Joe Flacco

[allblackraven]

Joe did have a good start this year showing some glimpses of what he can be. I just keep looking at Jax as a great matchup with still having a strong D and a good RB but running all the teams thru my head I don't see very many matchups that we can deal with. Elway could be a wildcard and maybe Tenn or dare I say Cincy but if we could just get 2 teams that do get enamored I'm thinking we could get a 2nd or 3rd.

Yep, he did but every year he has few good games, few bad ones and the rest is meh. I'd expect more for a draft pick and close to $20M price tag.

QB market is much different than last year, teams desperate for a good starter will fight over Foles and there doesn't seem to be too many desperate teams around.

 

[allblackraven]

He did start well this season. I suppose you could make an argument that when the OL blocked well and the receivers caught the ball he looked great. I think the early games showed us the QB Joe was and then he just lost it. Maybe it was the hits, so if he goes somewhere I can see him hoping for a better OL and thinking they can turn him around. Denver makes the most sense with the Kubiak connection, but I don't know how true or false that narrative is. They do have some decent draft stock, so it can happen.

Not sure Joe gives them more of an advantage over Keenum, who already knows the players around him and seems a safer option to transition to draft pick in 2020.

 

[DeVito52]

Yep, he did but every year he has few good games, few bad ones and the rest is meh. I'd expect more for a draft pick and close to $20M price tag.

QB market is much different than last year, teams desperate for a good starter will fight over Foles and there doesn't seem to be too many desperate teams around.

I think you mean fight over wentz, when 2x SB MVP nick foles wins the starting job

 

[allblackraven]

I think you mean fight over wentz, when 2x SB MVP nick foles wins the starting job

Lol, you never know.

 

[Grim]

Joe did have a good start this year showing some glimpses of what he can be. I just keep looking at Jax as a great matchup with still having a strong D and a good RB but running all the teams thru my head I don't see very many matchups that we can deal with. Elway could be a wildcard and maybe Tenn or dare I say Cincy but if we could just get 2 teams that do get enamored I'm thinking we could get a 2nd or 3rd.

Let’s look at the potential suitors:

TEN: I’m not sure TEN wants to move on from Marcus who costs $20M but Joe could be an option. They have the cap space ~$37M, OL, defense (Pees knows Joe for whatever that’s worth), WR.

DEN: they have the coaching connection with Kubiak, a new coach coming, a good defense, and cap ~$37M. They have Keenum under contract for $18M and may want to stick with him, but I think Joe is better at roughly the same price so that could be a factor.

WAS: lost their starter in Alex Smith maybe for good and he’s getting paid $15M and Eagles won’t be trading them Foles, have a good OL and defense but not much cap ~$17M.

MIA: don’t have much cap ~$13M, but have Tannehill costs $18M and hasn’t done much and a new coach and could be looking for a new QB or looking to improve him as a QB. Kinda have an OL.

TB: new coach who has an offense that fits but seem to be looking to fix Winston at $20M, limited cap ~$8M, good OL. I find this unlikely.

JAX: decent defense that could be great, over the cap by ~$7M so limited flexibility, need a QB due to major controversy at QB with Bortles under contract for $16M.

Competition: includes Sam “Rasputin” Bradford, Tyrod Taylor, Teddy Bridgewater, and Eagles Nick Foles, or one of the guys listed above who could be cut to clear up cap sans Alex Smith. I don’t think Taylor will be looked at as a starter this time, so I kinda remove him from this. I also think NYG draft a QB, so I didn’t include them because Eli to Joe is lateral movement and we want escalation. I am removing TB because I think they’re committed to Winston.

So that leaves JAX, MIA, & WAS as teams who could use a QB but have limited cap that they can clear by making some moves. It all depends on whether these teams think they are in win-now mode or not because otherwise you stick it out for next year. That’s why I see DEN, WAS, & JAX as our likeliest suitors. Problem with JAX & WAS is if you’re in win now mode you don’t want to cut a bunch of core guys to get Joe under the cap, which is why they would pay the heaviest price because we would likely have to absorb a chunk of Joe’s salary a la Eugene Monroe deal. Those cap figures are before accounting for rookies.

