The Random Thought Thread

[purplepittabread88]

earlier we were discussing the need for Derwin James and how we shouldn't have passed on him. No one is arguing the value of Derwin James vs. Hayden Hurst. However part of the thought that goes into this is that Andrews would have the TE and we wouldn't have needed Hurst.

Trading the 16 Pick twice allowed us to to parlay picks on multiple occasions. These trades subsequently yielded us the following players.

Hayden Hurst
Mark Andrews
Kenny Young
Jordan Lasley
Bradley Bozeman

Chances are less likely we trade up for Lamar Jackson without trading back and acquiring multiple picks.

Yes, Hurst vs. James is obvious who is the better player, but James vs. Jackson, Hurst, Andrews, Young, Lasley and Bozeman, I'd probably do it all over again.

That haul is certainly worth it but I wouldn't have minded taking Sony Michel or Will Hernandez. At the time I really wanted Ridley too but I am not sure how much of a product of Julio he is

 

[Grim]

So originally I thought that flacco had developed a connection with Andrews when hurst was injured so lamar and hurst would connected themselves ( preseason tds, even vs panthers)
But it’s already looking awful for hurst and it’s not like he’s a young guy.. other wise the draft class was great but it could have been legendary

I do believe Hurst is going to be a very good TE, we just need the right OC to be able to use both our rookie TEs.

James was the better player and we all knew that. I’m not angry about that as I am even disappointed we got an old TE when it takes TE years to develop and they are rarely rookie contributors. If we are in a win now mode I don’t get the pick.

 

[Oldfaithful]

earlier we were discussing the need for Derwin James and how we shouldn't have passed on him. No one is arguing the value of Derwin James vs. Hayden Hurst. However part of the thought that goes into this is that Andrews would have the TE and we wouldn't have needed Hurst.

Trading the 16 Pick twice allowed us to to parlay picks on multiple occasions. These trades subsequently yielded us the following players.

Hayden Hurst
Mark Andrews
Kenny Young
Jordan Lasley
Bradley Bozeman

Chances are less likely we trade up for Lamar Jackson without trading back and acquiring multiple picks.

Yes, Hurst vs. James is obvious who is the better player, but James vs. Jackson, Hurst, Andrews, Young, Lasley and Bozeman, I'd probably do it all over again.

I think the stigma of Hurst being a first round pick, and us trading back when Edmunds and James, who are both looking like bonafide studs is ruining this.

I would've much rather had Hernandez but I still think Hurst is fine. Him being MIA isn't really his fault. We've limited the playbook and for whatever reason we are far more hellbent on using Boyle and Maxx in the red zone than either rookie TE. Additionally, him getting hurt early on cost him reps with both Lamar and Flacco alike. I get that Boyle is the best blocker of the bunch, and Maxx is that way too, but Andrews has clearly proven himself the better receiver and Hurst has had his moments. It's not really a fair comparison right now because... Well our coaches are being fucking idiots. Hurst flashed big time in the preseason and even then it looks like he's improved as a blocker.

And even when we do throw the ball to Hurst it's not like we put the guy in positions to suceed. Like it or not, Hurst is the most athletic TE on the roster. Yet we give those idiotic TE screens to Boyle or Maxx. It's a nice little microcosm of the team right now. Lots of talent. Horrid coaching and scheming.

I still think the Hurst pick is fine. I don't care if he's 25. TE's, like OGs, can play at a high level into their mid 30s. It also took Pitta a year to get going and he was the same thing. We just need to get him involved and be paitent(Which this fanbase hilariously lacks). I also think it's fine because with Lamar in the future I expect the team to run A LOT of two TE sets. Especially with how Hurst was used in college. H-Back, inline, slot WR. In the hands of a real offensive coordinator, Hurst could turn into a real weapon.

I still think Hurst and Andrews are going to terrorize teams in the future. If I am wrong, I am wrong, but still. It's where I stand.

 

[Grim]

I think the stigma of Hurst being a first round pick, and us trading back when Edmunds and James, who are both looking like bonafide studs is ruining this.

