The Good, The Better and The Best vs NE

[Dom McRaven]

Can we talk about how badly we dragged our nuts across their chins from start to finish?

Nick Boyle ran his mouth last week, the whole world was all oOoOh DoNt GiVe ThE pAtRiOtS bUlLeTiN bOaRd MaTeRiAl... then Boyle scores his first career TD against them.

Lamar on the opening drive TD and he let them boys know! Humphrey too.

I love the swagger this team has right now. Pats fans are all saying “lol our record was worse last year and look how that ended” but that’s all a cover up... they know passing on Lamar Jackson is gonna haunt them

"...we dragged our nuts across their chins from start to finish" hahahaha

We're definitely going to need a Best of JoeyFlex 5 2.0 Thread.

 

[Dom McRaven]

BTW, THANK GOD we kept DeCosta.

more like, thank god he didn't want to leave.

It was always part of the plan. These fools (other teams' FOs) really thought they had a chance of taking DeCosta from us, not knowing that he was the heir apparent all along. All he did was wait his turn and the keys to the castle were his.

 

[rmcjacket23]

I stayed up till 3 AM because the adrenalin pumping through my veins didn't settle down. This morning I went right back to scouring the internet for videos and articles to see how the naysayers were doing in the aftermath of a severe drubbing of the Pats at the hands of imho the Michael Jordan of the NFL. How would the haters reconcile the facts with their perception? Some still hated like Whitlock, Gonzalez and Mancini saying they were all super impressed with the Patriots! Figure that one out for me please. Some reluctantly gave Lamar his props. Some outright jumped bandwagons shamelessly. Some stood their ground looking stupid.

Bottom line is Lamar doesn't give a rat's tiny poop bit what these guys think and that is the most satisfying thing to me.

I mean... its all basically overreactions at this point, and that's included on our side too.

On the Patriots side, its not like they're all the sudden some wildly overrated team that can't beat anybody good. Its not like anybody really thought they were going to go 16-0. They lose 2-3 games at least every year... no reason why this year would be different. So you look at their schedule, you realize they haven't played a lot of quality teams yet, and they have some tough road games ahead. Baltimore, Philadelphia, Houston, all on the road. Still have to play KC at home and Dallas as home also. They were always going to lose some of those games.

Like if I'm a Pats fan, you know what I'm saying to myself? That game mattered a hell of a lot more to the Ravens than the Patriots. Patriots didn't need to win that game at all. They're still in a great spot to get a bye, nobody thinks they're in a position where they won't win their division, and they were already 8-0. The Patriots are everyone's measuring stick. They won the SB last year, despite getting beat by Marcus Mariota, Blake Bortles, and Ryan Tannehill. You think they're coming back to NE today and being like "o shit we're dead we got no chance"? No way in hell that's happening.

For the Ravens, its the signature win they needed. You played the biggest dog, and you beat them down. That's all that needs to be said.

But then again, you go and lay in egg in Cincinnati in 6 days, and nobody will care about the NE win. Its just another inconsistent team who will make the playoffs and not have the consistency to win the games they need to.

Its a week to week league. Inferior teams beat superior teams on a weekly basis. Anybody really think the Chargers are a better team than the Packers? Anybody think the Jets are better than the Cowboys?
People are going to be asking the same question about whether the Ravens are better than the Patriots. Just winning H2H doesn't mean that much... its just one game in one week. Cleveland beat us. They're not better than us.

You determine who's better by how they play over the full course of a season, not how they play in one game. All the Patriots win did is show that we CAN beat the best. It doesn't mean we will when it matters the most. You have to earn that level of confidence.

 

[Nurps]

It was always part of the plan. These fools (other teams' FOs) really thought they had a chance of taking DeCosta from us, not knowing that he was the heir apparent all along. All he did was wait his turn and the keys to the castle were his.

Didn't we pay him full GM money for the past few years to show our intentions?

