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The 2022 Offseason Thread
- Thread starter rossihunter2
- Start date
i want him on the field because he's a good player who's really intelligent...
that's why he wears the green dot not the other way around lol
most specific vague interest we've heard so far
i dont think any of the other veteran WRs make more sense than Landry
Davesta
Ravens Ring of Honor
They gotta record the first practice encounter of Jarvis and Marcus Peters.
United we stand!
JAAM
Hall of Famer
Lmaooooooooo
rmcjacket23
Ravens Ring of Honor
I want him on the field because we don't have a lot of depth at Corner and Clark can do a TON of things in a Hybrid role, especially as a linebacker/safety hybrid.
I still haven't figured out why people want him traded. Like apparently he's not that good but people can't wait to get a mid-round draft pick for him. Not exactly an easy reconciliation to perform.
JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
PFF who is stone cold positional value through and through have the ravens as their #1 draft class.
I haven’t seen the article either but I’ve heard it’s every bit as absurd as it sounds from the quote
here's the section about baltimore:
Baltimore Ravens
One exec joked that if the Ravens selected a punter in the first round, analysts would probably applaud Baltimore for smartly zigging when the rest of the league was zagging. Without question, the Ravens’ long-term success has earned them the benefit of the doubt. But there is growing doubt from some who have long held the Ravens in high regard.“The No. 1 reason teams miss early in the draft is when they go for the outlier,” an evaluator said. “They try to roll 11 in Vegas instead of seven. That is Baltimore in this draft.”
There’s some fear the Ravens lowered their odds for success by using early picks for outlier players at less premium positions: 6-foot-4 safety Kyle Hamilton at 14, undersized center Tyler Linderbaum at 25, injured outside linebacker David Ojabo in the second round and, yes, a punter in the fourth, before anyone else drafted one.
“A lot depends on how you view Linderbaum, because it is beauty in the eye of the beholder with him,” an evaluator said. “There is not a great precedent of guys his size being great players in the league. He is very similar size-wise to Garrett Bradbury, who just got his fifth-year option declined. Kyle Hamilton checked every box except for the athletic component.”
If there were large numbers of 6-4 college safeties failing in the NFL year after year, we would know with greater certainty height was a limiting factor. But few safeties that tall exist at any level. Does that mean the hit rate is far lower for them?
“I’m more bullish on Baltimore, but I can see the skepticism,” an exec said. “While I like a lot of the players they picked, the positions they focused on were kind of weird: strong safety, center, nose tackle, punter, two tight ends. Kyle Hamilton fell and probably for a reason. He is a weird shape, tall and slow. Linderbaum was highly rated, but he’s a center. Ojabo, they got a quote-unquote value pick there, but he might not play. Travis Jones, he is a guy that the analytics loved. His measurables were very good. But his tape was not.”
Trading Hollywood Brown, drafting zero receivers and loading up on tight ends could signal Baltimore doubling down on its run-heavy offense rather than trying to unlock a conventional passing game by surrounding Lamar Jackson with upgraded traditional receiving weaponry.
“They just stick so heavily to their board that if someone is higher than a wide receiver, they are definitely going to take that other person, but they might be a little slow in adjusting to positional importance,” an exec said.
Basically - a bunch of execs realised they overlooked some guys because they overemphasised testing/measurables and overthought positional value... and now they're trying to justify why lol - the only real outlier the ravens drafted was Linderbaum and the only real risk was Ojabo
JAAM
Hall of Famer
Wow. Thanks for this. What an idiot lol
hahaha which one are you talking about? or just all of them?
JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
That is absurd. Especially the part about Travis jones having good measurables and bad tape, and about Kyle hamilton being slow.
