The Random Thought Thread

[RavensMania]

1. Agree with the presnap motion, though I will say that I generally only find that to be effective with teams who have outstanding speed that needs to be covered. Brown forces that action, and Duvernay to an extent, but like motioning somebody like Boykin or Snead isn't really going to force much manipulation on defense.
2. I'm generally not a fan of moving the pocket that often. For starter, I don't think it benefits Lamar's skill sets in particular, and by definition, it cuts the field at least in half, if not more so. Lamar is at his best when he's attacking the middle of the field, with multiple options, and from the pocket (in my eyes). One of my critiques of him this year, at least in my eyes, is he's fleeing the pocket too quickly, scrambling after merely a second or two, and not always allowing the play to develop.
I do like RavensMania ideas with RB screens. We do so little of that its comical.

not only is it done rarely in our offense, it's been done rarely in this offense forever and it would absolutely slow down the blitz.

 

[Charm City]

1. Agree with the presnap motion, though I will say that I generally only find that to be effective with teams who have outstanding speed that needs to be covered. Brown forces that action, and Duvernay to an extent, but like motioning somebody like Boykin or Snead isn't really going to force much manipulation on defense.
2. I'm generally not a fan of moving the pocket that often. For starter, I don't think it benefits Lamar's skill sets in particular, and by definition, it cuts the field at least in half, if not more so. Lamar is at his best when he's attacking the middle of the field, with multiple options, and from the pocket (in my eyes). One of my critiques of him this year, at least in my eyes, is he's fleeing the pocket too quickly, scrambling after merely a second or two, and not always allowing the play to develop.
I do like RavensMania ideas with RB screens. We do so little of that its comical.

To your first point I agree with you, I was referring mainly to the motions that we have with Brown and Duvernay since a LB or safety can generally match the speed of Snead or anyone else on our offense.
Second, I really want us to move the pocket just so teams don't pin their ears back and overload the side that the mesh is facing. It seems like teams have figured out that as long as you overload that side you should have most of the options covered due to the sheer number of players you're committing. If we incorporate some RB screens or other misdirection plays in addition to the presnap motion and moving the pocket it may prevent teams from committing to the first read and open up some of our traditional run plays.

 

[rossihunter2]

Looking back at it now, do you guys think we should’ve taken Metcalf or Brown over Hollywood in the first?

maybe AJ Brown but not Metcalf - he's been great but he's not a great fit for the style of offence we've been running here the last 2 years - he benefits a lot from having the best deep ball thrower in the league passing him the ball

im happy with hollywood - he's killing DBs every week lamar's just not getting him the ball - he's had one drop on a big play that i'd have liked him to have but otherwise lamar's missed him when that connection hasnt been made

if only a couple more of those had hit, we wouldn't even be talking about this lol

 

[rossihunter2]

Yep Bowser was my guy. I'm not always a blame the coaches guy but I think they tried to mold him into too much off the bat. His strengths are zone coverage and rushing the passer and we spent the better portion of 2 years trying to make him this full, all-around guy. You started to see shades of them getting him back into a more natural role last year and now we're really letting him do what he does best. Never thought he'd be a 10+ sack guy but think he can push 8 while also being dominant in coverage.

bowser and judon have been so good in coverage they've made most of our LBs completely redundant on 3rd down

 

[rossihunter2]

While I don't think our playcalling has been great, I do have to ask the question...
What specifically about it is bad? Like I hear people say this a lot, but I'm watching this years games compared to last years, and I'm really not seeing many things that are dramatically different in terms of play calling.

