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Lamar Jackson

Ellicottraven

Ravens Ring of Honor


So it begins…if Lamar is going down the fully guaranteed path, he will not be in the Ravens long term plans

I disagree. While they'll try to avoid the long-term guarantees like the Browns gave Watson, if that is the only way to keep Lamar, he'll still stay a Raven. My guess is he won't push the envelope because he's a reasonable guy. I think his guarantees will be close to 175M at the bare minimum and get close to $50M/yr or that much. I just want his deal to be reasonably long-term because with the burgeoning caps, in a few years, the impact of his salary will reduce. I like the deal to be at least 6-7 yrs. I doubt Lamar will agree to that though.
 

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
I disagree. While they'll try to avoid the long-term guarantees like the Browns gave Watson, if that is the only way to keep Lamar, he'll still stay a Raven. My guess is he won't push the envelope because he's a reasonable guy. I think his guarantees will be close to 175M at the bare minimum and get close to $50M/yr or that much. I just want his deal to be reasonably long-term because with the burgeoning caps, in a few years, the impact of his salary will reduce. I like the deal to be at least 6-7 yrs. I doubt Lamar will agree to that though.
I'd be overall fine with a fully guaranteed contract. Just not at 5 years and not at $230M guaranteed. He's just not that valuable in my eyes. I have no idea what kind of QB Lamar is going to look like in this league in 5 years.
They want to give a 3 year extension at $160M, fully guaranteed, I'd sign up for it today.
 

BoredMarine13

Ravens Ring of Honor
I disagree. While they'll try to avoid the long-term guarantees like the Browns gave Watson, if that is the only way to keep Lamar, he'll still stay a Raven. My guess is he won't push the envelope because he's a reasonable guy.
While I want to get on board with this sentiment, I just don't see Lamar assuming a deal that leans towards team friendly. Nothing to do with him personally, just the facts of his current situation based on his play. I don't see anyway the Ravens can get away from making him the highest paid player in the league with significant if not all guaranteed amounts.
 

JO_75

Hall of Famer
Lamar going to price himself out of town or it will be Flacco all over again and someone gets sacrificed due to the cap like Boldin.

 

JO_75

Hall of Famer
man lamar with this bull shit lol.. i wonder if he really wants a fully guaranteed deal like watson

The Mega Million is $790 Million on Tuesday, one of us here wins the lottery and show up to The Castle with a bunch of money for EDC to give Lamar.
 

gtalk12

Ravens Ring of Honor
The Mega Million is $790 Million on Tuesday, one of us here wins the lottery and show up to The Castle with a bunch of money for EDC to give Lamar.

I was going to go with share the money with the Flock

However this may be a better use of the money lol
 

redrum52

Hall of Famer
I'd be overall fine with a fully guaranteed contract. Just not at 5 years and not at $230M guaranteed. He's just not that valuable in my eyes. I have no idea what kind of QB Lamar is going to look like in this league in 5 years.
They want to give a 3 year extension at $160M, fully guaranteed, I'd sign up for it today.

This. I'm fine with fully guaranteed but would top out at 4 years.
 
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JO_75

Hall of Famer
PFT suggested we offer Lamar the Kyler Murray contract... they must be high over there. Given what Lamar has done compared to Kyler where you really are getting one good half season of football even though that might be due to Kingsbury and Coaching more. Something tells me Lamar is going to tie Rodgers at $50M annually, just below it at $48M-$49.5M or more than $50M annually.
 
PFT suggested we offer Lamar the Kyler Murray contract... they must be high over there. Given what Lamar has done compared to Kyler where you really are getting one good half season of football even though that might be due to Kingsbury and Coaching more. Something tells me Lamar is going to tie Rodgers at $50M annually, just below it at $48M-$49.5M or more than $50M annually.

