The Random Thought Thread

[RavensMania]

Didn’t know the specifics but do know it will catch up to them.

Lets not assume just because Watsons deal is fully guaranteed that it isn't flexible. He is getting paid 46m in base salary over the course of his contract and that can be converted to a signing bonus and spread out over the remainder of the contract. With the salary cap going up as it's supposed to, they won't be as cash strapped as many people believe.

We would be able to do the same if we were to end up giving Lamar a fully guaranteed contract.

 

[ndub]

Lets not assume just because Watsons deal is fully guaranteed that it isn't flexible. He is getting paid 46m in base salary over the course of his contract and that can be converted to a signing bonus and spread out over the remainder of the contract. With the salary cap going up as it's supposed to, they won't be as cash strapped as many people believe.

We would be able to do the same if we were to end up giving Lamar a fully guaranteed contract.

Browns better hope he can return to form. Guys not played meaningful football in a year and a half/two years

 

[Tank]

Lets not assume just because Watsons deal is fully guaranteed that it isn't flexible. He is getting paid 46m in base salary over the course of his contract and that can be converted to a signing bonus and spread out over the remainder of the contract. With the salary cap going up as it's supposed to, they won't be as cash strapped as many people believe.

We would be able to do the same if we were to end up giving Lamar a fully guaranteed contract with?

Wut? Here you go. $230 mil. guaranteed, 5 years is just that. Can’t spread it beyond 5 years. And if he shits the bed after 2 or 3 years there’s still a ton of dead cap with a fully guaranteed contract. Looks like they’re getting a break this year for a 5 game season. Dumber than dumb.

 

[allblackraven]

Lets not assume just because Watsons deal is fully guaranteed that it isn't flexible. He is getting paid 46m in base salary over the course of his contract and that can be converted to a signing bonus and spread out over the remainder of the contract. With the salary cap going up as it's supposed to, they won't be as cash strapped as many people believe.

We would be able to do the same if we were to end up giving Lamar a fully guaranteed contract.

Lamar's salary cap number is not a main issue. It can be manipulated in a few different ways. The only real break on a deal is Steve Bisciotti's willingness, or a lack thereof, to pony up and give him guarantees.

 

[RavensMania]

Wut? Here you go. $230 mil. guaranteed, 5 years is just that. Can’t spread it beyond 5 years. And if he shits the bed after 2 or 3 years there’s still a ton of dead cap with a fully guaranteed contract. Dumber than dumb.

View attachment 4053

I'm not saying to spread it beyond 5 years at all. They can and will convert a portion of the 46m in 2023 to a signing bonus and spread that out to the end of the contract to create space. They can do that in any of the years of his contract. Players like receiving the money up front and almost always will be willing to do this. Yes it will increase future years caps.

 

[RavensMania]

Lamar's salary cap number is not a main issue. It can be manipulated in a few different ways. The only real break on a deal is Steve Bisciotti's willingness, or a lack thereof, to pony up and give him guarantees.

I totally agree with this

 

[Tank]

I'm not saying to spread it beyond 5 years at all. They can and will convert a portion of the 46m in 2023 to a signing bonus and spread that out to the end of the contract to create space. They can do that in any of the years of his contract. Players like receiving the money up front and almost always will be willing to do this. Yes it will increase future years caps.

Future years? There’s only 4 future years to spread $220 mil.. lol And it’s guaranteed!

 

[RavensMania]

Future years? There’s only 4 future years to spread $220 mil.. lol And it’s guaranteed!

I didn't say to spread the entire amount, I said a portion

My bet is his overall cap hit will be between 35 and 40 million with the remainder prorated. No way he plays on a total cap hit of 55m next season.

 

[Tank]

I didn't say to spread the entire amount, I said a portion

$220 mil. isn’t the entire amount, it’s what he’s guaranteed to earn for the next 4 years, after this year.

 

[RavensMania]

$220 mil. isn’t the entire amount, it’s what he’s guaranteed to earn for the next 4 years, after this year.

I'm not converting the entire base salary in any of the years. I'm reducing his salary about 20m and paying it to Watson in a signing bonus and then prorating that amount over the remainder of the years to lower his cap hit.

As I said in the above post, I don't think he plays on a cap hit higher than 35 to 40m in 2023.

