Next Up: @ Bengals

[Simba]

I'm on the fence about current games. I think if Bills don't want to play this weekend either, may need to go the forfeit route. Unfortunate, but I can't see the NFL just being like "yeah Pittsburgh, Miami, you can't play in the playoffs this year". Which is precisely what happens if the Bills don't forfeit.

I don't think its going to come to that though. I think everybody will play this weekend. Only thing they'll probably figure out is what happens with last nights game.

Again, I don't necessarily disagree. Just hope that the NFL makes the tough call and doesn't put this onus on the players to make a decision like that during a really tough time, but I know that's asking for a lot. One of these situations where the NFL could really make a statement here after all of the bad press regarding player safety, but I don't suspect that they will. And to some extent, I understand why they wouldn't. But still a golden opportunity.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Allegedly the players and coaches made the call to not play, I say give both teams a forfeit for defying Gooddell and let us play for the division next week.

Obviously joking but allegedly the players and coaches did make the call, which was the right call. I’d rather not postpone the season so just give the bengals the division, we don’t deserve it anyway

There's a lot of conjecture within what happened with the timing last night. NFLPA Director totally denied the idea that the NFL gave them a "five minute warning" to resume playing, so that idea is taken with a grain of salt to me. I'm pretty sure the 5 minute policy is derived from the time of like an on-field injury (like a broken bone). Its not designed for cardiac arrest and I wouldn't be surprised if the NFL doesn't have a policy on recovery time from cardiac arrest. Nor probably should there be.

I have no doubt it was the players call to not continue. But I also really don't believe there's other people trying to force them to play either.

 

[Thezone27]

There's a lot of conjecture within what happened with the timing last night. NFLPA Director totally denied the idea that the NFL gave them a "five minute warning" to resume playing, so that idea is taken with a grain of salt to me. I'm pretty sure the 5 minute policy is derived from the time of like an on-field injury (like a broken bone). Its not designed for cardiac arrest and I wouldn't be surprised if the NFL doesn't have a policy on recovery time from cardiac arrest. Nor probably should there be.

I have no doubt it was the players call to not continue. But I also really don't believe there's other people trying to force them to play either.

It was the right call, but it also did save the Bills from a loss.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Again, I don't necessarily disagree. Just hope that the NFL makes the tough call and doesn't put this onus on the players to make a decision like that during a really tough time, but I know that's asking for a lot. One of these situations where the NFL could really make a statement here after all of the bad press regarding player safety, but I don't suspect that they will. And to some extent, I understand why they wouldn't. But still a golden opportunity.

I think in regards to this type of situation, its totally reasonable to put it on the players themselves. If they want to play, play. If they don't, don't. And if they don't, it probably has to be a forfeit, because it creates massive competitive unbalances to the teams that want to play and aren't impacted as much. This situation impacts everybody, but I don't think its unreasonable to think it impacts the Ravens far less than it impacts the Bills.

As for the player safety thing, its basically a non-preventable tragedy in my eyes. People can lump this into concussion protocols and CTE and all that, but one is not like the other. We don't have anywhere close to enough information to know why this even happened, or if football was even involved in it happening.

If the public wants to use this to bitch and moan about the NFL not taking player safety serious enough (while continuing to be colossal hypocrites in doing so), so be it. They can live with that.

 

[Thezone27]

Which is good but it did happen.

 

[Thezone27]

I think in regards to this type of situation, its totally reasonable to put it on the players themselves. If they want to play, play. If they don't, don't. And if they don't, it probably has to be a forfeit, because it creates massive competitive unbalances to the teams that want to play and aren't impacted as much. This situation impacts everybody, but I don't think its unreasonable to think it impacts the Ravens far less than it impacts the Bills.

As for the player safety thing, its basically a non-preventable tragedy in my eyes. People can lump this into concussion protocols and CTE and all that, but one is not like the other. We don't have anywhere close to enough information to know why this even happened, or if football was even involved in it happening.

