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Lamar Jackson

RaineV1 said:
You're probably right but I really dislike that mentality. The relationship between athletes and team owners and their league is pretty similar to the average worker and their corporation. For every dollar Mahomes and other top end players get the owners and Goodell are getting far, far more despite the player being the one that creates that money.

Also we shouldn't put athletes on the same level of rich or even close to the level of rich as the owners. And we shouldn't see their negotiations as just rich people arguing. Even if Lamar got everything he wanted he would still be closer to being broke than he ever will to having Biscotti's level of money and influence. There's a gigantic difference between even the richest player and the poorest owner.
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I agree. Though from the mindset of somebody who lives paycheck to paycheck, its radically different. Its not a linear scale.
Lamar might be closer to poverty than he is to Steve, however, they basically both have the same purchasing power. Lamar can't buy an NFL franchise on his own, but he can buy many houses, many cars, set up generations of his family with great wealth (to the point where they will never have to work again), do luxurious vacations, etc.
The difference between the Billionaire and somebody like Lamar isn't $. It's Power. That's the difference. It's not about the $ they spend, because as any liberal will tell you, they think the biggest problem is that Billionaires hoard all the $, instead of spending it.
Its about power and influence more than $.
 
Deebo813 said:
Im sure he knew but he just believes he is worth more thats all.. i dnt think lamar is that dumb to not know the market value out there.. or maybe he did but was hoping to get better offers from the desperate teams
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I think Lamar is dumb for not realizing that being last to the party isn't what's best for his lifetime earnings. Its about being first to the party.
Sooner you sign the extension, more $ you make earlier = quicker you get to the next contract.
The irony of this whole thing is that Lamar wants max guaranteed $ because he realizes careers may not last, while simultaneously voluntarily playing for less $ early in his career. That doesn't pass any logical financial concept.

Two years ago, both sides should have walked up to each other, simultaneously, and said "give me $50K more than the Josh Allen deal", and been done with it. Neither side did it. And today, one party is making out significantly better than the other because of that failure.
 
SaltyDog said:
It has to be getting to a point of humiliation for him. How does he give in and save face at the same time? It’s really getting to the point of surreal. It’s fugly man.
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We say "him", but I fully believe he bought into some BS that someone else has sold him from the beginning. Of course he has had to go along with it, but someone has given him really bad advice, I think before any NFLPA involement.
 
RaineV1 said:
I disagree. If Lamar was just a free agent he likely would get some team giving him very close to what he wants. It's more about having to do a contract the Ravens won't match and two first round picks on top of that.
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Don't think they care about the picks.

The matching the deal is the problem, but if other teams were willing to give him what he wants, they'd have already done so. They could have had all the info they needed nearly a week ago.

Of course the million dollar question is... what does Lamar want? Does he want a fully gtd deal for 5 years like Watson, or does he just want more gtd $ than Watson? If he wants either one of those things, I think there are precisely zero NFL teams that would write him an offer on either. MAYBE one team would go the Mahomes route, which is "we'll give you $235M, but its on like an 8-10 year deal". And Lamar wouldn't sign that, nor should he.

If his market is lower than that, he'd have suitors. But two first round picks aren't swaying anybody. They give up single first rounders for mid-tier WRs in some cases these days. Carson Wentz went for a first and a third like two years ago.

It's not the picks. It's the $. And currently, the Ravens control over the $.
 
Deebo813 said:
I cant really say he is overvaluing himself till later on.. when flacco got his contract, he 100% deserved that mf but after like 2-3yrs, he was a bit overpaid
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Vet contracts are generally valued on what you've accomplished in the recent past. Unfortunately for Lamar that includes missing the most important parts of the last 2 seasons. It seems that no one other than the Ravens are willing to pay up at this point.
 
Tank said:
We say "him", but I fully believe he bought into some BS that someone else has sold him from the beginning. Of course he has had to go along with it, but someone has given him really bad advice, I think before any NFLPA involement.
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It always circles back to him not hiring an agent long ago. An agent would always have HIS best interest as a priority. The NFLPA has ALL players as a priority. Usually bad advice comes from people who don’t have your best interest front and center.
 
