The Defence, The Offence and The Passing Game

[RavensMania]

Huh? Practiced twice? Played on one leg?

1. How much practicing do you think players are actually doing mid-season? At least three days a week, they're not even wearing pads (Monday, Tuesday, Saturday), and the other days they're having little to no physical contact with each other, and are largely just installing the gameplan, doing walkthroughs, doing some conditioning, and maybe getting some reps in. Pretty much anybody who's been in the league for more than 3-4 years is getting AT LEAST one of those days off too.
Ronnie Stanley basically hasn't taken a practice rep in a month, and likely won't for the rest of the season. Marshal Yanda took like no practice reps for like 3 straight years because he played with torn muscles for the entire season.
Suddenly, practicing for two days doesn't sound so bad. Its the norm for many players in mid-October during a football season.
2. Played with one leg? How about no. How about he had an injury that he was perfectly fine to practice with. He's no more banged up than the dozens of other football players who are all playing hurt this time of year. That includes the guys that block for him, and the guys he's playing against.

Not only are you dramatically overvaluing the practice time of a QB who hasn't missed any snaps due to injury this year, and couldn't possibly be classified as "needing the reps", but you're also dramatically overvaluing his injury, which literally nobody has suggested impacted his performance. Especially when you consider that much of his performance issues from this particular game were on the mental side, not the physical side.

AND... what I'm seeing on film isn't a one week problem. So what was his excuse against Washington or KC when he had similar issues?

Like I said already... I'm pretty much past the regular season at this point. We can sleep walk to the playoffs, and in some cases, it feels like we have been. I'm looking for indicators on what's going to happen when we play Tennessee, or Buffalo, or Pittsburgh, or KC, or NE, in the playoffs. Luckily, I'll get to see us play most of those teams beforehand anyway.

I'm going to have to disagree with this, especially in a year we had a shortened offseason with no OTAs no preseason games. Lamar needs to practice as much as he can. He needs to have chemistry with his receivers and it's not true. Also not sure where you are getting information regarding Stanley not taking a practice rep for a month.

Practice is important for every position, but most important for a QB and Lamar will be the 1st to admit it.

 

[rossihunter2]

probably not. Up to this point, I believe James Urban has been huge for Lamar.

I was saying that with regard to that hypothetical situation that was mentioned that Lamar was looking like trash in practice which by all accounts has not been the case

 

[RavensMania]

I was saying that with regard to that hypothetical situation that was mentioned that Lamar was looking like trash in practice which by all accounts has not been the case

got it, thank you for clarifying.

 

[rmcjacket23]

I'm going to have to disagree with this, especially in a year we had a shortened offseason with no OTAs no preseason games. Lamar needs to practice as much as he can. He needs to have chemistry with his receivers and it's not true. Also not sure where you are getting information regarding Stanley not taking a practice rep for a month.

Practice is important for every position, but most important for a QB and Lamar will be the 1st to admit it.

1. Do you think chemistry with his receivers is the problem? I don't. I think not throwing to the correct receiver, who is open, within the structure of the offense, is the problem. And I think ball placement/accuracy is partially a problem. I think the former requires almost no practice time to improve on. In fact, it really requires more film study and game prep.
2. I was half exaggerating on Ronnie Stanley, though not really...
Week 1: Practiced in full all week
Week 2: DNP Wednesday, LP Thursday, FP Friday
Week 3: Practiced in full all week
Week 4: LP Wednesday, DNP Thursday and Friday, and did not play on Sunday
Week 5: LP Wednesday and Thursday, FP Friday

So the three weeks where he was actually marked as "injured", he practiced in full on 2 of the 9 days eligible, did not practice at all on 3 of the 9 days eligible, and was limited on the other 4.

Limited practice effectively equates to a player just doing individual drills off to the side, and not really participating in the team portions of practices.

So you're talking about a guy who's essentially done a "full practice", with the team, on 2 total days of the 3 weeks he was on the injury report.

I would expect that to be the norm going forward. He's only going to get more injuries, and the kinds of injuries these are aren't the kinds of injuries that just heal during the season. They stay the same or get worse, and then they rehab or have surgery after the season.

 

[cdp]

1. Do you think chemistry with his receivers is the problem? I don't. I think not throwing to the correct receiver, who is open, within the structure of the offense, is the problem. And I think ball placement/accuracy is partially a problem. I think the former requires almost no practice time to improve on. In fact, it really requires more film study and game prep.
2. I was half exaggerating on Ronnie Stanley, though not really...
Week 1: Practiced in full all week
Week 2: DNP Wednesday, LP Thursday, FP Friday
Week 3: Practiced in full all week
Week 4: LP Wednesday, DNP Thursday and Friday, and did not play on Sunday
Week 5: LP Wednesday and Thursday, FP Friday

So the three weeks where he was actually marked as "injured", he practiced in full on 2 of the 9 days eligible, did not practice at all on 3 of the 9 days eligible, and was limited on the other 4.

