2019 OL Thread

[Willbacker]

and god dammit i wish garrett bradbury was stronger, like if he had average power and anchor with the same level of ridiculous skill and athleticism he would be a generational talent, an OL who can move like him is freaking rare, idk if ive seen a center as athletic as this guy, dude moves like a blocking TE.

He was a TE before they moved him to center.

 

[RavensMania]

man elgton jenkins is fun to watch. OL are usually boring evals for me but the real bullies are some of my favorite tapes(cough quenton nelson), and the uber athletic guys are fun to watch as well, but jenkins falls in that former category, you cant beat the guy in pass pro, he takes a shallow drop off the snap and grabs you immediately and the best the DT can do is get jenkins to arch his back, his anchor is just ridiculous, like he cant get pushed back even a yard it seems. and in the run game he has those yanda like snaps where hes getting big push on his own man by himself while helping the man next to him get some push too, hes just a space maker up front in the run game. just a really powerful fucker and nasty style, i havent watched him in a while but his tape stuck in my mind and i always thought of him as a first rounder, after another look i think hes just not getting enough credit period. the only weaknesses i see is that he doesnt always lean forward as much as he should and can play a little upright at times, and sometimes his feet can get a little heavy and he settles for plant and shove, rather than drive, which is a weakness i saw with frank ragnow as well which knocked him down to a second rounder in my book, but the main difference for me is that jenkins appears to be way more powerful, because even with these things he is still shoving guys around like ragdolls. if jenkins can get that pad level down and get some more lean to his game, and churn those feet to get more drive out of his lower body, then he may end up an all pro center.

and remember how we mostly thought price and ragnow were round 2 picks? well they both went relatively early in 1, and nobody seemed to have a problem with it either, why? because center quality is so shit in this league that a center who at least looks like he can be a non liability of a starter is considered a first round talent, elgton jenkins though looks better than either of those guys by a wide margin. i wouldnt mind him at all at 22

He does have some negatives though. Plays a little too straight up and stiff for my liking to take him that high, but the 2nd should be fine.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

He does have some negatives though. Plays a little too straight up and stiff for my liking to take him that high, but the 2nd should be fine.

I actually pointed that out lol, he doesn’t really look stiff but he does get too vertical, funny thing is though he still physically dominates guys even with his back arched backwards

 

[RavensMania]

I actually pointed that out lol, he doesn’t really look stiff but he does get too vertical, funny thing is though he still physically dominates guys even with his back arched backwards

yes you did, just missed it. Pit of Misery for me again. What a day

 

[Oldfaithful]

I can see it now “Welcome to Baltimore, Erik McCoy”
*harbaugh starts the year off with Skura for some inexplicable reason*

 

[cobrajet]

I can see it now “Welcome to Baltimore, Erik McCoy”
*harbaugh starts the year off with Skura for some inexplicable reason*

Yeah, but isn’t the knock on McCoy, what we all hate about Skura? McCoy is very athletic but doesn’t he get pushed around by power rushers? I want a road grader to help the run game. I also believe Garrett Bradbury would be the perfect Center if he was also stronger. I would love to have a better Center, but not sure we would get much of an upgrade in this draft. If Cody Ford is available, I think he would be a road grader at Left Guard and see him as an upgrade over Hurst or Lewis. I am not great at watching tape, so I just go by what I read. Am I wrong in my thought process here? Would love your thoughts on this, because IMHO fixing our oline should be top priority. I love smashmouth football. If we trade back, I am okay grabbing McCoy, but not sure he is worth it at #22.

 

[Jacquouille]

Yeah, but isn’t the knock on McCoy, what we all hate about Skura? McCoy is very athletic but doesn’t he get pushed around by power rushers? I want a road grader to help the run game. I also believe Garrett Bradbury would be the perfect Center if he was also stronger. I would love to have a better Center, but not sure we would get much of an upgrade in this draft. If Cody Ford is available, I think he would be a road grader at Left Guard and see him as an upgrade over Hurst or Lewis. I am not great at watching tape, so I just go by what I read. Am I wrong in my thought process here? Would love your thoughts on this, because IMHO fixing our oline should be top priority. I love smashmouth football. If we trade back, I am okay grabbing McCoy, but not sure he is worth it at #22.

