The General Front 7 Thread

[JoeyFlex5]

There are only 1st and 2nd team All Pro edge rushers which gives you 4. All Pro different than Pro Bowl

Many edge rushers fall under the LB group, like von, Alexander, mercilus, and I'm not sure which ones the others are.

So one LB and one DE on each side, first and second team, makes 8 total. Not sure how they can make it 9, I guess since linebackers are diverse groups they can include more than the typical amount of edge rushers and opt out of traditional linebackers.

 

[rossihunter2]

Jernigan will likely become a pro bowl level guy in Phillys scheme, still doesn't make it a bad trade for us. Keeping Jernigan instead of taking that deal means one thing: super bowl or bust. We weren't resigning him, no way, so if he doesn't contribute massively this one year resulting in a super bowl, and we passed on an opportunity to get a solid return, then we biffed it. I am always for getting a return on players that are on borrowed time, unless that player will help us win a super bowl, and let's face it, it's not happening this year

my only remaining issue with the trade is we essentially traded jernigan for wormley - the principle ive come around on but the player we got out of it im not sold on yet and probably wont be until he plays well for us

 

[Jacquouille]

my only remaining issue with the trade is we essentially traded jernigan for wormley - the principle ive come around on but the player we got out of it im not sold on yet and probably wont be until he plays well for us

Of course the jury is still out but I like Wormley better. I think he is more versatile and has more stamina then Jernigan. Plus I'd venture to stay he has more strength, length and heavier hands.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

my only remaining issue with the trade is we essentially traded jernigan for wormley - the principle ive come around on but the player we got out of it im not sold on yet and probably wont be until he plays well for us

People always talk about wormley having a high floor and low ceiling but I don't see it. I wasn't big on wormley really ever, but the low ceiling thing I can't agree with. He has great length, a grown mans body, and has similar if not better burst and closing speed than Jernigan, and also is less boneheaded and in much better shape, so we can probably expect him to at least come to camp In shape and not sucking wind by halftime every week.

He is not as shifty or powerful as Jernigan who was a real bully, he was powerful as hell, and had quick feet to work the inside, but wormley works the outside better, he counter moves very well, and closes in on the ball carrier with very surprising speed. His floor is a consistent contributor, his ceiling is probably not far from jernigans depending on what you value, if you value a guy who is more sound, durable, and smart, then wormleys ceiling may be higher, if you value sporadic stretches of big plays once every 2-3 weeks then you prefer Jernigan.

I liked Jernigan a lot, but thought the trade was a smart one, regardless of who we got.

 

[Willbacker]

Mack
Beasley
Clowney
Wake
Vernon
Graham
Alexander
Mercilus
Miller

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...ms-2016-complete-list-of-players-and-reaction

I can definitely see where you coming from since the 2nd team D seems to have like a 100 players on it lol. I guess they giving out participation trophies out now. At one time they didn't even have a 2nd team All Pro. A true All Pro is the best of the best at his position for that year which to me it means it should be just the 1st teamers. All Pro should be the highest honor.

Now with Judon he most definitely has the potential to be elite but he's gonna have to become a 3 down LB and play 85-90% of the snaps imo. I'm really excited about his future and I wouldn't mind seeing play more at the SLB position and take on the RT's ala Paul Kruger and let Suggs and Williams come off the edge on the blind side.

 

[Jacquouille]

There's one percent of me that believes ZDS can make an impact. He is horrid on the edge but a pretgy good interior rusher on passing downs. Maybe if he learns to set the edge he could follow the McPhee path we hoped.

 

[Sooky]

I have faith in the secondary it really is up to these guys. I am actually really afraid of teams running over us especially during the first of the season. I think losing Lawerence Guy will be a bigger blow than any of us will ever know. Not saying he is elite, but man was he reliable against the run and pretty solid against the pass.