If the public wants to use this to bitch and moan about the NFL not taking player safety serious enough (while continuing to be colossal hypocrites in doing so), so be it. They can live with that.

Heart attacks just happen.

 

[QtR Nevermore]

The NFL's already done better than UEFA. When Christian Eriksen went into cardiac arrest on the field they continued the game after a 90 minute delay. The game itself looked surprisingly normal afterwards too. I suppose players just go into game mode automatically.

The difference is that soccer is not a violent sport like football so players aren't delivering blows etc. That's going to feel a bit different, probably for every team, for the rest of this season.

 

[Simba]

I think in regards to this type of situation, its totally reasonable to put it on the players themselves. If they want to play, play. If they don't, don't. And if they don't, it probably has to be a forfeit, because it creates massive competitive unbalances to the teams that want to play and aren't impacted as much. This situation impacts everybody, but I don't think its unreasonable to think it impacts the Ravens far less than it impacts the Bills.

As for the player safety thing, its basically a non-preventable tragedy in my eyes. People can lump this into concussion protocols and CTE and all that, but one is not like the other. We don't have anywhere close to enough information to know why this even happened, or if football was even involved in it happening.

If the public wants to use this to bitch and moan about the NFL not taking player safety serious enough (while continuing to be colossal hypocrites in doing so), so be it. They can live with that.

And that's why I get it, but also just have to add the human aspect to it. Putting myself in the commissioner's shoes, I'd hate there to be a situation where a player that isn't comfortable playing feels obligated to go out there for the team because there's still that seeding/playoff impact. And if that player goes out there with his head not in it and gets hurt or something, that's a really bad look and just adds to the fuel.

It's why I think they have a golden opportunity although I don't think they take it. Regardless of the circumstances of the injury, it's an opportunity to say that player safety matters. They run ad campaigns on mental health all season long. I fully recognize that it's a business and they answer to the sports books and all of that stuff, but they still do have an opportunity put up or shut up and to make a tough decision. All I'm really saying here.

 

[Thezone27]

And that's why I get it, but also just have to add the human aspect to it. Putting myself in the commissioner's shoes, I'd hate there to be a situation where a player that isn't comfortable playing feels obligated to go out there for the team because there's still that seeding/playoff impact. And if that player goes out there with his head not in it and gets hurt or something, that's a really bad look and just adds to the fuel.

It's why I think they have a golden opportunity although I don't think they take it. Regardless of the circumstances of the injury, it's an opportunity to say that player safety matters. They run ad campaigns on mental health all season long. I fully recognize that it's a business and they answer to the sports books and all of that stuff, but they still do have an opportunity put up or shut up and to make a tough decision. All I'm really saying here.

Yeah, The Deshaun Watson thing was another missed opportunity.

 

[rossihunter2]

I know I’ve been the one saying we can beat the Bengals they’re overrated. But after we lost to the joke Steelers I’m done with this team, I’m sick of Lamar’s injury I’m sick of us always being unclutch. The Bengals fanbase used to not hold a candle to ours but recently our crowd noise is not impressive and Steeler fans were dancing on Rays statue waving their towels all night. There’s no excitement counter to Cincinnati. Bills and Bengals (and probably patriots or jags too) will destroy this joke team.

Now I have a small glimmer of hope That Lamar comes back and plays great, but it’s foolish to cling to that. We and I do need to remember we don’t have our MVP QB so it’s almost unfair to critique this hard, but is he going to come back?

yeah fans in the stadiums have not been great this year noise-wise - and way too many away fans in the stadium

 

[Michael M.]

Heart attacks just happen.

This wasn't a heart attack-he went into cardiac arrest due to a helmet blow (trauma) to the chest. It was like a heart punch-caused his heart to stop. A heart attack is caused by a circulation issue, this was not that.

 

[QtR Nevermore]

I think they're going to change the rules on the back of this. What Higgins did was legal but, for years now, defensive players haven't been allowed to lead with the helmet because it isn't safe. Offensive players have been allowed to continue, just because it's 'finishing the run' / playing tough and we love to see it, but there isn't really any justification for allowing it, especially now we have an example of what can happen.