Yeah I think its going to be something like 5 years $250m $190m guaranteed
 

Ellicottraven

Ravens Ring of Honor
I'd be overall fine with a fully guaranteed contract. Just not at 5 years and not at $230M guaranteed. He's just not that valuable in my eyes. I have no idea what kind of QB Lamar is going to look like in this league in 5 years.
They want to give a 3 year extension at $160M, fully guaranteed, I'd sign up for it today.
I'd be overall fine with a fully guaranteed contract. Just not at 5 years and not at $230M guaranteed. He's just not that valuable in my eyes. I have no idea what kind of QB Lamar is going to look like in this league in 5 years.
They want to give a 3 year extension at $160M, fully guaranteed, I'd sign up for it today.
I have no such qualms about Lamar's longevity or durability. I may be an outlier, but I am of the strict belief that any contract upwards of $50M/yr needs to be a multi-year contract beyond 7-8 yrs perhaps. As for the guarantees they could be around 180-200M which secures him for 4 yrs at least. Now, my sense is with the new TV contract coming up, the cap will burgeon upwards of 250M in a couple of years and keep going up. Now, it is to the Ravens' advantage to sign him to a multi-year contract now so they can leverage his cheaper (relatively speaking deal) starting 2025 through whenever it ends. So, my hope is for a 7-8 yr contract
Yeah I think its going to be something like 5 years $250m $190m guaranteed
I suspect if they are paying him 50M+, they're going to have to spread it out over a longer duration. It's a risk-reward thing that they'll have to internally assess. By signing him for 7 yrs, then they are able to participate in future QB salary saving and the burgeoning cap given the upcoming new TV deals. So, if I were the Ravens I would either offer him 7 yrs or 3 yrs and nothing in-between. 3 yrs is far less risk and also potentially no reward at all if Lamar balls out and stays consistently healthy and available. Then they'd have to pay him the market price of well over 60M/yr on another extension. I think the Ravens know that Lamar isn't injury-prone like the media pontificates day and night. Then, they should shoot for the 7 or higher term extension with 50+M annually and about 4 yrs of it guaranteed, say 200M. So, my hope is it is a 352.5M extension for 7 yrs with 200M guaranteed.
 

Davesta

Ravens Ring of Honor
i wonder what was the offer EDC gave Lamar last year. Bet he swinging air right now.

 

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
I have no such qualms about Lamar's longevity or durability. I may be an outlier, but I am of the strict belief that any contract upwards of $50M/yr needs to be a multi-year contract beyond 7-8 yrs perhaps. As for the guarantees they could be around 180-200M which secures him for 4 yrs at least. Now, my sense is with the new TV contract coming up, the cap will burgeon upwards of 250M in a couple of years and keep going up. Now, it is to the Ravens' advantage to sign him to a multi-year contract now so they can leverage his cheaper (relatively speaking deal) starting 2025 through whenever it ends. So, my hope is for a 7-8 yr contract