SaltyDog said:
It always circles back to him not hiring an agent long ago. An agent would always have HIS best interest as a priority. The NFLPA has ALL players as a priority. Usually bad advice comes from people who don’t have your best interest front and center.
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Or from someone who has no idea of what they are talking about.
 
The Ravens drafted Lamar and put him into a position to excel. They built and entire offense around him and called plays that maximized his unique skillset. Lamar to his credit, put in a ton of hard work and won a unanimous MVP for being the most electric player in all of football that season. What Lamar hasn't done is do the same for himself from a business perspective. An agent would have negotiated a deal after year 3 so that he was making $30M+ starting last year and he would be making about the same as what he is this year. Lamar would have ALREADY made $20M-$30M more in his career than he has done thus far. An agent would have had him better sponsorships by now. How did not he not have a $100M shoe deal from Nike or Under Armour following his MVP season? Lamar could have already had way more money than he is fighting for now. Lamar performed well enough on the field to get his money, but there is a reason why players hire agents.

From a contract perspective the Ravens have played their hands perfectly this season, but they screwed up to some extent. They could have given him $35M a year a couple years ago on a 5-year deal and not needed to get anywhere close to guaranteeing 100% of the deal. Then Watson, who Lamar likely feels is not the same caliber of a quarterback as him, with assault allegations swarming, gets the kind of deal that resets the QB market. Lamar as his own agent goes, "If someone will give that deal to THAT guy, they will give it to me". IF, Lamar was a free agent to start this offseason season and there was no draft capital tied to Lamar, a team would have given him a contract in excess of what the Ravens have offered in all likelihood. Lamar has overplayed his hand to this point, but all he has to do now is stay the course and keep betting on himself.

Play this season at $33M and stay healthy. Be in the same position next season and watch as the Ravens do the exact same thing. Except by then Joey B, Herbert and Hurts will likely have signed extensions. Then just wait for a team who prepared for Lamar to be available to make an offer. Or... Lamar can go back to the Ravens and ask for a 3 year, $138M guaranteed (Lamars holding out netted him more money, he gets a fully guaranteed deal and the Ravens get their QB) contract now. Be 29 years old as a true free agent and go test the market without teams having to worry about the Ravens matching an offer or having to give up a pair of first rounders. Lamar has painted himself in a corner where he can't take the 3-year guaranteed deal reported in the media, he can't not get a fully guaranteed deal, he can't hire an agent at this point and he can't use the media to force his way out of Baltimore. Lamar allowed all of those things to happen because he wanted to save the 3% or whatever it is that an agent would have charged him. Lamar needs to stop having beef with the Ravens (if true) and find a deal that makes him look like he got a stronger deal than he should given the limited leverage that he had this offseason. Then.... the guy should hire an agent.
 
Goldzglove21 said:
The Ravens drafted Lamar and put him into a position to excel. They built and entire offense around him and called plays that maximized his unique skillset. Lamar to his credit, put in a ton of hard work and won a unanimous MVP for being the most electric player in all of football that season. What Lamar hasn't done is do the same for himself from a business perspective. An agent would have negotiated a deal after year 3 so that he was making $30M+ starting last year and he would be making about the same as what he is this year. Lamar would have ALREADY made $20M-$30M more in his career than he has done thus far. An agent would have had him better sponsorships by now. How did not he not have a $100M shoe deal from Nike or Under Armour following his MVP season? Lamar could have already had way more money than he is fighting for now. Lamar performed well enough on the field to get his money, but there is a reason why players hire agents.

From a contract perspective the Ravens have played their hands perfectly this season, but they screwed up to some extent. They could have given him $35M a year a couple years ago on a 5-year deal and not needed to get anywhere close to guaranteeing 100% of the deal. Then Watson, who Lamar likely feels is not the same caliber of a quarterback as him, with assault allegations swarming, gets the kind of deal that resets the QB market. Lamar as his own agent goes, "If someone will give that deal to THAT guy, they will give it to me". IF, Lamar was a free agent to start this offseason season and there was no draft capital tied to Lamar, a team would have given him a contract in excess of what the Ravens have offered in all likelihood. Lamar has overplayed his hand to this point, but all he has to do now is stay the course and keep betting on himself.

