Signings, Cuts, Trades

[rmcjacket23]

and he's not being paid 2x as much. Kickers last a very long time, but agree they do drop off.

Right. My point is if people think Tucker is worth more, how much more? The top like 3-4 kickers in the league are all pretty comparable to Tucker in terms of production, and they're all making pretty close to the same amount of money. Like if he made 20% more than everybody else, that's $1M a year.

 

[UPennChem]

That tucker post was clearly just appreciation for Tucker. Not serious about the financials

 

[JoeyFlex5]

I could hype myself up for Preston.

Weird I’ve literally never heard of him lol

 

[JoeyFlex5]

Ravens should’ve found a way to give tucker an extra 10m bonus just for that 66er

 

[RavensMania]

Right. My point is if people think Tucker is worth more, how much more? The top like 3-4 kickers in the league are all pretty comparable to Tucker in terms of production, and they're all making pretty close to the same amount of money. Like if he made 20% more than everybody else, that's $1M a year.

I don't know. Not many kickers can say they have missed 3 kicks 30-39 yards (94/97) or only 11 kicks between 40-49 yards (100/111). He's worth every penny that we are paying him and yes I understand you aren't arguing against the contract.

He's only missed 3 kicks under 40 yards. He is the epitome of consistency and greatness.

 

[Deebo813]

OK. Just not sure what that number is. As great as he is, he's not like 2x as good as the next best kicker.

As far as what he has accomplished, i think he is 2x better than the next.. counting up to last season i think he is

 

[rmcjacket23]

As far as what he has accomplished, i think he is 2x better than the next.. counting up to last season i think he is

I think statistically that would be hard to argue. 2x better means he's making like 2x amount of kicks, making double the high risk kicks, etc., which he's routinely not. He's high in all of those marks, and he's more consistently been at the top than just about anybody else, but 2x isn't really supportable logically or doesn't hold up to stats.
The difference between Tucker and some of the other really good kickers is usually 2, maybe 3, kicks per year. And that includes PATs as well.
The only thing that really separates him from others is the consistency for how long he's been doing it. There's a lot of guys that kick it well for 3-4 years and then have inconsistent years or fall off. He hasn't. That's what separates him.

 

[Simba]

I think the thing with Tucker is that yeah, $6M is top of market and he absolutely deserves that. But also if you had given him $8M a year, my reaction would be that's fine too. Not saying he should get it, but with how good and clutch he's been for us, it just FEELS like $6M is cheap.

 

[Deebo813]

I don't know. Not many kickers can say they have missed 3 kicks 30-39 yards (94/97) or only 11 kicks between 40-49 yards (100/111). He's worth every penny that we are paying him and yes I understand you aren't arguing against the contract.

He's only missed 3 kicks under 40 yards. He is the epitome of consistency and greatness.

Bruh no kicker right now is comparable to tucker

 

[Deebo813]

I think statistically that would be hard to argue. 2x better means he's making like 2x amount of kicks, making double the high risk kicks, etc., which he's routinely not. He's high in all of those marks, and he's more consistently been at the top than just about anybody else, but 2x isn't really supportable logically or doesn't hold up to stats.
The difference between Tucker and some of the other really good kickers is usually 2, maybe 3, kicks per year. And that includes PATs as well.
The only thing that really separates him from others is the consistency for how long he's been doing it. There's a lot of guys that kick it well for 3-4 years and then have inconsistent years or fall off. He hasn't. That's what separates him.

Statistically is actually easier to prove. The fact that he hasnt fallen off it what makes him 2x better lol. He is still kicking as good as those guys that kick great for 3-4yrs… not to mention he is in his 30s and we still are relying on him to kick game winning 60 yarders

 

[rmcjacket23]

Statistically is actually easier to prove. The fact that he hasnt fallen off it what makes him 2x better lol. He is still kicking as good as those guys that kick great for 3-4yrs… not to mention he is in his 30s and we still are relying on him to kick game winning 60 yarders

But you didn't prove anything statistically. You went qualitative instead of quantitative.
He's not 2x better because of longevity. Longevity is the reason he still gets a large paycheck, while others who were good for a year or two bounce around the league in tryouts and change teams every year.

He's twice as good as an average kicker, or a waiver wire add. He's not twice as good as Boswell, or Carlson, or Butker, or any of these guys that have been good for a few years now. His career may last longer than them, which is why he'll get paid more money and for longer, but that doesn't mean he's like double the player lol. Not even close.

 

[UPennChem]

Did the Tucker extension open up any room for us?

