Lamar Jackson

[allblackraven]

designed runs put you in a good position away from contact, like running out of bounds or sliding before contact. When you are scrambling, you are scrambling because you are about to be sacked. Yes there is a HUGE difference between a designed run and scrambling.

Fiind examples of QBs getting injured while they are on a designed run. It happens less often than being nailed in the pocket. We are giving you actual examples and many recent.


The point is traditional pocket QB's are more likely to have bad injuries, imo and do in fact.

The only one recent I remember is Jimmy G. tearing his ACL on a designed run and again just because he wanted to be smarter than run play designer - try to extend the run while on the sideline already and fucked it up on his own, without being touched.

For all of you that don't believe what Mania and others are saying - just go out and play some sport, any sport and see how awkward things (including injuries) actually happen.

Of course any player can get injured in any situation but Lamar's designed running isn't making that more likely to happen, quite opposite.
Why don't you go ask Wentz, Romo, Ben, Brees, Alex Smith, Foles..... - why did they have to run so much and put themselves in dangerous situations?

 

[SaltyDog]

designed runs put you in a good position away from contact, like running out of bounds or sliding before contact. When you are scrambling, you are scrambling because you are about to be sacked. Yes there is a HUGE difference between a designed run and scrambling.

Fiind examples of QBs getting injured while they are on a designed run. It happens less often than being nailed in the pocket. We are giving you actual examples and many recent.


The point is traditional pocket QB's are more likely to have bad injuries, imo and do in fact.

Of course QB’s get hurt in the pocket. Lol. In fact I agreed that the injuries are often more severe. But you can’t pretend that pocket QB’s get hit on every pass play. Just doesn’t happen.

What I’m Saying is that just purely from a statistical standpoint, the RISK of injury goes up if you add plays that increase physical contact. That’s not saying that injuries go up in fact, just RISK of injury. Which you argued that it doesn’t. Also Lamar has has not shied away from defenders. How often has he slid, or ran out of bounds vs. taking on a defender? And even when he does slide or run out of bounds there is still more risk then handing the ball off to Ingram or Edwards.

 

[Tank]

LMAO! This really shouldn’t even be a thing. Football is a contact sport and injuries happen to all players no matter their position. But it should be obvious to all that a guy(not specifically saying Lamar, so stop)running the ball is more susceptible to injury than one that is not. It’s the reason a running back’s average length of career is the shortest of any player on the field(half that of a QB) ergo in general the more you run the ball the more likely you will be injured. It’s just a fact. And again there’s a lot of variables so one runner may be less likely to be injured than another runner.

 

[rossihunter2]

The only one recent I remember is Jimmy G. tearing his ACL on a designed run and again just because he wanted to be smarter than run play designer - try to extend the run while on the sideline already and fucked it up on his own, without being touched.

For all of you that don't believe what Mania and others are saying - just go out and play some sport, any sport and see how awkward things (including injuries) actually happen.

Of course any player can get injured in any situation but Lamar's designed running isn't making that more likely to happen, quite opposite.
Why don't you go ask Wentz, Romo, Ben, Brees, Alex Smith, Foles..... - why did they have to run so much and put themselves in dangerous situations?

ive done all sorts of sports at all different levels and sustained injuries in many different situations - only one of those major injuries came from a tackle-situation - the vast majority came in non-contact situations - i still have back problems from a non-contact injury i got in a warm-up 10 years ago

 

[rossihunter2]

Of course QB’s get hurt in the pocket. Lol. In fact I agreed that the injuries are often more severe. But you can’t pretend that pocket QB’s get hit on every pass play. Just doesn’t happen.