Play this season at $33M and stay healthy. Be in the same position next season and watch as the Ravens do the exact same thing. Except by then Joey B, Herbert and Hurts will likely have signed extensions. Then just wait for a team who prepared for Lamar to be available to make an offer. Or... Lamar can go back to the Ravens and ask for a 3 year, $138M guaranteed (Lamars holding out netted him more money, he gets a fully guaranteed deal and the Ravens get their QB) contract now. Be 29 years old as a true free agent and go test the market without teams having to worry about the Ravens matching an offer or having to give up a pair of first rounders. Lamar has painted himself in a corner where he can't take the 3-year guaranteed deal reported in the media, he can't not get a fully guaranteed deal, he can't hire an agent at this point and he can't use the media to force his way out of Baltimore. Lamar allowed all of those things to happen because he wanted to save the 3% or whatever it is that an agent would have charged him. Lamar needs to stop having beef with the Ravens (if true) and find a deal that makes him look like he got a stronger deal than he should given the limited leverage that he had this offseason. Then.... the guy should hire an agent.
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Welcome! Agree with all you said here.

Negotiations 101 - Never negotiate from a point of weakness. After 2020 he was in a position of strength. Winning the MVP in 19 and having a fairly solid year in 20, during the Covid mess. He should have pushed for a restructure or a new deal then. Now, after missing significant playing time over the past two years, his position is weakened. Play on the tag, have a great year, and stay healthy. His stock will rise and he will get paid. And yes, hire an agent please.
 
rmcjacket23 said:
I think Lamar is dumb for not realizing that being last to the party isn't what's best for his lifetime earnings. Its about being first to the party.
Sooner you sign the extension, more $ you make earlier = quicker you get to the next contract.
The irony of this whole thing is that Lamar wants max guaranteed $ because he realizes careers may not last, while simultaneously voluntarily playing for less $ early in his career. That doesn't pass any logical financial concept.

Two years ago, both sides should have walked up to each other, simultaneously, and said "give me $50K more than the Josh Allen deal", and been done with it. Neither side did it. And today, one party is making out significantly better than the other because of that failure.
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Yea you got a point here
 
drjohnnyfever said:
He's got a fully guaranteed deal coming this year for $32M... He's got no choice but to enter his 3rd "Prove-It" year and actually, well... prove that he is deserving of "Happy Endings" Watson dough. Truth be told, no QB is worth that yearly money in a team sport. He does have this year, tho, to prove that he's big money, but if he does anything short of being stellar or seems less than engaged or less than serious about proving it, he'll never get it because he has mismanaged and misunderstood the strengths and weaknesses he's had in negotiating so badly that he's playing on the cheap.
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Which is probably why he's working his angles now to try to not have to play on that tag. He doesn't want to play on it. He just thought he'd have a bevy of offers from which to choose.

It didn't exactly go the way I expected, but him getting no outside offers so far might be the thing that actually gets him to come back to the negotiating table here.
 
Simba said:
Which is probably why he's working his angles now to try to not have to play on that tag. He doesn't want to play on it. He just thought he'd have a bevy of offers from which to choose.

It didn't exactly go the way I expected, but him getting no outside offers so far might be the thing that actually gets him to come back to the negotiating table here.
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He's mismanged things so badly, I wonder if the last offer is even still on the table from the Ravens. I think it would be good PR if it were to just pay the last best offer, but who knows. It would be a solid if they just said we feel comfortable in our offer and we love you Lamar. Done.

...yet, given how everything has gone so far, I see limited potential of that happening. :)
 
drjohnnyfever said:
He's got a fully guaranteed deal coming this year for $32M... He's got no choice but to enter his 3rd "Prove-It" year and actually, well... prove that he is deserving of "Happy Endings" Watson dough. Truth be told, no QB is worth that yearly money in a team sport. He does have this year, tho, to prove that he's big money, but if he does anything short of being stellar or seems less than engaged or less than serious about proving it, he'll never get it because he has mismanaged and misunderstood the strengths and weaknesses he's had in negotiating so badly that he's playing on the cheap.
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Mahomes and old Brady deserve that money but no one else. I hate that every player “deserves” to reset the market. Those guys should be anomalies. When you make 5 straight home afc championship games, I’ll give Lamar 1 bill guaranteed.
 
no one seems to ever bring this up. There was a deal offered to Lamar in the months following the Josh Allen contract.
 
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