 

[rossihunter2]

I have faith in the secondary it really is up to these guys. I am actually really afraid of teams running over us especially during the first of the season. I think losing Lawerence Guy will be a bigger blow than any of us will ever know. Not saying he is elite, but man was he reliable against the run and pretty solid against the pass.

So I went back over a load of this season to make sense of the offseason a bit and I finally understand the Williams (overpaying) move and Jernigan's trade and it's down to ironically the opposition we played

So often last year we'd be looking at 3 wr sets on 1st and 2nd down which meant we moved into a heavy nickel package with Brandon Williams at the 3tech which meant Jernigan was off the field, and Michael pierce coming in to play the nose and then Suggs on one edge and mostly McClellan on the other which means guy wasn't in and Jernigan wasn't in (probably why Ozzie was happy to not keep them)

The average result of a running play in this situation was around 2.5ypc (maybe less) which is incredibly good and I genuinely think that some of the fall off down the stretch might have been down to Michael pierce fading after the long year and obviously not having jimmy smith which meant leaving safety help outside and therefore not able to help in he box

So im certainly not worried in the context of the whole season in our run defence as long as our base 3-4 isn't a mess which I doubt it will be (but there's some leeway there with potentially two new starters setting the edge if we protect Suggs on early downs)

 

[Sooky]

So I went back over a load of this season to make sense of the offseason a bit and I finally understand the Williams (overpaying) move and Jernigan's trade and it's down to ironically the opposition we played

So often last year we'd be looking at 3 wr sets on 1st and 2nd down which meant we moved into a heavy nickel package with Brandon Williams at the 3tech which meant Jernigan was off the field, and Michael pierce coming in to play the nose and then Suggs on one edge and mostly McClellan on the other which means guy wasn't in and Jernigan wasn't in (probably why Ozzie was happy to not keep them)

The average result of a running play in this situation was around 2.5ypc (maybe less) which is incredibly good and I genuinely think that some of the fall off down the stretch might have been down to Michael pierce fading after the long year and obviously not having jimmy smith which meant leaving safety help outside and therefore not able to help in he box

So im certainly not worried in the context of the whole season in our run defence as long as our base 3-4 isn't a mess which I doubt it will be (but there's some leeway there with potentially two new starters setting the edge if we protect Suggs on early downs)

I also like them paying Williams because we know what we have with him every game. Very few times did he get ran over (the only time was in the last couple games when Jimmy Smith and Mosley I believe were both out which is huge to our run game.) Jernigan was off and on and there was no way the team was going to pay for him. They got as much value as possible. I think the team has seen just as much potential in Pierce as they had in Jernigan in the 3 years he was here. I know everyone is drooling over the idea of Pierce having a bunch of sacks, but losing Williams in a division with Bell, Crowell/Johnson, and the trio in Cincy would be a nightmare. The Ravens always have a shot beating the Steelers in the division just because they match up so well. The Steelers are your dream fantasy team, but when it comes down to match ups in the playoffs, the Ravens have the team that would likely go farther than the Steelers. I don't think the Steelers win another Super Bowl with Ben with his decline and we have already probably seen the best from Bell/Brown you can't do much better than what they already did.

I think the Ravens defense is top 5 next season if not 1. I have good faith just because I do think their secondary is the best right now. If we lose Weddle, Jefferson, or Jimmy Smith that definitely changes. The Ravens just need to start finding young pass rushers. I think if they have that figured out this season, the Ravens defense will be scary. Unfortunately every season you can almost guarantee an underperforming offense.

 

[rossihunter2]

I also like them paying Williams because we know what we have with him every game. Very few times did he get ran over (the only time was in the last couple games when Jimmy Smith and Mosley I believe were both out which is huge to our run game.) Jernigan was off and on and there was no way the team was going to pay for him. They got as much value as possible. I think the team has seen just as much potential in Pierce as they had in Jernigan in the 3 years he was here. I know everyone is drooling over the idea of Pierce having a bunch of sacks, but losing Williams in a division with Bell, Crowell/Johnson, and the trio in Cincy would be a nightmare. The Ravens always have a shot beating the Steelers in the division just because they match up so well. The Steelers are your dream fantasy team, but when it comes down to match ups in the playoffs, the Ravens have the team that would likely go farther than the Steelers. I don't think the Steelers win another Super Bowl with Ben with his decline and we have already probably seen the best from Bell/Brown you can't do much better than what they already did.

