The Good, The Bad and The Ugly - Browns Edition

[Tank]

Many here regularly beat up on BWill, but it’s no accident that the run D is 1000% better with a healthy Brandon in the game.

 

[rossihunter2]

I still think GRo is getting off to easy for the play calling of this game. He consistently ran the ball on first down for no gain whatsoever.

this was infuriating - and then we'd pass on 1st down and suddenly find ourselves in 2nd and short and the running game would be available to us all of a sudden

roman needs to remember that we are 100% a pass first team at this point and call plays accordingly

 

[rmcjacket23]

I still think GRo is getting off to easy for the play calling of this game. He consistently ran the ball on first down for no gain whatsoever.

Often on second down, we'd either get an incompletion or only a modest gain.

We were in 3rd and long ALL game. Then on 3rd downs, we just so often threw the ball to a receiver well short of the sticks and usually without blockers. The one I remember working was the one to Hollywood where he had to zoom in between 2 guys to barely get it. It didn't work plenty of other times.

There is also been a sub pattern that is undeniable that we've seen all season. When we're not playing well, like we were yesterday, we get this sense of desperation mode and ALWAYS go for a deep ball even if it's not there. If I recall correctly Lamar has 5 interceptions almost half of them in that exact situation.

There is no threat of any play action. I understand that traditionally you use the run to set up your passing game, but this OL plus group of running backs isn't capable of setting the tone early in games. We need to pass early to set up the running game and actually develop play action.

Finally we still always have around 2 running plays that are obviously DOA regarding a pitch or option to Freeman outside. He can't do it. Stop making him do it.

As people were saying yesterday about the sacks, Lamar is literally asked to carry the weight of the entire team and that's why he holds on so long. We saw him effectively win the game by getting that TD off a crazy breakdown. I just think it would be easier on him if the play calling wasn't either actively inhibitory or just goofy.

So my push back is this...

Play action won't work, because our running game isn't a threat. You think there's any defense in the league who is looking at us and saying "yeah, we gotta make sure Murray and Freeman don't beat us". Teams figured out several months ago that all you have to play is Lamar. Play to beat Lamar. If you can keep his running ability mildly in check, and you can take away the deep ball, the Ravens simply don't have anything else to beat you with at the moment, and they're 100% right.

I'll defend running on first down partially, because if you don't run it on first down, what are you doing on second down? What happens when first down gets a small gain or the pass is incomplete? Are you running on second down thinking you're going to get a 5-6 yard gain, because these backs aren't getting that with any sort of consistency at all.

I think if you're going to throw more on first down, you damn well better have plays that are near certainties to get completed and for sufficient yardage. Pretty much takes deep shots out of the playbook, and basically turns you into a more predictable team to me.

I've never once seen a team execute play action well when there's no threat of the run game. And we don't have a threat of the run game right now. So for me, play action, until you've established the run, is just giving Lamar less time to get rid of the ball.

 

[QuothTheRaven]

Murray is the exact type of back you want when you're up like double digits in the fourth quarter and trying to pound out time of possession and grind the opposing defense down to a victory.
Problem is our running game isn't good enough for the first three quarters to have such leads, so yes, he's kind of useless.

I have no problem with the *role*, I just think he's bad at it unfortunately.

 

[QuothTheRaven]

I'm not sure what else they can do to improve it.

Pat Ricard up the gut 20x a game. Let them find out.

 

[Tank]

Browns TD was a no catch. It’s bizarre that they didn’t slow the replay down at the point the ball bounced on the ground. Slowed it before and after. wth?

 

[RL52TheGreatest]

Is Nate McCrary still on our practice squad? He showed some burst in the pre-season and could be worth giving a shot on the active roster. At the very least, he could be a better third option than Ty'Son, who the coaches obviously don't trust and hasn't really shown anything since the beginning of the season.

 

[QuothTheRaven]

Is Nate McCrary still on our practice squad? He showed some burst in the pre-season and could be worth giving a shot on the active roster. At the very least, he could be a better third option than Ty'Son, who the coaches obviously don't trust and hasn't really shown anything since the beginning of the season.

You have to assume it's because he sucks, but given the situation is does seem like it would be worth giving him a call-up and seeing how he handles a game day.

 

[UPennChem]

So my push back is this...

Play action won't work, because our running game isn't a threat. You think there's any defense in the league who is looking at us and saying "yeah, we gotta make sure Murray and Freeman don't beat us". Teams figured out several months ago that all you have to play is Lamar. Play to beat Lamar. If you can keep his running ability mildly in check, and you can take away the deep ball, the Ravens simply don't have anything else to beat you with at the moment, and they're 100% right.

