Lamar Jackson

[rossihunter2]

I think I’d rather have Colon at center and 7 million + dollars than bozeman.
I’d rather spend money on dline than draft guys super early.

i think a game changing saftey is one of the biggest holdbacks to this team (lacking rn)
But it’s also somewhat of a luxury so.

i really dont want to be spending on DL in free agency - we need an injection of youth in the defensive trenches - we just had 3 contracts for ageing vets on that DL simultaneously - i want to see more youth and energy in that position group - only money i want spent on DL really is to supplement not to rebuild - if calais is game for a reasonable price then sure we bring him back for one more year, if B Will wants to continue and is happy to take justin ellis money then sure he can tag along another year too

but we need youth coming through beyond just Madubuike and Washington

i think safety is important for sure - but more generally play-makers in the secondary

 

[Deebo813]

Mekari is ideally a solid swing tackle.

I don't put a lot of stock into how certain fans views are determined from "watching games", mostly because a lot of fans don't know what they're looking at when they watch games. They think every sack, pressure, etc. has to be on the Oline. There's only a handful of people on this planet I know that actually take the time to watch film of Olineman. Meaning they don't even watch where the ball is or what anybody else is doing... just the lineman. I myself find that boring, which is why I lean on others to do it for me.

Your eyes can easily deceive you. Especially true when there's pre-conceived notions of what should happen or what you're expecting to happen.

Oh trust me i have no idea what im looking at when i watch olinemen, however when i see you getting beat often, i know what im seeing and thats trash..its why i dnt understand how people were so happy about players such as phillips, murry, westry or even mekari coming back like honestly…nothing they have done suggested that them coming back will give us any kind of hope.. mekari could possibly be something but from what i watched after he came back, shit was trash

 

[rmcjacket23]

Oh trust me i have no idea what im looking at when i watch olinemen, however when i see you getting beat often, i know what im seeing and thats trash..its why i dnt understand how people were so happy about players such as phillips, murry, westry or even mekari coming back like honestly…nothing they have done suggested that them coming back will give us any kind of hope.. mekari could possibly be something but from what i watched after he came back, shit was trash

Well, are they better than the guys who were playing their positions when they were out hurt?

I've not seen anybody suggesting Westry or Murray are quality starters. Do you have players on the roster that are better than them? Can you go find players better than them in December? If not, its kind of the end of the discussion. There's really no point in discussing whether they're bad or not. No action can be taken to change it.

Phillips, ideally, is evaluated as a LG, because that's where he was supposed to be playing.

Hence why this discussion is about what 2022 would look like. And if you notice, universally, nobody is suggesting Mekari or Phillips should be the starting RT, just like nobody is suggesting Westry or Murray should be starters. I'm not even suggesting either is on the roster next year.

Don't have the luxury of cherry picking who you want to play at this point. You got who you got.

 

[JAAM]

Yea Lamar has been playing like shit but this shit ain’t helping. Get Roman’s ass out of here

 

[Davesta]

Yea Lamar has been playing like shit but this shit ain’t helping. Get Roman’s ass out of here

Should it fall solely on GRo? Wasn’t Keith Williams brought in to help fix this as the pass game coordinator? I’m surprise we’re still having this issue with Keith and Tee there

 

[JAAM]

Should it fall solely on GRo? Wasn’t Keith Williams brought in to help fix this as the pass game coordinator? I’m surprise we’re still having this issue with Keith and Tee there

Keith said he was there to help the WRs run the routes Roman came up with lol

 

[rossihunter2]

Oh trust me i have no idea what im looking at when i watch olinemen, however when i see you getting beat often, i know what im seeing and thats trash..its why i dnt understand how people were so happy about players such as phillips, murry, westry or even mekari coming back like honestly…nothing they have done suggested that them coming back will give us any kind of hope.. mekari could possibly be something but from what i watched after he came back, shit was trash

he was disappointing against the bears in his first game back
he was great against the browns
he looked good to start against the steelers before he got injured...

and its really not that easy to notice at a glance - lots of people went after phillips for the 2 pt play and yes he had a rubbish game before then but he actually didnt screw up on that play and was supposed to leave watt unblocked

 

[rossihunter2]

Should it fall solely on GRo? Wasn’t Keith Williams brought in to help fix this as the pass game coordinator? I’m surprise we’re still having this issue with Keith and Tee there

he's not the pass game coordinator (which is what david culley was)
he's the pass game specialist which is a glorified title for a route-running coach

 

[rossihunter2]

Yea Lamar has been playing like shit but this shit ain’t helping. Get Roman’s ass out of here

that's really really fucking frustrating

i feel like someone has to have got something wrong here - especially on the 2nd play in the thread with the 2 post routes - that cant have been the play design

and if it is then that's a sackable offence (if you'll pardon the double pun there)

 

[JAAM]

that's really really fucking frustrating

i feel like someone has to have got something wrong here - especially on the 2nd play in the thread with the 2 post routes - that cant have been the play design

and if it is then that's a sackable offence (if you'll pardon the double pun there)

Do you think a good start would be moving on from Roman, or do you think he can adapt?