I'm seeing significantly less designed runs by Lamar, which may have an impact, but I'm also seeing vastly inferior execution, especially on the offensive line, in the running game.

oh execution's been poor for sure but teams have been much better at gap exchanging against our running scheme and they're trying to force the give read to lamar on basically all the zone-read type looks which is why lamar's best runs have come on those inverted-veer type runs where the reads are switched around where the give read is actually the keep read with lamar running inside - obviously that's inherently going to create more contact with lamar than those outside runs where he's already on his way towards the sideline but teams are hard committing to stop that play which looked like the easiest 7+ yards in football last year

the passing game is mostly where i have a problem with the coaching - and it's not necessarily playcalling per se - more the general route combinations which have been predictable and not very creative and it doesnt feel like those designs complement the players we have on the roster

we've been endlessly creative in the run game the last 2 and a half years but our passing game has become stale - we were great running 4 verts against cover 3 last year on those empty plays but we've not seen anything similar this year in terms of beating coverage with scheme - ultimately you need your guys to win and execute but you can help them out with scheme a lot better than we have been creating space in the passing game

 

[rossihunter2]

1. Agree with the presnap motion, though I will say that I generally only find that to be effective with teams who have outstanding speed that needs to be covered. Brown forces that action, and Duvernay to an extent, but like motioning somebody like Boykin or Snead isn't really going to force much manipulation on defense.

last year it wasnt about manipulating defence - more about motioning snead across to create an extra blocker on that side and being able to seal on the outside

the motion we use isnt mostly about selling an end around it's mostly about a numbers game but teams know that's what we're doing so can adjust and we havent counter-adjusted

 

[Simba]

bowser and judon have been so good in coverage they've made most of our LBs completely redundant on 3rd down

That's a big thing that is missed when it comes to Judon in particular. Sure, he's not the greatest pure pass rusher in the world but the guy has a lot of others responsibilities and he's doing all of it pretty damn well. And that's where Bowser comes in and why I do think it's important to retain him, because the SLB spot here is pretty important to what we do defensively. I still think Bowser would make a damn good OTTO on a 4-3 team and we've been using him in that role somewhat this year, if not completely in name.

 

[Deebo813]

While I don't think our playcalling has been great, I do have to ask the question...
What specifically about it is bad? Like I hear people say this a lot, but I'm watching this years games compared to last years, and I'm really not seeing many things that are dramatically different in terms of play calling.

I'm seeing significantly less designed runs by Lamar, which may have an impact, but I'm also seeing vastly inferior execution, especially on the offensive line, in the running game.

Those playaction rollout calls where every pass catcher runs the same way which eventually ends up being a 2yrd dump off to the tight end needs to stop. I also feel like our playcalling is predictable and isnt creative as much. I understand we wanted to get boykin involved but after that 3rd game, i felt like it was time to get dunervay and proche more involved. Lets do more motion and not just with the tightends.. i would be okay if we tried everything and our offense still looked bad but imo we have yet to do that

 

[rossihunter2]

That's a big thing that is missed when it comes to Judon in particular. Sure, he's not the greatest pure pass rusher in the world but the guy has a lot of others responsibilities and he's doing all of it pretty damn well. And that's where Bowser comes in and why I do think it's important to retain him, because the SLB spot here is pretty important to what we do defensively. I still think Bowser would make a damn good OTTO on a 4-3 team and we've been using him in that role somewhat this year, if not completely in name.

he's a LB who has very few run responsibilities (albeit has been pretty good against the run when he's been in that situation) but who's asked to do all sorts of complicated zone drops from awkward spots while also being a threat to rush either stunting, creating space for someone who's stunting or winning around the edge

he and judon are similar but it's been really cool seeing how much Wink has put them on the field together at the same time next to each other and caused havoc for opposing QBs trying to identify who's coming and who's dropping because bowser's been awesome so far this year fake rushing even when he's dropping - sometimes he goes a whole 2 steps upfield into a rush before he drops and that can create overloads without rushing more than 4 or 5

some of wink's blitzes this year have been works of art - i looked at some of the texans ones in decent depth and the bengals game obviously all 5 starting DBs got a sack but there's normally at least 1 blitz call a game that i look at and go 'wow'

 

[JoeyFlex5]

do you guys think that maybe NOT making any moves for the offense is a vote of confidence from the FO and coaches that they can get on the right track? or was ngakoue just the only move that was out there for us to make?