What I’m Saying is that just purely from a statistical standpoint, the RISK of injury goes up if you add plays that increase physical contact. That’s not saying that injuries go up in fact, just RISK of injury. Which you argued that it doesn’t. Also Lamar has has not shied away from defenders. How often has he slid, or ran out of bounds vs. taking on a defender? And even when he does slide or run out of bounds there is still more risk then handing the ball off to Ingram or Edwards.

literally what harbs, roman and marty said at the back end of last year was they did analytical studies about this and their response to everyone who kept spouting the idea that running qbs would suffer more injuries - so not even the stats are on your side im afraid

here's why broken down:
- OL are so bad in quality across the league that qbs are getting hit a lot in the pocket in uncontrolled situations
- in the pocket in a throwing motion your body is not braced for impact
- when running you are in a more defensible position to take on impacts
- when running you are more in control of how and where you take a hit (and whether you take one at all)
- running qbs get hit less in the pocket in non-braced positions because they have the ability to avoid pressure

so while there are more plays where the qb has the ball in the hands at the end of the play, there's not a much larger number of hits being received by a mobile qb per se but the force and danger of those impacts is lesser generally

case study this past week - lamar ran 16 times for 120 yards he did not slide once but took only 2 hits - one when he was trying to get a 1st down in a redzone situation and was only a yard short, and one where he cut between 2 defenders for extra yardage
Lamar avoided various pressures and extra hits in the pocket by escaping when he was hurried

 

[SaltyDog]

literally what harbs, roman and marty said at the back end of last year was they did analytical studies about this and their response to everyone who kept spouting the idea that running qbs would suffer more injuries - so not even the stats are on your side im afraid

here's why broken down:
- OL are so bad in quality across the league that qbs are getting hit a lot in the pocket in uncontrolled situations
- in the pocket in a throwing motion your body is not braced for impact
- when running you are in a more defensible position to take on impacts
- when running you are more in control of how and where you take a hit (and whether you take one at all)
- running qbs get hit less in the pocket in non-braced positions because they have the ability to avoid pressure

so while there are more plays where the qb has the ball in the hands at the end of the play, there's not a much larger number of hits being received by a mobile qb per se but the force and danger of those impacts is lesser generally

case study this past week - lamar ran 16 times for 120 yards he did not slide once but took only 2 hits - one when he was trying to get a 1st down in a redzone situation and was only a yard short, and one where he cut between 2 defenders for extra yardage
Lamar avoided various pressures and extra hits in the pocket by escaping when he was hurried

Well I would love to see the results of their analytical study. While the things you’re saying make sense, they are all subjective statements. I have no idea what the statistics on injuries of running QB’s vs, pure pocket passers are which is why I’m not arguing that point. What I’m arguing is that if you increase the POSSIBILITY of physical contact, you are, by default, going to increase the RISK of injury, simply by math. Not rocket science.

 

[allblackraven]

LMAO! This really shouldn’t even be a thing. Football is a contact sport and injuries happen to all players no matter their position. But it should be obvious to all that a guy(not specifically saying Lamar, so stop)running the ball is more susceptible to injury than one that is not. It’s the reason a running back’s average length of career is the shortest of any player on the field(half that of a QB) ergo in general the more you run the ball the more likely you will be injured. It’s just a fact. And again there’s a lot of variables so one runner may be less likely to be injured than another runner.

Now just give us examples of QBs who run mostly like RBs - praying they'll find gaps in the D line

What you are saying doesn't make sense.

 

[Tank]

Well I would love to see the results of their analytical study. While the things you’re saying make sense, they are all subjective statements. I have no idea what the statistics on injuries of running QB’s vs, pure pocket passers are which is why I’m not arguing that point. What I’m arguing is that if you increase the POSSIBILITY of physical contact, you are, by default, going to increase the RISK of injury, simply by math. Not rocket science.

Now just give us examples of QBs who run mostly like RBs - praying they'll find gaps in the D line

What you are saying doesn't make sense.

 

[allblackraven]

Well I would love to see the results of their analytical study. While the things you’re saying make sense, they are all subjective statements. I have no idea what the statistics on injuries of running QB’s vs, pure pocket passers are which is why I’m not arguing that point. What I’m arguing is that if you increase the POSSIBILITY of physical contact, you are, by default, going to increase the RISK of injury, simply by math. Not rocket science.