I think the Ravens defense is top 5 next season if not 1. I have good faith just because I do think their secondary is the best right now. If we lose Weddle, Jefferson, or Jimmy Smith that definitely changes. The Ravens just need to start finding young pass rushers. I think if they have that figured out this season, the Ravens defense will be scary. Unfortunately every season you can almost guarantee an underperforming offense.

the other thing about williams is he has an underrated first step quickness for a guy his size and a decent second move which i was surprised to see and having pierce come in and them play together allows williams more of a rushing opportunity from the 3tech - now he didnt have great rush production last year but that should hopefully improve with this alignment being more of a mainstay - especially with the wrs the steelers and bengals now have i expect us to be in nickel even more than last year - maybe even dime - albeit i think pierce and williams wont be together a lot on third downs - what we've been missing on 3rd down is a mcphee or mercilus (how he's used in that 5 man front in houston) with a rush linebacker lining up at the nose and rushing from there which i think we now might try and emulate with our improved secondary - we could legitimately try and have 5 rushers vs 5 blockers like houston does and use some of these young rushers and give them 1 on 1 all across the front

 

[RavensMania]

the other thing about williams is he has an underrated first step quickness for a guy his size and a decent second move which i was surprised to see and having pierce come in and them play together allows williams more of a rushing opportunity from the 3tech - now he didnt have great rush production last year but that should hopefully improve with this alignment being more of a mainstay - especially with the wrs the steelers and bengals now have i expect us to be in nickel even more than last year - maybe even dime - albeit i think pierce and williams wont be together a lot on third downs - what we've been missing on 3rd down is a mcphee or mercilus (how he's used in that 5 man front in houston) with a rush linebacker lining up at the nose and rushing from there which i think we now might try and emulate with our improved secondary - we could legitimately try and have 5 rushers vs 5 blockers like houston does and use some of these young rushers and give them 1 on 1 all across the front

Filmstudy did some research on BWill this season. His research revealed that when he was playing 3T is when he was at his at his worst. It will be interesting to see if he improves upon that this season...

 

[rossihunter2]

Filmstudy did some research on BWill this season. His research revealed that when he was playing 3T is when he was at his at his worst. It will be interesting to see if he improves upon that this season...

ill have to look that analysis up but i have to think that it's an alignment that works best for the team even if not for him individually and it's one that i think he will improve at individually given that he hadnt spent much of his career in the 3tech spot while ngata was here and jernigan would play the 3tech rather than the nose - it might be a case of genuinely not being used to the position yet (albeit i could be wrong) but just watching it back live he didnt feel like he was overmatched or ineffective in that spot

 

[Dom McRaven]

This is kinda random, but still on topic pertaining to the front 7: I'm kinda still in awe that we held PIT to only 14 points despite our pass-rush being mediocre and their o-line being top-5.

 

[Boldnpurpblack]

Whats up Y'all. Sorry for the prolonged absence but happy to be back.

This front 7 gonna have the perfect mix of vet savvy, big nasty up front, and relentless athleticism all around.

Correa, Kaufusi, and Bowser/TWill are the wildcards that could make this unit down right scary. And i have a feeling we'll have a better hit than fail ratio with those guys.

 

[SepticeyePoe]

Whats up Y'all. Sorry for the prolonged absence but happy to be back.

This front 7 gonna have the perfect mix of vet savvy, big nasty up front, and relentless athleticism all around.

Correa, Kaufusi, and Bowser/TWill are the wildcards that could make this unit down right scary. And i have a feeling we'll have a better hit than fail ratio with those guys.

Hey dude!

I'm excited to see all of them play together.