I'll defend running on first down partially, because if you don't run it on first down, what are you doing on second down? What happens when first down gets a small gain or the pass is incomplete? Are you running on second down thinking you're going to get a 5-6 yard gain, because these backs aren't getting that with any sort of consistency at all.

I think if you're going to throw more on first down, you damn well better have plays that are near certainties to get completed and for sufficient yardage. Pretty much takes deep shots out of the playbook, and basically turns you into a more predictable team to me.

I've never once seen a team execute play action well when there's no threat of the run game. And we don't have a threat of the run game right now. So for me, play action, until you've established the run, is just giving Lamar less time to get rid of the ball.

What you're saying is not wrong. I also tried to state that you can't have play action without fear of the running game. However, see @rossihunter2 reply to me above. We had far more success throwing on first down than running it.

We all know that the RBs are limited. But we are still looking for ways to improve. My very naive fan thought is to try and use the passing game to set up the run. Because right now as you said most teams know on first down, more likely than not we're running it. They're not afraid of either one up the gut and they really aren't afraid of either bouncing outside. So they know if they just play disciplined against Lamar we're talking about a 1 yard gain at most.

I think as uncomfortable as it may be and especially so for Roman, this has gotta be a pass first team. We just don't have the resources to justify trying to be a run first team.

The only way would be if we went back to having Lamar carry it 4 times a drive. If there was a greater threat to Lamar running each running play, it might help out the running backs. But we all know the consequences of doing that.

But that's what I see. Start passing more or start running Lamar more.

 

[UPennChem]

this was infuriating - and then we'd pass on 1st down and suddenly find ourselves in 2nd and short and the running game would be available to us all of a sudden

roman needs to remember that we are 100% a pass first team at this point and call plays accordingly

See my below reply. I COMPLETELY agree with you. It's just unfortunate because we know that's very uncomfortable for him.

 

[UPennChem]

You have to assume it's because he sucks, but given the situation is does seem like it would be worth giving him a call-up and seeing how he handles a game day.

Trust me I've been begging for that. I had been hating on Ty'son since the preseason. Made multiple comments about how I thought McCrary was the right guy between the two. Obviously something is up though because he's not getting a chance. But man is Ty'son bad. Murray is the epitome of ok, but not a RB1. Murray and Ty'son are just BAD.

 

[OURavensFan]

Can we use Duvernay like Debo Samuel?

 

[RL52TheGreatest]

You have to assume it's because he sucks, but given the situation is does seem like it would be worth giving him a call-up and seeing how he handles a game day.

Yeah, one would have to assume that he probably sucks if the coaching staff hasn't given him a shot on the active roster yet, but I'm willing to try anything at this point lol

 

[JAAM]

Can we use Duvernay like Debo Samuel?

That would require having a competent play caller lol

 

[Deebo813]

It’s gonna suck when Micah Parsons wins DROY award over this guy just because of the team he plays on.

Oh how I was so wrong about you, Oweh. I love you.

View attachment 2975

Micah is having one crazy ass season.. it dnt really have anything to do with the team

 

[Deebo813]

You’re thinking of tyreek hill. This is the dad that raised a son that kicked a drunk girl as she sat on the ground

Tbf it has nothing to do with how his dad raised him… thats all on tyreke hill

 

[JAAM]

Holy shit when you can’t establish the run and then you stack routes on top of each other, no wonder Lamar and the offense play terrible. I mean it’s really sad to watch

 

[Deebo813]

For me, its pretty simple. Our offense will be limited the rest of the year because we're not really that effective running the ball. In a vacuum, our rushing stats look favorable league wide. But that's almost entirely Lamar, and a lot of the bigger gains are on unscripted plays.

Lamar has more than double the rushing yardage of ANY RB on this team. The two RBs we actually play and give carries to (Murray and Freeman) average 32 yards/game each and combine to average 3.8 YPC, which is well below replacement level in the NFL.

In 5 of our 11 games this year, RBs have failed to eclipse 75 rushing yards TOTAL, for the whole group, in a game. They've only gone over 100 yards 3 times in total, and not surprisingly, we won all three games (KC, LAC, MIN). They've been held under 40 yards rushing three times.

This offense isn't going to dramatically improve I don't think. I'm not sure what else they can do to improve it. There's no extra resources coming, and there's more coaching I see that is going to improve it. It is what it is.

I told you awhile back that i dnt see the offense improving cause the oline and rbs suck and its nothing we can really do about it..

 

[gtalk12]

How the hell is this half injured Ravens team the one seed? I'm not even going to get mad or happy anymore the rest of the season, just whatever happens happens.

We have Lions bro.

 

[gtalk12]

Imagine what the team would look like if Lamar and the offense was humming at the same time that our pass rush was getting home??