 

[RavensMania]

But you didn't prove anything statistically. You went qualitative instead of quantitative.
He's not 2x better because of longevity. Longevity is the reason he still gets a large paycheck, while others who were good for a year or two bounce around the league in tryouts and change teams every year.

He's twice as good as an average kicker, or a waiver wire add. He's not twice as good as Boswell, or Carlson, or Butker, or any of these guys that have been good for a few years now. His career may last longer than them, which is why he'll get paid more money and for longer, but that doesn't mean he's like double the player lol. Not even close.

and if you go down all of the years Tucker has kicked you won't ever find 65% fg made. That happened in 2018 when Boswell made 13 / 20 kicks or in 2019 when Daniel Carlson made 73% of his kicks (19 / 26). I'm not saying I'd pay him 2x's more, but no one is truly arguing that and I'm not sure why this is even being hashed out. Oh wait, I know why....

Justin Tucker is most likely going to go to the HOF as a kicker and only a couple kickers are in the HOF. That's enough said.

 

[airconteka]

It's really nothing to do with how much better Tucker is, it's an imperfect market and kickers are undervalued. Best he can hope for is to be the highest paid and he is 20% higher than the second highest which I am sure is significant compared to any other player group.

 

[Deebo813]

But you didn't prove anything statistically. You went qualitative instead of quantitative.
He's not 2x better because of longevity. Longevity is the reason he still gets a large paycheck, while others who were good for a year or two bounce around the league in tryouts and change teams every year.

He's twice as good as an average kicker, or a waiver wire add. He's not twice as good as Boswell, or Carlson, or Butker, or any of these guys that have been good for a few years now. His career may last longer than them, which is why he'll get paid more money and for longer, but that doesn't mean he's like double the player lol. Not even close.

I didnt go into detail cause i shouldnt have to. I feel like that should just be known. by the way, tucker makes everyone look avg.

 

[JO_75]

I think the thing with Tucker is that yeah, $6M is top of market and he absolutely deserves that. But also if you had given him $8M a year, my reaction would be that's fine too. Not saying he should get it, but with how good and clutch he's been for us, it just FEELS like $6M is cheap.

This is what I meant. Obviously today's NFL doesn't value kicking as much since most teams now go for it on 4th down even in FG range and despite having Tucker, we still go for it on 4th even when we know it's an easy 3 points. Just for everything Tucker has done with game winning field goals and how clutch he has been, definitely feels $6M is highway robbery.

 

[allblackraven]

I think the thing with Tucker is that yeah, $6M is top of market and he absolutely deserves that. But also if you had given him $8M a year, my reaction would be that's fine too. Not saying he should get it, but with how good and clutch he's been for us, it just FEELS like $6M is cheap.

It definitely is cheap, considering that he won plenty of games for us. Other kickers are considered good if they don't lose you a game.

 

[rmcjacket23]

It's really nothing to do with how much better Tucker is, it's an imperfect market and kickers are undervalued. Best he can hope for is to be the highest paid and he is 20% higher than the second highest which I am sure is significant compared to any other player group.

But I don't think they're undervalued at all. In fact its pretty much impossible to be undervalued when the entire market place is all paying players in the same range.
They're not getting the inflation-driven prices everybody else gets because a) they're kicking less often, b) they made PATs harder, which gives teams more of a reason to go for 2PC (and there's still too many teams who don't go for it enough) and c) a lot of the longer type FGs are about as mathematically a risk as going for it, depending on yardage.

 

[rmcjacket23]

I didnt go into detail cause i shouldnt have to. I feel like that should just be known. by the way, tucker makes everyone look avg.

No, he doesn't. He makes average kickers look average. He makes good kickers look average to people who ain't got no clue what they're talking about. That's who he makes look average.

 

[rmcjacket23]

and if you go down all of the years Tucker has kicked you won't ever find 65% fg made. That happened in 2018 when Boswell made 13 / 20 kicks or in 2019 when Daniel Carlson made 73% of his kicks (19 / 26). I'm not saying I'd pay him 2x's more, but no one is truly arguing that and I'm not sure why this is even being hashed out. Oh wait, I know why....

Justin Tucker is most likely going to go to the HOF as a kicker and only a couple kickers are in the HOF. That's enough said.

You'll have to ask the people in the room who think he's 2x better than everybody else why that's being hashed out. I can't go down that trip into la la land with you.
All I've done is agree with NFL teams and the Ravens in how they assess value of kickers and of Tucker, which is not really the kind of thing fans are qualified to argue with in the first place.