 

[Boldnpurpblack]

Hey dude!

I'm excited to see all of them play together.

Yea it'll be interesting to see how it all comes together and what the rotation will look like and how they're going to use different fronts in different situations.

Gut feeling Judon is gonna show out w/ double digit sacks. And if not he can have a McPhee like impact.

Also think Pierce is going to have a great year in an expanded role. Has shown a knack for run stops already and with more opportunity can hopefully bring an interior rush presence.

 

[Jacquouille]

Currently watching Houston vs FSU (2015 Bowl Game). How in the world do you wish to tell me Tyus Bowser can't rush the passer if you have seen this game?

 

[Sledge Hammer]

Whats up Y'all. Sorry for the prolonged absence but happy to be back.

This front 7 gonna have the perfect mix of vet savvy, big nasty up front, and relentless athleticism all around.

Correa, Kaufusi, and Bowser/TWill are the wildcards that could make this unit down right scary. And i have a feeling we'll have a better hit than fail ratio with those guys.

I don't think Correa is ever an NFL starter. Kaufusi the jury is out. If he becomes anything it will have to be From the 4-3 alignments. He isn't stout enough for the interior. And he wasn't athletic enough to play olb. Judon and Timmy are probably double digit edge rushers. Bowser has a lot to learn. A great athlete but very very raw. Needs moves and experience and maybe a little more size for the edge. And needs to build his instincts and playbook knowledge if he is to play ilb. He actually has the physical tools to excel at ilb if he can get the mental aspect side. Henry is a phenomenal athlete but he has to get a better feel for the interior, master some rush moves and build the entire mental aspect of an interior player. Very raw but is very gifted.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

whos the starting DE in our 34 in week 1? hell whats the starting lineup on the dl? i think the 5T is urbans job to lose, i think 3T is gonna come down to wormley and whoever looks more natural there between pierce and bwill.

what im really excited about though, is the possibility of a base 4-3 once suggs leaves. a DL of Judon, pierce, williams, and kaufusi/timmy, with bowser, mosley, and correa at LB sounds like a handful, and then jefferweddle both being versatile guys who can play up close should create a ton of confusion.

weddle--------- jefferson
Jimmy------------------Bowser----Mosley----Correa --------------------Carr/Humphrey
Judon - Pierce - Bwill - Kaufusi/Urban

fun base package

 

[Boldnpurpblack]

whos the starting DE in our 34 in week 1? hell whats the starting lineup on the dl? i think the 5T is urbans job to lose, i think 3T is gonna come down to wormley and whoever looks more natural there between pierce and bwill.

what im really excited about though, is the possibility of a base 4-3 once suggs leaves. a DL of Judon, pierce, williams, and kaufusi/timmy, with bowser, mosley, and correa at LB sounds like a handful, and then jefferweddle both being versatile guys who can play up close should create a ton of confusion.

weddle--------- jefferson
Jimmy------------------Bowser----Mosley----Correa --------------------Carr/Humphrey
Judon - Pierce - Bwill - Kaufusi/Urban

fun base package

I think its gonna be:

Weddle ----- Jefferson
Jimmy -------------------------- Suggs ------ Mosley ---------- Correa ----------- Judon ----------------------- Carr
Urban ------------Pierce/BWill----BWill/Pierce


Though I think more often than not we'll take off Urban and bring on Canady/Boykin. And in passing situations i think we'll use a lot of just 1 down lineman (Pierce/BWill) and use 5 stand up LB's. And we have a mix of guys w/ diverse skill sets that can make that fun.. like Boswer/Correa could easily flip 1 on the edge, 1 in the middle where then either could drop in coverage, blitz a gap, rush the edge, cover a flat/zone, etc... guys like Suggs, Judon, Zadarius, Urban, Kaufusi could all be stand up edge ushers or drop down with their hand in the dirt and stand back up again.

You can just move those guys all around.

But in terms of base personnel..... week 1.... i think thats what we're seeing.