Limited practice effectively equates to a player just doing individual drills off to the side, and not really participating in the team portions of practices.

So you're talking about a guy who's essentially done a "full practice", with the team, on 2 total days of the 3 weeks he was on the injury report.

I would expect that to be the norm going forward. He's only going to get more injuries, and the kinds of injuries these are aren't the kinds of injuries that just heal during the season. They stay the same or get worse, and then they rehab or have surgery after the season.

How about the throw to M.Brown into the endzone? Throw was on the money but hollywood couldn't haul it in. Receivers and Lamar have to clean up their game. i

 

[Sandtown]

Honestly when it comes to Greg Roman passing concepts you have to expect more especially with David Culley as his passing coordinator. Not only that but he has guys like James Urban, Bobby Engram, and etc that he could possibly lean on for ideas. I don't think the passing game woes in it self is entirely on Greg Roman but it shouldn't be hard for it to be a bit creative unless nobody on the coaching staff really can contribute good /creative ideas at all.

 

[RavensMania]

 

[rmcjacket23]

How about the throw to M.Brown into the endzone? Throw was on the money but hollywood couldn't haul it in. Receivers and Lamar have to clean up their game. i

That's not a chemistry issue. That's a Pro receiver not catching a pass that he has been catching since high school.

Chemistry involves timing of routes, QBs understanding how and when receivers make breaks on the ball, what their limitations are, etc.

That throw didn't qualify. That throw qualified as a Pro QB putting the ball in a place where a Pro receiver should catch it and he didn't. Its not chemistry. Its just a mistake and failure to execute.

 

[purp]

Huh? Practiced twice? Played on one leg?

1. How much practicing do you think players are actually doing mid-season? At least three days a week, they're not even wearing pads (Monday, Tuesday, Saturday), and the other days they're having little to no physical contact with each other, and are largely just installing the gameplan, doing walkthroughs, doing some conditioning, and maybe getting some reps in. Pretty much anybody who's been in the league for more than 3-4 years is getting AT LEAST one of those days off too.
Ronnie Stanley basically hasn't taken a practice rep in a month, and likely won't for the rest of the season. Marshal Yanda took like no practice reps for like 3 straight years because he played with torn muscles for the entire season.
Suddenly, practicing for two days doesn't sound so bad. Its the norm for many players in mid-October during a football season.
2. Played with one leg? How about no. How about he had an injury that he was perfectly fine to practice with. He's no more banged up than the dozens of other football players who are all playing hurt this time of year. That includes the guys that block for him, and the guys he's playing against.

Not only are you dramatically overvaluing the practice time of a QB who hasn't missed any snaps due to injury this year, and couldn't possibly be classified as "needing the reps", but you're also dramatically overvaluing his injury, which literally nobody has suggested impacted his performance. Especially when you consider that much of his performance issues from this particular game were on the mental side, not the physical side.

AND... what I'm seeing on film isn't a one week problem. So what was his excuse against Washington or KC when he had similar issues?

Like I said already... I'm pretty much past the regular season at this point. We can sleep walk to the playoffs, and in some cases, it feels like we have been. I'm looking for indicators on what's going to happen when we play Tennessee, or Buffalo, or Pittsburgh, or KC, or NE, in the playoffs. Luckily, I'll get to see us play most of those teams beforehand anyway.

Haha cool man. Again, I'm just talking about my personal preferences.

I certainly agree that Lamar still has flaws that could hold this team back from winning the super bowl. I'm just not...as outraged as you and others about the fact that those flaws exist in my 23 year old, reigning MVP, 23-6, starting quarterback.

"I'm pretty much past the regular season."

Ok...then why watch?

 

[rmcjacket23]

Haha cool man. Again, I'm just talking about my personal preferences.

I certainly agree that Lamar still has flaws that could hold this team back from winning the super bowl. I'm just not...as outraged as you and others about the fact that those flaws exist in my 23 year old, reigning MVP, 23-6, starting quarterback.

"I'm pretty much past the regular season."

Ok...then why watch?

For the same reason I watch any other game... because its football, and I enjoy it. I don't watch it to be impressed by blowing out a team that we're supposed to blow out and by beating teams that aren't close to sniffing January football.

I watch the regular season to gauge what my expectations should be for the postseason. If we lose to every contending team we play this year (which we won't), then my expectations will be low. If we blow all of them out, then my expectations will be high.

I'm not outraged by the flaws. But an MVP award only matters to the one person that gets it. Lombardi trophies are shared by hundreds of people who worked hard to make it happen. I'm interested in the latter, not the former.