QBs are more likely to get in physical contact while sitting in or trying to scramble out of the pocket than if they run outside on designed plays.

How the heck is that not clear?????

 

[allblackraven]

Well I would love to see the results of their analytical study. While the things you’re saying make sense, they are all subjective statements. I have no idea what the statistics on injuries of running QB’s vs, pure pocket passers are which is why I’m not arguing that point. What I’m arguing is that if you increase the POSSIBILITY of physical contact, you are, by default, going to increase the RISK of injury, simply by math. Not rocket science.

And how's this for analytical study - go watch youtube videos of injuries to the most recent ones that come to mind:

Wentz
Romo
Ben
Brees
Alex Smith
Foles

and check what they were doing when injury took place.

 

[rossihunter2]

Well I would love to see the results of their analytical study. While the things you’re saying make sense, they are all subjective statements. I have no idea what the statistics on injuries of running QB’s vs, pure pocket passers are which is why I’m not arguing that point. What I’m arguing is that if you increase the POSSIBILITY of physical contact, you are, by default, going to increase the RISK of injury, simply by math. Not rocket science.

that's just not necessarily true - the types of contact are important which you are completely ignoring

 

[allblackraven]

Note: scrambling out to pass; If the run is designed, it's designed to end the run out of bounds, therefore no contact/no hit, unless he's unlucky to meet a dirty player.

Happened just yesterday.

 

[Tank]

oh my........lol

 

[allblackraven]

oh my........lol

????

 

[Ice Bowl]

????

Hope you guys get to 3-0 after Sunday's game vs KC. Best wishes Raven nation.

 

[rossihunter2]

Per Hensley:

Lamar Jackson’s NFL rankings after two games:
Passer rating: 145.2 (1st)
Comp. rate: 71.9 percent (5th)
Passing yards: 596 (10th)
Yards per att.: 10.46 (3rd)
TDs: 7 (t-1st)
Rushing yards: 126 (15th overall, 1st for QBs)

 

[gtalk12]

If you are a pocket passer, getting the ball out quickly is how you stay up for a long time.

If you are mobile, getting away from the pocket to avoid big hits and running out of bounds after a gain is a way to avoid injury.


As long as Jackson avoids big hits, doesn't really matter to me how he does it.

 

[Charm City]

Im not sure what that has to do with anything. So your saying that something like that couldn’t happen on a designed run? I say it definitely could, and does happen. May not be as likely, but definitely could happen.

I think he's saying that that play has nothing to do with RG3 being a running QB. Any QB could have done something similar in that situation which was scramble during a broken play.

 

[SepticeyePoe]

literally what harbs, roman and marty said at the back end of last year was they did analytical studies about this and their response to everyone who kept spouting the idea that running qbs would suffer more injuries - so not even the stats are on your side im afraid

here's why broken down:
- OL are so bad in quality across the league that qbs are getting hit a lot in the pocket in uncontrolled situations
- in the pocket in a throwing motion your body is not braced for impact
- when running you are in a more defensible position to take on impacts
- when running you are more in control of how and where you take a hit (and whether you take one at all)
- running qbs get hit less in the pocket in non-braced positions because they have the ability to avoid pressure

so while there are more plays where the qb has the ball in the hands at the end of the play, there's not a much larger number of hits being received by a mobile qb per se but the force and danger of those impacts is lesser generally

case study this past week - lamar ran 16 times for 120 yards he did not slide once but took only 2 hits - one when he was trying to get a 1st down in a redzone situation and was only a yard short, and one where he cut between 2 defenders for extra yardage
Lamar avoided various pressures and extra hits in the pocket by escaping when he was hurried

Sig rubbing off on the Ravens, lol

 

[redrum52]

Can I say both sides are right?

What one is saying is the RISK goes up, which it does. Can't deny that, but fluke shit happens all the time in this game.

What the other side is saying is, you will see the hit coming and you are at least setting up how you are hit in most scenarios. It not just some random scramble. There is also a difference between when Lamar runs and an rb runs.