I suspect if they are paying him 50M+, they're going to have to spread it out over a longer duration. It's a risk-reward thing that they'll have to internally assess. By signing him for 7 yrs, then they are able to participate in future QB salary saving and the burgeoning cap given the upcoming new TV deals. So, if I were the Ravens I would either offer him 7 yrs or 3 yrs and nothing in-between. 3 yrs is far less risk and also potentially no reward at all if Lamar balls out and stays consistently healthy and available. Then they'd have to pay him the market price of well over 60M/yr on another extension. I think the Ravens know that Lamar isn't injury-prone like the media pontificates day and night. Then, they should shoot for the 7 or higher term extension with 50+M annually and about 4 yrs of it guaranteed, say 200M. So, my hope is it is a 352.5M extension for 7 yrs with 200M guaranteed.
So I have three huge problems with this:
1. I honestly don't know what Lamar has done to warrant a 7-8 year contract. Basically nobody gets that deal. Mahomes got that deal (longer), but his achievements are wildly above Lamar's and pretty much everybody else's. Especially over the first 3-4 years. Nobody else is in that arena. You can go look around at all the big money deals, including people more qualified and less qualified for one, and basically none of them go beyond 5 years.
2. The deal you described is a fairly bad deal for everybody. For starters, if Lamar knows the cap is expected to go up, why would you want to wait 7-8 years to get back in the market again? Why wouldn't you want to theoretically become a FA again by like 30-31?
For the Ravens, with that kind of structure, you're basically forced into a restructure/extension after like year 3-4. Even if the cap got to like $300M, you'd undoubtedly be looking at like $55-60M cap hit 4-5 years down the road. That's not attainable at that level. Contracts these size are basically just a series of extensions until the player retires or the team moves on.
3. I'm not super concerned about durability issues long term. I'd call it more of the Michael Vick/Cam Newton effect. Is anybody certain that Lamar is going to be a prolific passer of the football at like 31-32? Not like he is now, or even above average, but prolific? Like top of the league level. Because if he's not, I think its a problem, because I don't think 31-32 year old Lamar is going to be running for a thousand yards (probably not even 500 yards) and is certainly not going to be running away from people at that age. He'll still have mobility, but that ability to make a defense totally guess what he's going to do with the ball is going to fade and fade quickly with age.
So with that knowledge, I'm not sure that I want to commit 7-8 years to him, because I don't know what I'm getting with him in 7-8 years. I was one of the few people who suggested that the shelf life for him, based on his skill sets, may not be a 35 year old veteran franchise player. It might be that 30-32 is when he hits his ceiling, and its all downhill after that.

Ultimately, the 7-8 year thing wouldn't scare me, depending on how the guaranteed money shakes out. But I'm not buying that either side wants a deal that long. They're not common league-wide, and I don't think Lamar is the type of player you usually hand that deal to. Especially 4-5 years in.
 

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
I have no such qualms about Lamar's longevity or durability. I may be an outlier, but I am of the strict belief that any contract upwards of $50M/yr needs to be a multi-year contract beyond 7-8 yrs perhaps. As for the guarantees they could be around 180-200M which secures him for 4 yrs at least. Now, my sense is with the new TV contract coming up, the cap will burgeon upwards of 250M in a couple of years and keep going up. Now, it is to the Ravens' advantage to sign him to a multi-year contract now so they can leverage his cheaper (relatively speaking deal) starting 2025 through whenever it ends. So, my hope is for a 7-8 yr contract

I suspect if they are paying him 50M+, they're going to have to spread it out over a longer duration. It's a risk-reward thing that they'll have to internally assess. By signing him for 7 yrs, then they are able to participate in future QB salary saving and the burgeoning cap given the upcoming new TV deals. So, if I were the Ravens I would either offer him 7 yrs or 3 yrs and nothing in-between. 3 yrs is far less risk and also potentially no reward at all if Lamar balls out and stays consistently healthy and available. Then they'd have to pay him the market price of well over 60M/yr on another extension. I think the Ravens know that Lamar isn't injury-prone like the media pontificates day and night. Then, they should shoot for the 7 or higher term extension with 50+M annually and about 4 yrs of it guaranteed, say 200M. So, my hope is it is a 352.5M extension for 7 yrs with 200M guaranteed.
One other thing I'd point out... the 3 year deal is extremely bad for the franchise. Like I can see Lamar wanting it, and I can see the Ravens doing it, but as a fan, you should be terrified of it.
A 3 year deal is basically going to be fully guaranteed, and it'll be at least $45-50M per year. It provides little to no cap flexibility, and so basically, you're paying high retail prices when the cap hasn't moved tremendously. The reason these 5-6 year + deals happen is because the team can maneuver it to match the current cap landscape, extend in the back end, etc.
A three year deal is basically something where we have to renegotiate a new contract almost every year, because the cap limitations are so enormous.

If I'm the Ravens, a 3 year or less deal is really not something I'm even really willing to entertain, unless its at a significant discount.
 

rmcjacket23

Ravens Ring of Honor
PFT suggested we offer Lamar the Kyler Murray contract... they must be high over there. Given what Lamar has done compared to Kyler where you really are getting one good half season of football even though that might be due to Kingsbury and Coaching more. Something tells me Lamar is going to tie Rodgers at $50M annually, just below it at $48M-$49.5M or more than $50M annually.
The AAV is kind of irrelevant. I think the total guaranteed money and length is relatively on par with Murray.
They're more similar in terms of in-season production and lack of playoff production than most people realize.
 

