They did get some before the bill below but certainly haven't gotten 90+ billion

https://www.factcheck.org/2019/04/trump-misleads-on-aid-to-puerto-rico/
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-aid-after-trump-spat-puerto-rico/1331924001/

• Economy is better now but it had been recovering for years, tax cuts were a boost but trade war has hurt. Quantitative easing was huge. Look up the economic cycle. The numbers come from the same people but apparently the numbers magically turned correct after November 2016.
• Look up Gulf of Tonkin August 4th 1964
• I remember hearing all about it on Fox, found this Washington Times piece, BBC article below a decent read

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/nov/4/curl-sandy-is-obamas-katrina-but-the-media-looks-a/
[URL]https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-20163776[/URL]

 

[Inqui]

Economy is better now but it had been recovering for years, tax cuts were a boost but trade war has hurt. Quantitative easing was huge. Look up the economic cycle. The numbers come from the same people but apparently the numbers magically turned correct after November 2016.

Real GDP (https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GDPC1)
Jobs (https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PAYEMS)
Nominal GDP (https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth - doesn't mean as much though)

Whack the 10-year stats on those charts and you can see where the economy bottomed out post-GFC and - like you say - the trends have been pretty consistent since then. QE's keeping the headline economic indicators afloat but is probably doing more than anything else to siphon money from the poor to the rich (which creates its own issues down the road) and is creating bubbles in the stock market and housing and so on and is undoubtedly contributing to the general mood of electoral anger. Trump's campaign talk was that the numbers don't reflect the situation on the ground and the indicators are all looking at the wrong things, but now his presidential talk is all about how great those same numbers are.

The other thing while I'm here is that presidents deserve almost none of the credit and blame they get for the economy (unilateral trade wars aside). A president oversees about 40% of the economy (https://data.oecd.org/gga/general-government-spending.htm) and most of that's administrative (who's going to abolish the Department of Defence?) given the actual spending levels are decided by the House. The one person who probably has the single biggest impact on the economy is the Fed chair. Anything with interest rates gets affected by the things he/she does. I've said all this several times though, so you can see why I hardly bother anymore.

One comment I'll make about Iran is that a lot gets made of the administration reining in Trump's worst impulses, but this is an area where Trump is reining in the administration's worst impulses. And he deserves a lot of credit for that. How John Bolton can have any kind of government job after his role in the unmitigated success of Iraq (and the ways it's making the world better to this day) is genuinely beyond me. The hawks in both countries seem to be spoiling for a fight, but the moderates in Iran including the president are losing ground (that's a whole other can of worms though) and Trump does deserve credit for telling his hawks to cool their jets.

 

[52520Andrew]

Blackface, as cringy as that is for me, is one thing. To have a noose AND friends dressed up as KKK members? Yea I am out on that. Disgusting.

Yeah can't really defend that

As for my thoughts on immigration, I fully support people trying to come into this country the right way and we should make it so that honest families, even those fleeing war or persecution from "shithole countries", can come here in search of better lives. My ancestors did the same and we turned out alright. Plus with the declining birth rate, immigration is key to keeping the population(and the economy) growing long term.

I'd also remove the limit for how many people can enter legally or at least increase it by a fairly large amount. If they are good people then we should be fine bringing them in. If we can make it so that people can get into this country and not have a million hoops to jump through, you remove the motivation for them to enter illegally and you can actually screen who is coming in. Because at the end of the day that is the big problem with illegal immigration, we don't know all that much about who is here and what their background is.

I think if we can do that, you can justify more border patrol and the wall because the only people trying to come in illegally would be those "bad hombres" and it would free up border patrol to focus on those people. I still don't think a wall is much more than a speed bump, this isn't Israel and there are hundreds of miles still to maintain. Plus most drugs coming into the country aren't via some guy backpacking through the desert so the wall won't really do much on that front.

 

[gtalk12]

Totally switching the subject here,

how do you feel about Blue Laws that regulate Car Dealerships to be closed on Sundays?

I have been in the car business for over 6 years and would like to hear your opinions on this matter.