 

[Tank]

I'm not converting the entire base salary in any of the years. I'm reducing his salary about 20m and paying it to Watson in a signing bonus and then prorating that amount over the remainder of the years to lower his cap hit.

No matter how you slice it it’s crippling at some point in the near future, just look at the screenshot I posted for you. And if he gets hurt or doesn’t play well at any time the team is dead stinkin’ in the water the contract being fully guaranteed.

 

[Willbacker]

I'm not converting the entire base salary in any of the years. I'm reducing his salary about 20m and paying it to Watson in a signing bonus and then prorating that amount over the remainder of the years to lower his cap hit.

As I said in the above post, I don't think he plays on a cap hit higher than 35 to 40m in 2023.

Yes but his cap hit will be over 60 mil in his last 2 yrs with no way to get out. They are fools and 100% against signing Lamar to that kind of contract. It's an awful lot of betting on the cap rising exponentially each year.

 

[ndub]

Yes but his cap hit will be over 60 mil in his last 2 yrs with no way to get out. They are fools and 100% against signing Lamar to that kind of contract. It's an awful lot of betting on the cap rising exponentially each year.

Amen

 

[RavensMania]

Yes but his cap hit will be over 60 mil in his last 2 yrs with no way to get out. They are fools and 100% against signing Lamar to that kind of contract. It's an awful lot of betting on the cap rising exponentially each year.

Cleveland set up the contract with even cap hits on all of the years of the contract. If you reduce his cap hit in 2023 by 20m, it will increase as you said, but the cap is going to go up a pretty decent amount as well with the new TV deals also. Most contracts are set up with a stairstep increase in each of the years. I believe Cleveland set it up this way to allow for the increases due to a proration.

This is good constructive discussion and no one really knows what is going to happen until the offseason, but just because you have a fully guaranteed contract, doesn't mean you have an inflexible contract by design.

 

[Tank]

Yes but his cap hit will be over 60 mil in his last 2 yrs with no way to get out. They are fools and 100% against signing Lamar to that kind of contract. It's an awful lot of betting on the cap rising exponentially each year.

Actually if it’s say $40 mil. 2023 and 2024 it would be $90 mil. if divided equally 2025 and 2026!

 

[Willbacker]

Cleveland set up the contract with even cap hits on all of the years of the contract. If you reduce his cap hit in 2023 by 20m, it will increase as you said, but the cap is going to go up a pretty decent amount as well with the new TV deals also. Most contracts are set up with a stairstep increase in each of the years. I believe Cleveland set it up this way to allow for the increases due to a proration.

This is good constructive discussion and no one really knows what is going to happen until the offseason, but just because you have a fully guaranteed contract, doesn't mean you have an inflexible contract by design.

Yes the base salary can be played with but it's still guaranteed which is the problem for them. Just makes me wonder if they'll have to use extensions even if Watson shits the bed.

 

[Old Bay]

 

[Tank]

Sad for Tua, but I hope he decides to retire.

 

[Old Bay]

Sad for Tua, but I hope he decides to retire.

Healthwise, I agree. But with how young he is, I doubt he does unless some trusted medical professional insists on it.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Wut? Here you go. $230 mil. guaranteed, 5 years is just that. Can’t spread it beyond 5 years. And if he shits the bed after 2 or 3 years there’s still a ton of dead cap with a fully guaranteed contract. Looks like they’re getting a break this year for a 5 game season. Dumber than dumb.

View attachment 4053

So couple problems with this. Namely, this is a really good structure for the Browns:
1. If people think he's playing 2023 on a $55M cap hit, they're delusional. They'll convert a large chunk of salary to a signing bonus, prorate that, and rinse repeat.
2. If you're saying to yourself "well yeah, but they're just putting more cap into the future", you're right. Except by the time they get to the 2025-2026 timeframe, they'll be talking extension. That extension will involve taking large amounts of his current salaries, converting to bonus, and prorating over the new contract length.

The only way that doesn't happen is if Watson a) sucks and doesn't produce or b) does something ridiculously stupid again.
Not saying either can't happen, but on-field production has never been an issue for Watson.

When Cleveland did this, its pretty clear they view him as the franchise QB for 10-15 years, not 5 years. They structured this contract in a way that pretty much guarantees they can do whatever they want with it, every year, as long as he's performing.