Ellicottraven

Ravens Ring of Honor
So I have three huge problems with this:
1. I honestly don't know what Lamar has done to warrant a 7-8 year contract. Basically nobody gets that deal. Mahomes got that deal (longer), but his achievements are wildly above Lamar's and pretty much everybody else's. Especially over the first 3-4 years. Nobody else is in that arena. You can go look around at all the big money deals, including people more qualified and less qualified for one, and basically none of them go beyond 5 years.
2. The deal you described is a fairly bad deal for everybody. For starters, if Lamar knows the cap is expected to go up, why would you want to wait 7-8 years to get back in the market again? Why wouldn't you want to theoretically become a FA again by like 30-31?
For the Ravens, with that kind of structure, you're basically forced into a restructure/extension after like year 3-4. Even if the cap got to like $300M, you'd undoubtedly be looking at like $55-60M cap hit 4-5 years down the road. That's not attainable at that level. Contracts these size are basically just a series of extensions until the player retires or the team moves on.
3. I'm not super concerned about durability issues long term. I'd call it more of the Michael Vick/Cam Newton effect. Is anybody certain that Lamar is going to be a prolific passer of the football at like 31-32? Not like he is now, or even above average, but prolific? Like top of the league level. Because if he's not, I think its a problem, because I don't think 31-32 year old Lamar is going to be running for a thousand yards (probably not even 500 yards) and is certainly not going to be running away from people at that age. He'll still have mobility, but that ability to make a defense totally guess what he's going to do with the ball is going to fade and fade quickly with age.
So with that knowledge, I'm not sure that I want to commit 7-8 years to him, because I don't know what I'm getting with him in 7-8 years. I was one of the few people who suggested that the shelf life for him, based on his skill sets, may not be a 35 year old veteran franchise player. It might be that 30-32 is when he hits his ceiling, and its all downhill after that.

Ultimately, the 7-8 year thing wouldn't scare me, depending on how the guaranteed money shakes out. But I'm not buying that either side wants a deal that long. They're not common league-wide, and I don't think Lamar is the type of player you usually hand that deal to. Especially 4-5 years in.
Let me simply respond by saying that in my mind, Lamar Jackson is wildly superior to every other QB in the league, Mahomes included. Mahomes' success was driven by several factors including playmakers at every level. If Lamar had the same weapons as any of these top 4-5 QBs, I'm convinced he'd be near unbeatable. If Mahomes got a 10 yr contract and accepted it gleefully and then got capped in the knee and missed a few games, Lamar is entirely capable of getting a 7 yr extension. He should too. He is such a transcendent talent that he'll rewrite history books if he gets the right weapons and protection as other QBs do. I'm not belaboring or arguing why I feel the way I do, but I'm not budging. I see absolute greatness and charisma in Jackson that no other football player possesses regardless of championship pedigree. That is why you do everything possible to enable him.

I say all this not because I'm a huge Lamar Jackson fan and his dad, but because he is simply that special and the only iteration of Michael Jordan this league has had the good fortune of having. He is a superstar that is must-see TV and no matter what people tune in to watch him, just like they did MJ all those years ago. That's it. I stick with 7 yrs 353.5M with 200M guaranteed.
 

RaineV1

Ravens Ring of Honor
Let me simply respond by saying that in my mind, Lamar
I say all this not because I'm a huge Lamar Jackson fan and his dad, but because he is simply that special and the only iteration of Michael Jordan this league has had the good fortune of having. He is a superstar that is must-see TV and no matter what people tune in to watch him, just like they did MJ all those years ago. That's it. I stick with 7 yrs 353.5M with 200M guaranteed.
Just for this comment Brady is gonna stick around for another decade and win 5 for super bowls.
 
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