 

[balfan23]

i think with this point my guess is there's a couple of reasons - the one where he loses yardage felt to me like he thought he could get the edge for a moment and create more yards

but in general i think because he's still recovering from injuries that he's avoiding contact where he can (when he can) while he's still healing - i fully expect as he gets healthier that he will play differently - and i think part of it is just underestimating the speed of linebackers etc. to close him down when he's trying to get yards a bit like lamar early in his first season where he was surprised by how fast everyone else was and it took him a while to readjust his angles

Yeah the play he's talking about where Hollywood lost yards out of bounds it was definitely to avoid contact and not to extend the play. He had nowhere to go. It didn't bother me too much, because I'm pretty sure he had already gotten a first down on the play.

However - It is a concern of mine. Not so much that something bad might happen as a result of his avoiding contact (like losing yards in a key situation), but just a sign of how fragile he knows he is. An NFL football field is not good for the fragile, cause you're going to get hit somewhere along the line. He hasn't been really hard hit on any play I've seen and he's still had a situation where he went out for weeks (though I do understand those kind of injuries can occur on tackles that don't necessarily look like a hard hit).

We need a guy with his skillset and speed on the outside, but I do worry he's going to have a hard time staying on the field.

 

[balfan23]

I mean... its all basically overreactions at this point, and that's included on our side too.

On the Patriots side, its not like they're all the sudden some wildly overrated team that can't beat anybody good. Its not like anybody really thought they were going to go 16-0. They lose 2-3 games at least every year... no reason why this year would be different. So you look at their schedule, you realize they haven't played a lot of quality teams yet, and they have some tough road games ahead. Baltimore, Philadelphia, Houston, all on the road. Still have to play KC at home and Dallas as home also. They were always going to lose some of those games.

Like if I'm a Pats fan, you know what I'm saying to myself? That game mattered a hell of a lot more to the Ravens than the Patriots. Patriots didn't need to win that game at all. They're still in a great spot to get a bye, nobody thinks they're in a position where they won't win their division, and they were already 8-0. The Patriots are everyone's measuring stick. They won the SB last year, despite getting beat by Marcus Mariota, Blake Bortles, and Ryan Tannehill. You think they're coming back to NE today and being like "o shit we're dead we got no chance"? No way in hell that's happening.

For the Ravens, its the signature win they needed. You played the biggest dog, and you beat them down. That's all that needs to be said.

But then again, you go and lay in egg in Cincinnati in 6 days, and nobody will care about the NE win. Its just another inconsistent team who will make the playoffs and not have the consistency to win the games they need to.

Its a week to week league. Inferior teams beat superior teams on a weekly basis. Anybody really think the Chargers are a better team than the Packers? Anybody think the Jets are better than the Cowboys?
People are going to be asking the same question about whether the Ravens are better than the Patriots. Just winning H2H doesn't mean that much... its just one game in one week. Cleveland beat us. They're not better than us.

You determine who's better by how they play over the full course of a season, not how they play in one game. All the Patriots win did is show that we CAN beat the best. It doesn't mean we will when it matters the most. You have to earn that level of confidence.

On the Cincinnati bit - you can bet your house that Harbaugh and the vets on this team and preaching that all week. They will be on high alert to make sure guys aren't feeling a little too good about themselves after the big win and all the hype that comes with it. Good thing is - I just don't think the 22 year old leader of this team is of that nature. When Lamar says he doesn't listen to the hype and keeps on working, he is very believable. So hopefully - no egg in Cincinnati.

Yes, you are judged by the full season and the post season too. Go 13-3 and get bounced in your first playoff game and no one cares.