 

[Simba]

do you guys think that maybe NOT making any moves for the offense is a vote of confidence from the FO and coaches that they can get on the right track? or was ngakoue just the only move that was out there for us to make?

I'd lean more toward the latter. On offense, OL and WR are the main areas of need. I don't see anyone offloading a starting quality OL at this point. WR or a pass catcher would be nice but none of what is reported to be available really moves the needle.

 

[Dom McRaven]

do you guys think that maybe NOT making any moves for the offense is a vote of confidence from the FO and coaches that they can get on the right track? or was ngakoue just the only move that was out there for us to make?

I'd lean more toward the latter. On offense, OL and WR are the main areas of need. I don't see anyone offloading a starting quality OL at this point. WR or a pass catcher would be nice but none of what is reported to be available really moves the needle.

That and POSSIBLY wanting to see if any of the younger guys like Duv and Proche deserve more snaps/playing time. Duv definitely deserves it.

 

[SepticeyePoe]

That and POSSIBLY wanting to see if any of the younger guys like Duv and Proche deserve more snaps/playing time. Duv definitely deserves it.

Given Harbaugh's reaction to drafting Duvernay, I wouldn't understand it if he doesn't start getting more involved in the offense.

 

[Deebo813]

Even though it looks like we have a 0% chance at beating kc, i think we can beat them lol. However, kc vs Tb in SB would prolly break all tv records

 

[JO_75]

It wasn't until late in the draft process this year when people started saying Burrow should refuse to play for the Bengals. The Jets sit 0-7, and already people are saying Trevor should return to Clemson in order to avoid the Jets. Peyton Manning "avoided" the Jets in 1997 so to speak by returning to Tennessee for his senior year then was drafted by the Colts and had a Hall of Fame Career. Of course we know about Elway and Eli, the only two times that a prospect refused to play for a team or forced a trade. What does everyone think of this?

 

[redrum52]

Has Tucker ever missed a game-winning fg?

 

[JoeyFlex5]

Has Tucker ever missed a game-winning fg?

Extra point, not fg.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

It wasn't until late in the draft process this year when people started saying Burrow should refuse to play for the Bengals. The Jets sit 0-7, and already people are saying Trevor should return to Clemson in order to avoid the Jets. Peyton Manning "avoided" the Jets in 1997 so to speak by returning to Tennessee for his senior year then was drafted by the Colts and had a Hall of Fame Career. Of course we know about Elway and Eli, the only two times that a prospect refused to play for a team or forced a trade. What does everyone think of this?

I think burrow made the right move not avoiding the bengals, they could be a problem in a few years with burrow as long as they avoid the John Ross and billy price type picks. The jets though..: idk man, they’re really bad, but then again Adam gase has A LOT to do with it

 

[RL52TheGreatest]

It wasn't until late in the draft process this year when people started saying Burrow should refuse to play for the Bengals. The Jets sit 0-7, and already people are saying Trevor should return to Clemson in order to avoid the Jets. Peyton Manning "avoided" the Jets in 1997 so to speak by returning to Tennessee for his senior year then was drafted by the Colts and had a Hall of Fame Career. Of course we know about Elway and Eli, the only two times that a prospect refused to play for a team or forced a trade. What does everyone think of this?

If Trevor stays in college for another year to avoid the possibility of getting drafted by a certain team then I have no problem with that. If, however, he enters the draft and tries to pull an Elway/Eli then I'll lose all respect for him. Once a team drafts you then you should be playing for that team regardless of how you feel about it; the draft isn't free agency where you can just pick where you want to go.

 

[RavensMania]

Even though it looks like we have a 0% chance at beating kc, i think we can beat them lol. However, kc vs Tb in SB would prolly break all tv records

Maybe due to the fact the entire New England area would be watching TB. I have family in New England due to my wife being from Massachusetts. Yes, I've converted her to become a Ravens fan. Anyway, one of her friends and a couple family members think the dynasty was more on TB than on BB. It certainly will be interesting to watch TB in TB and see how it plays out these next couple years.