I would've much rather had Hernandez but I still think Hurst is fine. Him being MIA isn't really his fault. We've limited the playbook and for whatever reason we are far more hellbent on using Boyle and Maxx in the red zone than either rookie TE. Additionally, him getting hurt early on cost him reps with both Lamar and Flacco alike. I get that Boyle is the best blocker of the bunch, and Maxx is that way too, but Andrews has clearly proven himself the better receiver and Hurst has had his moments. It's not really a fair comparison right now because... Well our coaches are being fucking idiots. Hurst flashed big time in the preseason and even then it looks like he's improved as a blocker.

And even when we do throw the ball to Hurst it's not like we put the guy in positions to suceed. Like it or not, Hurst is the most athletic TE on the roster. Yet we give those idiotic TE screens to Boyle or Maxx. It's a nice little microcosm of the team right now. Lots of talent. Horrid coaching and scheming.

I still think the Hurst pick is fine. I don't care if he's 25. TE's, like OGs, can play at a high level into their mid 30s. It also took Pitta a year to get going and he was the same thing. We just need to get him involved and be paitent(Which this fanbase hilariously lacks). I also think it's fine because with Lamar in the future I expect the team to run A LOT of two TE sets. Especially with how Hurst was used in college. H-Back, inline, slot WR. In the hands of a real offensive coordinator, Hurst could turn into a real weapon.

I still think Hurst and Andrews are going to terrorize teams in the future. If I am wrong, I am wrong, but still. It's where I stand.

The thing with Hurst isn’t that he’s an old TE but it’s rather that he’s an old TE who isn’t contributing this year and we can’t afford for a 1st round pick to not immediately contribute this year. First round picks are or should be immediate starter/impact players now and we are not getting that from Hurst yet. Maybe one day but not right now. If he never becomes that player then it’s a huge issue

 

[Adreme]

The thing with Hurst isn’t that he’s an old TE but it’s rather that he’s an old TE who isn’t contributing this year and we can’t afford for a 1st round pick to not immediately contribute this year. First round picks are or should be immediate starter/impact players now and we are not getting that from Hurst yet. Maybe one day but not right now. If he never becomes that player then it’s a huge issue

Except TEs generally don't contribute their first years. Andrews is a nice exception, but the fact that he only had half the responsibility of Hurst helps the transition. TEs take a year to develop so worrying this year about Hurst is silly.

 

[cdp]

The thing with Hurst isn’t that he’s an old TE but it’s rather that he’s an old TE who isn’t contributing this year and we can’t afford for a 1st round pick to not immediately contribute this year. First round picks are or should be immediate starter/impact players now and we are not getting that from Hurst yet. Maybe one day but not right now. If he never becomes that player then it’s a huge issue

It seems like our 1st round pick never start immediately. Hurst, last year Humphrey would've never seen the field as much if not for injuries. Stanley I don't know what happens if Monroe doesn't retire. Mosley and Elam started by default.

 

[Grim]

Except TEs generally don't contribute their first years. Andrews is a nice exception, but the fact that he only had half the responsibility of Hurst helps the transition. TEs take a year to develop so worrying this year about Hurst is silly.

Yep that’s my point exactly. It is a rare exception that they immediately contribute. I felt Hurst could buck that trend but he’s looking like many others. Everyone or most everyone felt like Hurst could break that mold because he was older and more refined but nope. I think the worry is more that we aren’t getting more production from a first round pick. If he was a 2nd or 3rd round pick nobody would be complaining but there were others available at his pick who could’ve contributed more to this team this year to win now.

It seems like our 1st round pick never start immediately. Hurst, last year Humphrey would've never seen the field as much if not for injuries. Stanley I don't know what happens if Monroe doesn't retire. Mosley and Elam started by default.

I think Monroe was on the outs and that’s why we took Ronnie because we knew we needed better. Mosley was expected to start but just beat Arthur Brown so there’s that. Elam started after Huff was benched

 

[BloodRaven]

People need to cool it on Hurst, tightends typically take a long time to develop and he could still become the best player in this class. Our new franchize QB (be it Jackson or whoever) needs a safety valve to grow with.

 

[Grim]

People need to cool it on Hurst, tightends typically take a long time to develop and he could still become the best player in this class. Our new franchize QB (be it Jackson or whoever) needs a safety valve to grow with.