 

[52520Andrew]

Totally switching the subject here,

how do you feel about Blue Laws that regulate Car Dealerships to be closed on Sundays?

I have been in the car business for over 6 years and would like to hear your opinions on this matter.

You probably know more about it than me. First thought is that I don't know why they need to be closed those days. Feel like it should be the business's decision.

 

[gtalk12]

You probably know more about it than me. First thought is that I don't know why they need to be closed those days. Feel like it should be the business's decision.

Moral and work life balance.

 

[52520Andrew]

Moral and work life balance.

Lots of other companies are open on Sunday though and why can't people take off during the week? Wouldn't Sunday be busier than Monday?

 

[flynismo]

Yeah can't really defend that

As for my thoughts on immigration, I fully support people trying to come into this country the right way and we should make it so that honest families, even those fleeing war or persecution from "shithole countries", can come here in search of better lives. My ancestors did the same and we turned out alright. Plus with the declining birth rate, immigration is key to keeping the population(and the economy) growing long term.

I'd also remove the limit for how many people can enter legally or at least increase it by a fairly large amount. If they are good people then we should be fine bringing them in. If we can make it so that people can get into this country and not have a million hoops to jump through, you remove the motivation for them to enter illegally and you can actually screen who is coming in. Because at the end of the day that is the big problem with illegal immigration, we don't know all that much about who is here and what their background is.

I think if we can do that, you can justify more border patrol and the wall because the only people trying to come in illegally would be those "bad hombres" and it would free up border patrol to focus on those people. I still don't think a wall is much more than a speed bump, this isn't Israel and there are hundreds of miles still to maintain. Plus most drugs coming into the country aren't via some guy backpacking through the desert so the wall won't really do much on that front.

I think the main point of the wall is to funnel the people towards specific points, particularly, ports of entry. It's also supposed to provide the BP agents with better security.
I think it's a common misconception that a lot of people have; the wall isn't meant to be the be all, end all. It's just another cog in the security system. A vital part, but still just a part of it.

 

[Oldfaithful]

I think the main point of the wall is to funnel the people towards specific points, particularly, ports of entry. It's also supposed to provide the BP agents with better security.
I think it's a common misconception that a lot of people have; the wall isn't meant to be the be all, end all. It's just another cog in the security system. A vital part, but still just a part of it.

As a guy who doesn’t want to put that kind of money into a wall, that’s the exact viewpoint most republicans actually have in the senate. House I can’t speak for. They want it more as a deterrent rather than an end all be all. How many people are going to truly try to scale it, and if you also put motion sensors there that gives BP time to respond and time to catch up.

I think Trump’s rhetoric is BS, but I fully support securing the border and putting a wall there as a PART of that. There are those who do believe(I won’t name names) that the wall solves everything. It’s only a part of it.

 

[Willbacker]

Totally switching the subject here,

how do you feel about Blue Laws that regulate Car Dealerships to be closed on Sundays?

I have been in the car business for over 6 years and would like to hear your opinions on this matter.

If they should be closed on Sunday then everybody should be closed. Maybe it has something to do with the title and liscensing. Seems odd.

 

[cobrajet]

Totally switching the subject here,

how do you feel about Blue Laws that regulate Car Dealerships to be closed on Sundays?

I have been in the car business for over 6 years and would like to hear your opinions on this matter.

I think in Maryland, only four counties (Charles, Prince George’s, Montgomery, and Howard) are permitted to sell automobiles on Sunday. I remember when so many businesses used to be closed on Sunday. I remember when I was in my teens, one Sunday I almost ran out of fuel on the way home after a long trip because I found some of the gas stations that I exited the highway for were closed. I finally found one that was open, but I was running on fumes. I look back now and think, I am glad most places were closed on Sunday, instead of being dragged somewhere by my parents, I was able to ride my bike to the park and play baseball with the guys. It was a great childhood. I liked the Blue Laws, the city was quite and it helped promote families to enjoy a day together. Sunday drives used to be pretty cool visiting relatives and friends that were also off of work. I remember on Sunday afternoons playing football on my front lawn hearing C—O—L—T—-S echoing in the distance. God I miss those days!!!!