Did the win mean more to us than them? By like a million miles. But still, the win last night is some evidence that the Browns game was an outlier and the Seattle game was not. Hopefully we continue to build upon that evidence beyond getting a W in the upcoming trap game, but when we play a stretch of really good teams.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

i think with this point my guess is there's a couple of reasons - the one where he loses yardage felt to me like he thought he could get the edge for a moment and create more yards

but in general i think because he's still recovering from injuries that he's avoiding contact where he can (when he can) while he's still healing - i fully expect as he gets healthier that he will play differently - and i think part of it is just underestimating the speed of linebackers etc. to close him down when he's trying to get yards a bit like lamar early in his first season where he was surprised by how fast everyone else was and it took him a while to readjust his angles

This. I really think that dramatic cutback was an effort to hit the corner and he was just surprised by the angle the LB took, because before he takes that last step out you can see him clearly cut back upfield

 

[rossihunter2]

Yeah the play he's talking about where Hollywood lost yards out of bounds it was definitely to avoid contact and not to extend the play. He had nowhere to go. It didn't bother me too much, because I'm pretty sure he had already gotten a first down on the play.

However - It is a concern of mine. Not so much that something bad might happen as a result of his avoiding contact (like losing yards in a key situation), but just a sign of how fragile he knows he is. An NFL football field is not good for the fragile, cause you're going to get hit somewhere along the line. He hasn't been really hard hit on any play I've seen and he's still had a situation where he went out for weeks (though I do understand those kind of injuries can occur on tackles that don't necessarily look like a hard hit).

We need a guy with his skillset and speed on the outside, but I do worry he's going to have a hard time staying on the field.

if it wasnt to try and get more yards (of which im not convinced but im gonna find the play again to have another look) then its probably just because hes still recovering from his injuries and while hes in that state he wants to preserve himself when he can while he's healing - we know he can take a hit when he needs to like on that steelers td etc. but when he can avoid contact he does and that's fine also

 

[rossihunter2]

yeah ive had a look and it does look odd but when he makes the cut i think hes expecting mark ingram to get a block on the LB and as joey said i think hes surprised by the angle the LB takes - but he's not avoiding contact here because he tries to arc his run around the LB as the the LB comes forward and still gets tackled as he arcs his run to seemingly try and win the edge

id prefer him to cut up inside especially as mark ingram seemed to have lost that block but would still have position if hollywood cut inside him rather than outside but not sure of the timing when ingram loses vs when hollywood cuts

 

[rossihunter2]

side note that 3rd quarter drive after the pats td was awesome and gutsy - we had the critical 3rd and 5 throw to mark andrews vs the infamous cover zero blitz, the 4th and 4 to willie snead on a rollout, 2nd and 11 conversion to hollywood, the 1st and 10 where lamar had his insane escape when seemingly surrounded and then to cap it all off nick boyle's first career td

all those clutch plays came on 1 drive

 

[Militant X 1]

I'll go through my "bad" list. Full caveat... its a bit "picky" and these are all problems I can live with I think, especially after a game like last night...

1. TURNOVERS, TURNOVERS, TURNOVERS. There is no scenario I see where we can be an actual SB contender if you're going to be coughing up the football. Muffed punt in your own territory is unacceptable, and so is your veteran RB fumbling. It cost us 10 points last night, and on nights where the Patriots aren't making similar mistakes and other teams capitalize better of those, they're the kinds of things that cost you games.
Sounds harsh, but I could see Cyrus Jones finding himself unemployed this week. He's not playing on defense, the return game in general has been very disappointing all year long, and now you're fumbling in the biggest game of the year. Especially as players are getting healthy, its getting harder to justify a roster spot there in my eyes.
2. I love Hollywood Brown, and he's definitely a playmaker out there... BUT... am I the only one a little put off by how he avoids contact like the plague? I get it... he's small, and you don't want him taking big hits. But there's one play where he literally lost yardage in an attempt to run out of bounds, just so he doesn't get tackled. Its still football. You don't have to be Mark Ingram trying to run over people, but I'm not sure if running out of bounds or losing yardage to avoid contact is smart, both short term and long term. In certain spots, every yard matters.
3. I like the improvement I saw from the intermediate passing game this week, but we still aren't really stretching the field much in the passing game. I know its hard to replicate what we did to like Miami or even Arizona, but we're really not even taking shots at this point. Its only going to open up the offense that much more if we start attacking deeper in the passing game.

I agree with everything said here.