I think the criticism is fair but I don’t think people dislike the player or pick more than they dislike the value with our needs and apparent focus to win this year. I think that’s the real issue here more than anything. I feel this way because everyone brings up who we could’ve had and that’s been pretty consistent. It’s a fair criticism and it’s less of Hurst and more to do with our drafting as a whole and our history of 1st round picks not contributing much lately.

 

[Adreme]

If the Ravens were all in on this year they would not have drafted Lamar, teams have to think 3 years down the line at all times.

 

[Icy]

Do you guys feel like Andy Reid's gameplan yesterday would work with lamar ? with all the motion before the snap

 

[RavensMania]

Do you guys feel like Andy Reid's gameplan yesterday would work with lamar ? with all the motion before the snap

I do, but they have simplified the game plan for LJ, which is the right thing to do atm.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

After the game vs the chiefs, I strongly believe we are a good bounce and being spared a bullshit flag away from being a real threat in January. If we can do that in KC, we can beat anyone, we just need to stop getting fucked by refs and being on the ass end of a miracle play

 

[Icy]

I do, but they have simplified the game plan for LJ, which is the right thing to do atm.

i agree, i just couldn’t help but think what lamar would look like with someone like andy reid and his scheme

 

[rossihunter2]

earlier we were discussing the need for Derwin James and how we shouldn't have passed on him. No one is arguing the value of Derwin James vs. Hayden Hurst. However part of the thought that goes into this is that Andrews would have the TE and we wouldn't have needed Hurst.

Trading the 16 Pick twice allowed us to to parlay picks on multiple occasions. These trades subsequently yielded us the following players.

Hayden Hurst
Mark Andrews
Kenny Young
Jordan Lasley
Bradley Bozeman

Chances are less likely we trade up for Lamar Jackson without trading back and acquiring multiple picks.

Yes, Hurst vs. James is obvious who is the better player, but James vs. Jackson, Hurst, Andrews, Young, Lasley and Bozeman, I'd probably do it all over again.

the much better argument is Hurst vs.

Calvin Ridley
Will Hernandez
Sony Michel
Nick Chubb
James Daniels
Harold Landry
Anthony Miller

 

[RL52TheGreatest]

After the game vs the chiefs, I strongly believe we are a good bounce and being spared a bullshit flag away from being a real threat in January. If we can do that in KC, we can beat anyone, we just need to stop getting fucked by refs and being on the ass end of a miracle play

You just reminded me of the fumble that Mahomes had which barely rolled out of the reach of Suggs. FUUUUUCK man, we were so close to winning yesterday in a variety of different ways.

 

[rossihunter2]

Do you guys feel like Andy Reid's gameplan yesterday would work with lamar ? with all the motion before the snap

absolutely - there is literally nothing bad that comes from using all that pre-snap motion - it shows the defence more clearly to Lamar, it creates an extra element of deception which helps with the zone-read and with play-action and also spreads out the defence more, it creates more obvious matchups

there's a reason why almost every snap that Jared Goff takes from under centre uses some time of play fake - it's because it doesnt matter if you've done it 100 times it still holds the defence

its a similar concept in KC

 

[gtalk12]

the much better argument is Hurst vs.

Calvin Ridley
Will Hernandez
Sony Michel
Nick Chubb
James Daniels
Harold Landry
Anthony Miller

He's not and the idea that Ridley and Brown could be our speed receivers kills me

 

[DeVito52]

the much better argument is Hurst vs.

Calvin Ridley
Will Hernandez
Sony Michel
Nick Chubb
James Daniels
Harold Landry
Anthony Miller

And I would literally take every single one of them over hurst. All of those guys are making impacts. Hell, if James Daniels was on this team, our Oline would be set. He was a huge part of containing Aaron freaking Donald yesterday and the Bears coaching staff even said that. Every single one of those guys is better for this team than hurst is.

 

[rossihunter2]

He's not and the idea that Ridley and Brown could be our speed receivers kills me

yeah its frustrating - we gotta ride with Hurst though and he's occasionally showed some things but he's just getting inconsistent snaps and targets which is very frustrating - i really would be pissed if he turns into another Maxx