I'm not sure if the stiff arm not being called as hands to the face will go the same way but it really should for fairness sake.

 

[rossihunter2]

The NFL's already done better than UEFA. When Christian Eriksen went into cardiac arrest on the field they continued the game after a 90 minute delay. The game itself looked surprisingly normal afterwards too. I suppose players just go into game mode automatically.

The difference is that soccer is not a violent sport like football so players aren't delivering blows etc. That's going to feel a bit different, probably for every team, for the rest of this season.

i think the key difference here is that while what happened with Eriksen was awful too, he was also awake and stable before they restarted the game

that being said, UEFA really fucked up by forcing the match to continue and threatening a 3-0 forfeit of Denmark - if he was in the same condition as Hamlin though, I can't imagine them being able to get away with that kind of threat

 

[QtR Nevermore]

that being said, UEFA really fucked up by forcing the match to continue and threatening a 3-0 forfeit of Denmark - if he was in the same condition as Hamlin though, I can't imagine them being able to get away with that kind of threat

They'd probably have tried. UEFA/ FIFA don't give a fuck what anybody thinks of them. We all know Qatar bribed them and everyone is still in their jobs, waiting for the next bribe.

 

[rmcjacket23]

This wasn't a heart attack-he went into cardiac arrest due to a helmet blow (trauma) to the chest. It was like a heart punch-caused his heart to stop. A heart attack is caused by a circulation issue, this was not that.

I don't think anybody has nearly enough info yet to be definitively saying what caused anything to happen.

 

[Michael M.]

I don't think anybody has nearly enough info yet to be definitively saying what caused anything to happen.

They are reporting cardiac arrest. All I'm saying is that is not the same as a heart attack.

 

[rmcjacket23]

I think they're going to change the rules on the back of this. What Higgins did was legal but, for years now, defensive players haven't been allowed to lead with the helmet because it isn't safe. Offensive players have been allowed to continue, just because it's 'finishing the run' / playing tough and we love to see it, but there isn't really any justification for allowing it, especially now we have an example of what can happen.

I'm not sure if the stiff arm not being called as hands to the face will go the same way but it really should for fairness sake.

I doubt you'll see anything. This is like a once in a generation type thing. You may go 40-50 years and not see it happen again, with no changes to anything. This isn't close to like head trauma being routinely caused or specific types of blocks or hits that somewhat frequently cause injuries.

This is basically like lightning strike level of activity. It's not preventable. The only recourse is to have the best possible reactionary procedures to it. And generally speaking, the NFL and those teams are being herald for how they handled it. Super quick response time, super quick actionable items were taken by medical personnel. Was apparently diagnosed very quickly in a situation where a normal person probably wouldn't notice an issue like this immediately.

 

[rmcjacket23]

They are reporting cardiac arrest. All I'm saying is that is not the same as a heart attack.

Agreed its not. Just don't know definitely what causes cardiac arrest. Blunt trauma to the chest isn't the only thing that would cause that.

 

[Thezone27]

I doubt you'll see anything. This is like a once in a generation type thing. You may go 40-50 years and not see it happen again, with no changes to anything. This isn't close to like head trauma being routinely caused or specific types of blocks or hits that somewhat frequently cause injuries.

This is basically like lightning strike level of activity. It's not preventable. The only recourse is to have the best possible reactionary procedures to it. And generally speaking, the NFL and those teams are being herald for how they handled it. Super quick response time, super quick actionable items were taken by medical personnel. Was apparently diagnosed very quickly in a situation where a normal person probably wouldn't notice an issue like this immediately.

It is sad but true.

 

[Michael M.]

Agreed its not. Just don't know definitely what causes cardiac arrest. Blunt trauma to the chest isn't the only thing that would cause that.

Agreed-the rest is my speculation. Just so scary and have to hope and pray for a full recovery for this kid.