I thought the same thing about the turnovers and Cyrus Jones. As far as Hollywood? I saw it the same as you. He avoided contact like the plague and lost a few yards darting out of bounds. And, I was saying that we need to stretch the field even more than what has been done. Lamar threw a nice pass to Andrews but I'd like to see him go deep to Hollywood, Boykins and Roberts at some point to keep defense's honest!

 

[JoeyFlex5]

yeah ive had a look and it does look odd but when he makes the cut i think hes expecting mark ingram to get a block on the LB and as joey said i think hes surprised by the angle the LB takes - but he's not avoiding contact here because he tries to arc his run around the LB as the the LB comes forward and still gets tackled as he arcs his run to seemingly try and win the edge

id prefer him to cut up inside especially as mark ingram seemed to have lost that block but would still have position if hollywood cut inside him rather than outside but not sure of the timing when ingram loses vs when hollywood cuts

If anything, trying to regain the corner rather than attempt to cut inside and find a lane was protecting himself, but I strongly disagree that he retreated a good 4 yards just to avoid a tackle and step out. Going out of bounds was sort of the collateral damage of a business decision, if that LB gets cautious about him cutting inside and he doesn’t angle wide then by making that cut Hollywood can easily get the corner. He took a chance to make a play and didn’t do the reckless thing while he’s still injured

 

[Dom McRaven]

Didn't we pay him full GM money for the past few years to show our intentions?

Indeed we did. Which makes the other teams even bigger fools because they should've known better.

 

[Militant X 1]

I know Lamar is an artist when it comes to handing the ball off or faking a handoff but two he did yesterday just blew my mind - fake to Hill before the last TD and absolutely insane flick to Hollywood on a jet sweep. On that one I think only Lamar and Hollywood knew where the football is. I'm including NE and the Ravens players, both sidelines, 70K + people in the Bank and few million watching at home. After watching that over and over again, I'm still not sure where the football is.

That was the same play that "FAKER" mayfield tried last week with OBJ and he tossed it into the hands of the defender. Lol!

 

[rossihunter2]

If anything, trying to regain the corner rather than attempt to cut inside and find a lane was protecting himself, but I strongly disagree that he retreated a good 4 yards just to avoid a tackle and step out. Going out of bounds was sort of the collateral damage of a business decision, if that LB gets cautious about him cutting inside and he doesn’t angle wide then by making that cut Hollywood can easily get the corner. He took a chance to make a play and didn’t do the reckless thing while he’s still injured

he also only lost 2 yards of forward progress from that cut

 

[balfan23]

I know it probably didn't mean much to everyone but I really appreciated that they tied in some of the old Baltimore Colts history into the story on the broadcast last night. Showing Gino's (Marchetti's) Burgers and Chicken joint (which has been around for as long as I lived) and putting Unitas and Lenny Moore on the Mt. Rushmore.

Broadcasts all year have been showing historic photos of the old league and I just felt like Baltimore's history would not be acknowledged. I'm glad they did it.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

he also only lost 2 yards of forward progress from that cut

Due to the extra cut back upfield before stepping out.

 

[allblackraven]

I know it probably didn't mean much to everyone but I really appreciated that they tied in some of the old Baltimore Colts history into the story on the broadcast last night. Showing Gino's (Marchetti's) Burgers and Chicken joint (which has been around for as long as I lived) and putting Unitas and Lenny Moore on the Mt. Rushmore.

Broadcasts all year have been showing historic photos of the old league and I just felt like Baltimore's history would not be acknowledged. I'm glad they did it.

Not to mention The Wire reference...

 

[JO_75]

To put a stamp on last night's win.... I once again post this image where you will not see Lamar's name on this list.

 

[RavensMania]

with the packers it was such an opportunity that while he didnt want to move from the ravens he did double check with steve and ozzie that the 5 year plan (for him to takeover) was still in place and they reassured him it was - but i think from what he's said that's the only offer that ever made him double check his standing here

that's because he kept turning down interviews.