McCoy is not a powerhouse like Elgton Jenkins could be, but he makes up for it with good hands and anchor. He won't get pushed around. He's not going to fire off the snap and singlehandedly get DTs out of the way but he can execute every block in the run game. He'll be particularly valuable on combo blocks before getting to the second level where his athleticism and technical savvy really shine. For those reasons, and even though he's not on the level of a Billy Price imo, he can come in and be a 10 year starter without a doubt.

 

[cobrajet]

McCoy is not a powerhouse like Elgton Jenkins could be, but he makes up for it with good hands and anchor. He won't get pushed around. He's not going to fire off the snap and singlehandedly get DTs out of the way but he can execute every block in the run game. He'll be particularly valuable on combo blocks before getting to the second level where his athleticism and technical savvy really shine. For those reasons, and even though he's not on the level of a Billy Price imo, he can come in and be a 10 year starter without a doubt.

I guess my question then would be, why not go with Jenkins? I know Jenkins is not as athletic but if he already has the strength to be a better road grader than Bradbury or McCoy, would he the better Center in the power run game? I know I have a lot to learn about oline schemes, but I am trying to better educate myself.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

I guess my question then would be, why not go with Jenkins? I know Jenkins is not as athletic but if he already has the strength to be a better road grader than Bradbury or McCoy, would he the better Center in the power run game? I know I have a lot to learn about oline schemes, but I am trying to better educate myself.

The thing is we don’t run a straight power scheme, we mix power and zone concepts regularly, and romans scheme works MUCH better when your blockers can move. He calls exotic block packages similar to how wink calls exotic blitz packages, very unconventional and unpredictable at times, roman likes to leave guys nearly unblocked so he can send blockers elsewhere, defenders must be surprised often when they see certain guys come out of nowhere to block them.

The prerequisite should always be power, make sure your guys all have the minimum strength to hold up in the nfl and move defenders, but if you can sacrifice strength for mobility and still be strong enough, then you may be a better fit.

That said, I don’t know if our interior is powerful enough to do such a thing, so Jenkins may be better just because we need more power inside right now, but if we had a monster of a LG then McCoy or Bradbury would be a better fit.

It’s a toss up really. I think Bradbury is the most talented center I’ve seen in quite some time, but physically he really is limited, Jenkins is an absolute bully, no question that he will come in and knock dudes on their asses, but he is not an athlete. Personally I’m not big on McCoy and don’t think he’s as well rounded as many say, I’d rather go for either Jenkins or Bradbury than McCoy and get one end of the spectrum rather than a medium, and then build the rest of the interior to fit that.

 

[cobrajet]

The thing is we don’t run a straight power scheme, we mix power and zone concepts regularly, and romans scheme works MUCH better when your blockers can move. He calls exotic block packages similar to how wink calls exotic blitz packages, very unconventional and unpredictable at times, roman likes to leave guys nearly unblocked so he can send blockers elsewhere, defenders must be surprised often when they see certain guys come out of nowhere to block them.

The prerequisite should always be power, make sure your guys all have the minimum strength to hold up in the nfl and move defenders, but if you can sacrifice strength for mobility and still be strong enough, then you may be a better fit.

That said, I don’t know if our interior is powerful enough to do such a thing, so Jenkins may be better just because we need more power inside right now, but if we had a monster of a LG then McCoy or Bradbury would be a better fit.

It’s a toss up really. I think Bradbury is the most talented center I’ve seen in quite some time, but physically he really is limited, Jenkins is an absolute bully, no question that he will come in and knock dudes on their asses, but he is not an athlete. Personally I’m not big on McCoy and don’t think he’s as well rounded as many say, I’d rather go for either Jenkins or Bradbury than McCoy and get one end of the spectrum rather than a medium, and then build the rest of the interior to fit that.

This is helpful. My next question is....if Cody Ford is available at #22 would you take him to fill the weak link at LG over Hurst and Lewis, instead of Bradbury or Jenkins at Center. My thought is Ford could also fill in as Tackle if god forbid we suffered an injury there and maybe Bozeman could compete with Skura at Center. Just wondering what you thought about that scenario knowing that LG and Center are both weak links on the oline.

 

[Jacquouille]

I guess my question then would be, why not go with Jenkins? I know Jenkins is not as athletic but if he already has the strength to be a better road grader than Bradbury or McCoy, would he the better Center in the power run game? I know I have a lot to learn about oline schemes, but I am trying to better educate myself.