TLDR, it’s tricky to figure out what’ll happen with Joe but WAS, DEN, & JAX are our likeliest partners unless TEN is done with Mariota. Joe and Marcus are extremely different QB so you don’t get Joe if you are undecided on Mariota.

 

[Grim]

Not sure Joe gives them more of an advantage over Keenum, who already knows the players around him and seems a safer option to transition to draft pick in 2020.

The only advantage is I think Joe has the potential to be better than Keenum and Kubiak knows Joe and knows Keenum but I think he’s choose Joe if he had to decide but the injuries and stuff complicate it. Joe’s value and connections are hard to decide because he does face value but how many teams and what that value is remains a mystery. I mean, he could fetch as high as a 2nd or as low as a 4th IMO.

 

[rossihunter2]

Let’s look at the potential suitors:

TEN: I’m not sure TEN wants to move on from Marcus who costs $20M but Joe could be an option. They have the cap space ~$37M, OL, defense (Pees knows Joe for whatever that’s worth), WR.

DEN: they have the coaching connection with Kubiak, a new coach coming, a good defense, and cap ~$37M. They have Keenum under contract for $18M and may want to stick with him, but I think Joe is better at roughly the same price so that could be a factor.

WAS: lost their starter in Alex Smith maybe for good and he’s getting paid $15M and Eagles won’t be trading them Foles, have a good OL and defense but not much cap ~$17M.

MIA: don’t have much cap ~$13M, but have Tannehill costs $18M and hasn’t done much and a new coach and could be looking for a new QB or looking to improve him as a QB. Kinda have an OL.

TB: new coach who has an offense that fits but seem to be looking to fix Winston at $20M, limited cap ~$8M, good OL. I find this unlikely.

JAX: decent defense that could be great, over the cap by ~$7M so limited flexibility, need a QB due to major controversy at QB with Bortles under contract for $16M.

Competition: includes Sam “Rasputin” Bradford, Tyrod Taylor, Teddy Bridgewater, and Eagles Nick Foles, or one of the guys listed above who could be cut to clear up cap sans Alex Smith. I don’t think Taylor will be looked at as a starter this time, so I kinda remove him from this. I also think NYG draft a QB, so I didn’t include them because Eli to Joe is lateral movement and we want escalation. I am removing TB because I think they’re committed to Winston.

So that leaves JAX, MIA, & WAS as teams who could use a QB but have limited cap that they can clear by making some moves. It all depends on whether these teams think they are in win-now mode or not because otherwise you stick it out for next year. That’s why I see DEN, WAS, & JAX as our likeliest suitors. Problem with JAX & WAS is if you’re in win now mode you don’t want to cut a bunch of core guys to get Joe under the cap, which is why they would pay the heaviest price because we would likely have to absorb a chunk of Joe’s salary a la Eugene Monroe deal. Those cap figures are before accounting for rookies.

TLDR, it’s tricky to figure out what’ll happen with Joe but WAS, DEN, & JAX are our likeliest partners unless TEN is done with Mariota. Joe and Marcus are extremely different QB so you don’t get Joe if you are undecided on Mariota.

for me i think it's denver, jacksonville or miami

- Denver: getting joe and cutting keenum only costs them 7.5m and 10m dead cap for a better qb with proven success under the purview of their new (or old) OC - if they want him the cost is not prohibitive if they think he's a clear upgrade and there's good reason to think they'd be into it
- Jacksonville: they might not have the cap room because of all the dead money they have to eat on bortles contract if they want to get rid of him and you've got to think they want to draft someone but they also have to know that they cant move forward with either bortles or kessler and they cant rely on a prospect being there come draft time so joe's in play but I think they might try the Browns route of getting a guy like Tyrod at a reasonable price and then hoping to draft their guy
- Miami: it's a bad qb class - that's the only reason they'd ever be in range to pick up a qb this year and they need someone in the interim and there's no way i see tannehill on the roster next year - i could see joe being an attractive fit for them but a lot will depend on who the dolphins get to run their offence

 

[RavensMania]

Let’s look at the potential suitors:

TEN: I’m not sure TEN wants to move on from Marcus who costs $20M but Joe could be an option. They have the cap space ~$37M, OL, defense (Pees knows Joe for whatever that’s worth), WR.