 

[RavensMania]

1. Do you think chemistry with his receivers is the problem? I don't. I think not throwing to the correct receiver, who is open, within the structure of the offense, is the problem. And I think ball placement/accuracy is partially a problem. I think the former requires almost no practice time to improve on. In fact, it really requires more film study and game prep.
2. I was half exaggerating on Ronnie Stanley, though not really...
Week 1: Practiced in full all week
Week 2: DNP Wednesday, LP Thursday, FP Friday
Week 3: Practiced in full all week
Week 4: LP Wednesday, DNP Thursday and Friday, and did not play on Sunday
Week 5: LP Wednesday and Thursday, FP Friday

So the three weeks where he was actually marked as "injured", he practiced in full on 2 of the 9 days eligible, did not practice at all on 3 of the 9 days eligible, and was limited on the other 4.

Limited practice effectively equates to a player just doing individual drills off to the side, and not really participating in the team portions of practices.

So you're talking about a guy who's essentially done a "full practice", with the team, on 2 total days of the 3 weeks he was on the injury report.

I would expect that to be the norm going forward. He's only going to get more injuries, and the kinds of injuries these are aren't the kinds of injuries that just heal during the season. They stay the same or get worse, and then they rehab or have surgery after the season.

I didn't deny the Stanley one, because I knew he had been injured and limited. Yes, I believe chemistry is a good part of it and of course film study is just as important if not more, but I do believe Lamar is doing the film study and game prep. That being said, practice is part of game prep.

 

[rossihunter2]

So the three weeks where he was actually marked as "injured", he practiced in full on 2 of the 9 days eligible, did not practice at all on 3 of the 9 days eligible, and was limited on the other 4.

and those 2 full practices were friday practices which are the walkthroughs

 

[rossihunter2]

How about the throw to M.Brown into the endzone? Throw was on the money but hollywood couldn't haul it in. Receivers and Lamar have to clean up their game. i

it is funny how different the narrative of this game would have been (in terms of the offence) if hollywood had made that catch

we'd be talking about how even while not looking their best the offence still made explosive plays, about how duvernay was potentially emerging as another dangerous weapon to add to our existing top 2 etc.

rather than worrying about who our number 3 was we'd be talking about how good our top 2 are

 

[rossihunter2]

I didn't deny the Stanley one, because I knew he had been injured and limited. Yes, I believe chemistry is a good part of it and of course film study is just as important if not more, but I do believe Lamar is doing the film study and game prep. That being said, practice is part of game prep.

and its been said many times by coaches from lamar's past that he gets in a rhythm and when he is in rhythm it's important for him to stay in rhythm which comes from just keeping on going

 

[RL52TheGreatest]

That's not a chemistry issue. That's a Pro receiver not catching a pass that he has been catching since high school.

Chemistry involves timing of routes, QBs understanding how and when receivers make breaks on the ball, what their limitations are, etc.

That throw didn't qualify. That throw qualified as a Pro QB putting the ball in a place where a Pro receiver should catch it and he didn't. Its not chemistry. Its just a mistake and failure to execute.

Didn't one of the Bengals defenders get his hand in there at the last second to disrupt that catch? I mean, Hollywood should have caught it regardless, but it was a good defensive play IIRC.

 

[SepticeyePoe]

Didn't one of the Bengals defenders get his hand in there at the last second to disrupt that catch? I mean, Hollywood should have caught it regardless, but it was a good defensive play IIRC.

I remember the commentators pointing out the safety on that play.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Didn't one of the Bengals defenders get his hand in there at the last second to disrupt that catch? I mean, Hollywood should have caught it regardless, but it was a good defensive play IIRC.

I'd have to go back and watch the film. In real time, it seemed more like the Safety got his hand in the passing lane when the ball was en route, but didn't necessarily knock it away. May have thrown Hollywood off a bit, but I'd still expect him to make that catch.

 

[rossihunter2]

I remember the commentators pointing out the safety on that play.

i dont think they actually disrupted the ball - they got themselves in the way and vision of brown - it clearly wasnt an easy catch but im pretty sure it didnt get deviated from its path

 

[rossihunter2]

been watching madubuike (obviously) and while he caught my eye, brandon williams might have had his best game in years as a raven (not that he's been bad) - but he looked athletic, violent, dominant against the Bengals - just looked more threatening than I can remember for a while

he also played a lot more on 3rd down than I was expecting (possibly because Madubuike took lots of DT snaps on 1st and 2nd down - sometimes they played together at the same time but mostly not - Madubuike I dont think saw a single 3rd down against the Bengals)

 

[rossihunter2]

side note: the front 7 is really starting to gel...

Judon playing well
Bowser's been excellent
Ferguson finding himself a role and earning more snaps
Brandon Williams play his best football in a while
Calais Campbell and Derek Wolfe being exactly what we hoped
Pernell McPhee being quietly dominant in the run game and being effective as a pass rusher on the edge
Patrick Queen progressing week by week and making tons of plays
LJ Fort has been really solid
Justin Madubuike looked really good on his debut
Jihad Ward has been a steady role player