This is an all time bad take, like holy shit
JAAM
Hall of Famer
All of them that are talking shit about our draft lol
JoeyFlex5
Hall of Famer
Tylan Wallace’s college tape is pretty spectacular for a big school fourth rounder tbh. Like it’s very possible that the ravens are very high on him, he’s not a slouch, spectacular play ability, natural catcher, natural route runner, physical, body control, really has a dog in him. I’m looking forward to him getting some spin
EDC in the lounge pod they released yesterday specifically talked about the fact that without his injury, tylan probably goes in the 2nd round
oklahoma state's offence was so simple while he was there and they lined him up at the same spot on the same side basically every snap and asked him to win on the vertical plane or give him screens and ask him to make a play - sometimes he didnt but often he did - he was impressive at the 2021 senior bowl showing off his ability to run routes from the slot and run routes that broke more horizontally and worked the intermediate part of the field - he did struggle to get off press but there's a lot to like about his game and you can definitely project an improved release game working with "Dubb" or if not that a move to the slot or the z helps him stay away from press - but he's got play-strength and contact balance that would suggest he can develop and grow - when given off coverage he was horrible to deal with... has a beautiful sluggo move that he was devastating with
he was probably the 2nd best dude at the catch-point out of the whole 2021 draft class, second only to Ja'Marr Chase who is among the best i've ever seen coming out of college at the catch-point - wallace's concentration, body-control, timing, hand strength, hands in general are all exceptional traits at the catch-point
and it's also not beyond the realm of possibility that another year removed from his injury and another year in an NFL training program that he can't regain some of the extra explosion he had pre-injury - if he comes back looking like 2019 with his athleticism then watch out, and if not then i still think he's got a chance to be a nice possession type guy - i think he's easily the most talented wide receiver we've drafted outside of our 2 1st rounders for a long-time
by the end of the season it was notable that when we came out in 11 personnel to run no-huddle etc... it was hollywood, bateman and wallace who were being run out on the first drive - not watkins, not duvernay (and not proche who was inactive)
JAAM
Hall of Famer
Well this isn’t going to help his case against us
prosportsextra.com
NFL Free Agent Earl Thomas has a warrant out for his arrest
According to ProFootballTalk, Earl Thomas, 32, has a warrant out for his arrest within Travis County, Texas, faces a third-degree felony charge for allegedly violating the protective order two or m…
prosportsextra.com
Ellicottraven
Ravens Ring of Honor
That evaluator loves sour grapes evidently.
rmcjacket23
Ravens Ring of Honor
So I've heard a lot of people suggest that, from an analytics perspective, taking non-premium position players that early in the draft is a bad idea. And they ultimately may not be entirely wrong.
My only problem is... if all you do is isolate yourself to the 4-5 "critical" position groups as first or maybe even second round picks, I think your bust rate goes sky high.
Assuming you can get consensus on what a "premium" position is, most would probably say QB, Pass Rusher, Corner, and WR. Those are the big four. Maybe LT enters that group, but I think its debatable.
So if all teams universally adopted this, there would just be a ton of whiffs early in drafts, because there's no shortage of prospects in those groups that fail and fail miserably in this league.
Most of the "pro Linderbaum" camp would lean on the fact that a) almost everybody that evaluated him had him highly ranked as a C prospect, and many thought he's the best Center coming out of college they've seen in a long time". The bust rate on first round Centers is very low, and about half in recent memory have ended up as basically Pro Bowl level players. So while its not a sexy and risky pick, I think he's far less likely to be a total bust than most people taken.
I think a lot of people are just focused on the fact that they largely took TWO non-premium positional players in the first round, when there were higher "needs" potentially in play. Like I don't know if Linderbaum or Hamilton is going to be a more impactful player than Jermaine Johnson, a guy we passed on not once, but twice. I don't know. He plays a more premium position and was a bigger need than both of those guys.
But I think they're just nitpicking. To a certain extent, I understand, because the Ravens are being herald more for the "value" of where they got players than the actual talent of those players. And at the end of the day, in the long term, all that matters is production, not where you're drafted.
my point about safety though, is that certain analytics - WAR and increasing contract values in particular - are suggesting that safety is a high-value position, it just hasnt been recognised widely as such yet - so it's not just about limiting yourself to positions, it's also the fact that there's an under-interrogated idea about certain positions and their values
in terms of draft pick capital and contracts, QB, EDGE and OT are easily the most valued positions in the draft both currently and historically... CB is starting to trend that way too, and WR has just gone boom this offseason... and safeties, as a defensive force multiplier have found that in the current cover-2 world we live in, have had their values and game impact start to improve significantly at a high rate