DEN: they have the coaching connection with Kubiak, a new coach coming, a good defense, and cap ~$37M. They have Keenum under contract for $18M and may want to stick with him, but I think Joe is better at roughly the same price so that could be a factor.

WAS: lost their starter in Alex Smith maybe for good and he’s getting paid $15M and Eagles won’t be trading them Foles, have a good OL and defense but not much cap ~$17M.

MIA: don’t have much cap ~$13M, but have Tannehill costs $18M and hasn’t done much and a new coach and could be looking for a new QB or looking to improve him as a QB. Kinda have an OL.

TB: new coach who has an offense that fits but seem to be looking to fix Winston at $20M, limited cap ~$8M, good OL. I find this unlikely.

JAX: decent defense that could be great, over the cap by ~$7M so limited flexibility, need a QB due to major controversy at QB with Bortles under contract for $16M.

Competition: includes Sam “Rasputin” Bradford, Tyrod Taylor, Teddy Bridgewater, and Eagles Nick Foles, or one of the guys listed above who could be cut to clear up cap sans Alex Smith. I don’t think Taylor will be looked at as a starter this time, so I kinda remove him from this. I also think NYG draft a QB, so I didn’t include them because Eli to Joe is lateral movement and we want escalation. I am removing TB because I think they’re committed to Winston.

So that leaves JAX, MIA, & WAS as teams who could use a QB but have limited cap that they can clear by making some moves. It all depends on whether these teams think they are in win-now mode or not because otherwise you stick it out for next year. That’s why I see DEN, WAS, & JAX as our likeliest suitors. Problem with JAX & WAS is if you’re in win now mode you don’t want to cut a bunch of core guys to get Joe under the cap, which is why they would pay the heaviest price because we would likely have to absorb a chunk of Joe’s salary a la Eugene Monroe deal. Those cap figures are before accounting for rookies.

TLDR, it’s tricky to figure out what’ll happen with Joe but WAS, DEN, & JAX are our likeliest partners unless TEN is done with Mariota. Joe and Marcus are extremely different QB so you don’t get Joe if you are undecided on Mariota.

Denver can clear 11m in cap space while the skins would have to restructure Smiths contract to 1m salary and the rest bonus to save money on the cap. This would allow them to afford Flacco and make other moves. The reason they can’t outright cut Smith is that his salary is guaranteed through 2019 and If he is cut due to injury his 2020 salary becomes guaranteed.

 

[Grim]

for me i think it's denver, jacksonville or miami

- Denver: getting joe and cutting keenum only costs them 7.5m and 10m dead cap for a better qb with proven success under the purview of their new (or old) OC - if they want him the cost is not prohibitive if they think he's a clear upgrade and there's good reason to think they'd be into it
- Jacksonville: they might not have the cap room because of all the dead money they have to eat on bortles contract if they want to get rid of him and you've got to think they want to draft someone but they also have to know that they cant move forward with either bortles or kessler and they cant rely on a prospect being there come draft time so joe's in play but I think they might try the Browns route of getting a guy like Tyrod at a reasonable price and then hoping to draft their guy
- Miami: it's a bad qb class - that's the only reason they'd ever be in range to pick up a qb this year and they need someone in the interim and there's no way i see tannehill on the roster next year - i could see joe being an attractive fit for them but a lot will depend on who the dolphins get to run their offence

I can see MIA it just depends on the next HC. They have 13M but can clear a nice chunk if they cut Ryan so they could be at $26M due to the addition of $13M from cutting Ryan. It’s doable but tight. The question is if they are in win-now, and they may see NE as weakening and this is their opportunity to make a splash before Darnold or Allen amounts to something/nothing.