That's because Jenkins is an immovable force, both in a good way and a bad way. In the run game he can lock on a DT one on one which is just rare for a C (for any OL really). The problem is, that's the only thing he was asked to do. In Roman's scheme, the C was asked a lot to combo block (meaning helping the guard to handle a DT) then get to the second level and latch on a LB. How much of that was adapting to Jensen and Skura remains to be seen, but the fact remains that mobility and technicity are major components for the pivot spot.
Jenkins has some incredible assets and his punch is just downright jawdropping, which will, make him C1 for a lot of folks, but some of his deficiencies make him a questionnable fit for us.
And don't worry, you have every right to ask, it's my pleasure to answer.

 

[cobrajet]

That's because Jenkins is an immovable force, both in a good way and a bad way. In the run game he can lock on a DT one on one which is just rare for a C (for any OL really). The problem is, that's the only thing he was asked to do. In Roman's scheme, the C was asked a lot to combo block (meaning helping the guard to handle a DT) then get to the second level and latch on a LB. How much of that was adapting to Jensen and Skura remains to be seen, but the fact remains that mobility and technicity are major components for the pivot spot.
Jenkins has some incredible assets and his punch is just downright jawdropping, which will, make him C1 for a lot of folks, but some of his deficiencies make him a questionnable fit for us.
And don't worry, you have every right to ask, it's my pleasure to answer.

Yeah, I see what you are saying. Based on this, it is probably a tough call on which player would be the best fit.

 

[RavensMania]

Yeah, I see what you are saying. Based on this, it is probably a tough call on which player would be the best fit.

If we decide not to trade down, and draft at 22, and Cody Ford is there, I'd take him and not look back. He could then move to RG when Yanda retires and yes, god forbid can fill in at either R or L tackle.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

This is helpful. My next question is....if Cody Ford is available at #22 would you take him to fill the weak link at LG over Hurst and Lewis, instead of Bradbury or Jenkins at Center. My thought is Ford could also fill in as Tackle if god forbid we suffered an injury there and maybe Bozeman could compete with Skura at Center. Just wondering what you thought about that scenario knowing that LG and Center are both weak links on the oline.

I’m taking Cody ford over any of them because I think Cody ford is just a better OL in general. He can move enough for the scheme and is a powerhouse, and as you said he fits the swing tackle role we’ve always valued so much, he’s a massive upgrade at LG and hopefully Bozeman can win the C spot.

 

[cobrajet]

I’m taking Cody ford over any of them because I think Cody ford is just a better OL in general. He can move enough for the scheme and is a powerhouse, and as you said he fits the swing tackle role we’ve always valued so much, he’s a massive upgrade at LG and hopefully Bozeman can win the C spot.

Cool, I hope he is there at #22, if not, I hope we find a trade back partner.

 

[Edgar]

Anybody have a take on Risner? Seems like someone The Ravens would like. Played center his freshman year and projects as a guard. In truth, he is probably better than Brown as RT but at least he offers someone without substantial drop-off if we needed him to move.

 

[balfan23]

If we decide not to trade down, and draft at 22, and Cody Ford is there, I'd take him and not look back. He could then move to RG when Yanda retires and yes, god forbid can fill in at either R or L tackle.

The question here is whether or not Ford is that "special player" that the team is willing to stay at #22 and pick. I'm not sure how many players are on are board that we'll take at #22 vs trading back. I have a feeling not many and probably none that have a chance of being there at #22.

I have maintained i'm about 90% certain that we're trading back. I just think we want picks more than we're going to want a guy that's there for us over who we think we can still get after a tradeback.

 

[JoeyFlex5]

The question here is whether or not Ford is that "special player" that the team is willing to stay at #22 and pick. I'm not sure how many players are on are board that we'll take at #22 vs trading back. I have a feeling not many and probably none that have a chance of being there at #22.

I have maintained i'm about 90% certain that we're trading back. I just think we want picks more than we're going to want a guy that's there for us over who we think we can still get after a tradeback.

If there’s no player we feel is special enough to stay put and pick at 22, then who is gonna feel a player is special enough to give up picks to move up and select from the same pool of players?

 

[Willbacker]

If there’s no player we feel is special enough to stay put and pick at 22, then who is gonna feel a player is special enough to give up picks to move up and select from the same pool of players?

I'm thinking if Fant or Jacobs is on the board somebody might pull the trigger

 

[JoeyFlex5]

I'm thinking if Fant or Jacobs is on the board somebody might pull the trigger

a team trading up in the first for a RB or TE is about as likely as trading up in the first for a G