Denver can clear 11m in cap space while the skins would have to restructure Smiths contract to 1m salary and the rest bonus to save money on the cap. This would allow them to afford Flacco and make other moves. The reason they can’t outright cut Smith is that his salary is guaranteed through 2019 and If he is cut due to injury his 2020 salary becomes guaranteed.

Yeah not much question that DEN is okay with cap. That’s the first I heard on the potential Smith restructure but that’s a good ideal. It’s definitely a possibility.

 

[RavensMania]

I can see MIA it just depends on the next HC. They have 13M but can clear a nice chunk if they cut Ryan so they could be at $26M due to the addition of $13M from cutting Ryan. It’s doable but tight. The question is if they are in win-now, and they may see NE as weakening and this is their opportunity to make a splash before Darnold or Allen amounts to something/nothing.


Yeah not much question that DEN is okay with cap. That’s the first I heard on the potential Smith restructure but that’s a good ideal. It’s definitely a possibility.

Believe it was from an over the cap article

https://overthecap.com/the-redskins-options-with-alex-smith/

Being with the skins allows him to be behind a good OL, when healthy, and not be too far from home.

 

[allblackraven]

I can see MIA it just depends on the next HC. They have 13M but can clear a nice chunk if they cut Ryan so they could be at $26M due to the addition of $13M from cutting Ryan. It’s doable but tight. The question is if they are in win-now, and they may see NE as weakening and this is their opportunity to make a splash before Darnold or Allen amounts to something/nothing.


Yeah not much question that DEN is okay with cap. That’s the first I heard on the potential Smith restructure but that’s a good ideal. It’s definitely a possibility.

Dolphins next coach seems to be Chris Kris Richard.

 

[BloodRaven]

What can we get for him realistically? Hopefully we can get rid of him soon in the offseason

 

[RavensMania]

Dolphins next coach seems to be Chris Kris Richard.

fixed it

 

[arnie_uk]

On a side not. An injury like smith has, there should bw some sort of rule that his cap hit gets removed from the equation some how

 

[Grim]

On a side not. An injury like smith has, there should bw some sort of rule that his cap hit gets removed from the equation some how

I agree. It’s simply unfair for any team to be impacted by something totally out of the team’s control. This is a good example of that, especially since it’s the first year after signing the extension and happened the same year.

 

[rossihunter2]

I agree. It’s simply unfair for any team to be impacted by something totally out of the team’s control. This is a good example of that, especially since it’s the first year after signing the extension and happened the same year.

In English premiership rugby union they have a salary cap but can apply for cap relief when facing tons of injuries

With the NFL having an I/R and PUP list that would make applying for cap relief even easier if the NFL wanted to go that route

 

[RavensMania]

On a side not. An injury like smith has, there should bw some sort of rule that his cap hit gets removed from the equation some how

this type of contract is not unusual. yes i agree, there should be some way the nfl allows for cap relief, but not in this contract.

 

[RavensMania]

In English premiership rugby union they have a salary cap but can apply for cap relief when facing tons of injuries

With the NFL having an I/R and PUP list that would make applying for cap relief even easier if the NFL wanted to go that route

maybe a team would be able to put one player on such IR a season to save on cap space.

a player that is placed on IR could be moved to IR-cap relief at the beginning of the league every season.

 

[rossihunter2]

maybe a team would be able to put one player on such IR a season to save on cap space.

a player that is placed on IR could be moved to IR-cap relief at the beginning of the league every season.

I think the application element is important in it not being abused - teams don’t just get a free extra contract for I/r - they get cap relief if they are up against the cap and can’t get a replacement at the position

You know the nflpa would support it though because it means potentially 32 larger contracts per year

 

[RavensMania]

I think the application element is important in it not being abused - teams don’t just get a free extra contract for I/r - they get cap relief if they are up against the cap and can’t get a replacement at the position

You know the nflpa would support it though because it means potentially 32 larger contracts per year

i don't think it would be fair to have only teams that are up against the cap. i think it should be based on certain types of injures that are going to keep a player out for over a year and cost over a certain amount of money.


there does need to be some limit on how they are used.