 

[rossihunter2]

Do you think a good start would be moving on from Roman, or do you think he can adapt?

idk at this point - i think he's mostly been pretty good but the spacing issues like that are really really frustrating because they suggest that we've still ultimately got the same problems as last year...

and it can only be one of 2 things: either the routes and plays are designed like that (which would be unforgivable), or the receivers are making mistakes somewhere... i know andrews (and hollywood too) is given some ability to free-lance at times with his routes but i cant imagine that they'd allow him to do that in ways that would destroy the route concept and play design

i wonder if the problem is they both know lamar so well that they both make the same decisions when they freelance to find the same space which would make sense given what went wrong on the first play... looks to me like hollywood spotted no one guarding him and wanted lamar to alert to him and andrews also sees the space and runs a quick out into that same space (but that still doesnt account for that 2nd play where it's andrews and watkins who take each other's space away)

if it is player detail/execution then that still comes down to coaching (but more indirectly) because the details and the choices they make have to be correct

it's hard to know what specifically went wrong, but what is clear is that something is consistently going wrong and it's either a case of lack of detail in execution or it's a deficiency in play-design

that 1st play it seems pretty clear that hollywood free-lanced (but made a good decision if lamar sees it and they communicate better), the 2nd play is really the one that makes no sense to me because i cant work out who or what was supposed to happen differently

 

[Dom McRaven]

Yea Lamar has been playing like shit but this shit ain’t helping. Get Roman’s ass out of here

At this point, it's.......

 

[29BmoreBird22]

1. I would imagine a lot of teams wanted to trade up for Darrishaw, because he's a great player. But I'm not going down that rabbit hole.
2. I fully expect us to add a Tackle or two. I think the difference is people just assuming its going to be a Starter, OR, that it's going to be a high draft pick (i.e. first rounder). I don't. I see no scenario possible where the Ravens go into the draft saying they have to find a starting RT. They paid JuWuan James this year because, when healthy, he's a well above average RT, and because they expect him to compete for that job this coming offseason. And I think they like Mekari in that spot, because he's played well there when he's been out there.
Depth is an issue, and they know that. But depth could also come in the form of a day 2 or even day 3 draft pick. If anything, they may go the Villaneuva-type route again, trying to get a cheaper veteran.
However, this is all predicated on if Stanley is back. They're not going to find "depth" at LT. It doesn't really exist in this league. Most teams have a hard enough time finding a competent LT, let alone a high quality starter, and certainly not much in the way of "depth". If they think Stanley can't come back, LT becomes a huge priority. Hopefully that's not the case.
3. As for Guard, I can't imagine they'll make an investment there. They're already paying Zeitler pretty well, and they've drafted Cleveland, Phillips and Powers in the last three years. I fully expect one of those guys to be the starting LG. Phillips seemed to be the guy they preferred there coming into the season, but injuries forced him outside. Just can't see the FO basically deciding that none of these guys are the option.
4. There is a general thought process within the league that interior pass protection is more critical to Lamar than Tackle pass protection, due to the way Lamar plays in the pocket and his ability to scramble in and out of it. I'm not entirely sold, but the focus of the offseason was on beefing up the interior, not the outside, and I think there's a reason for that. They just weren't expecting so many injuries at Tackle.

I looked it up (I called it rumors because I wasn't sure I could find it verify), but what it actually was is that in an interview, DeCosta named Darrisaw, alongside Rosseu (sp?), Oweh, and Bateman as targets for their first round pick. They didn't actually expect Bateman to be there, but when he was, they knew they had to pull the trigger. Point is, the Ravens knew they needed a tackle and were seriously contemplating taking one, if he was available. Didn't end up materializing, sadly, but anyway...

I think well above average is a... stretch, but let's just say he was well above average when he last played a full season in 2018. That would still mean this man last played a season in 2018. In 2019, he suffered an injury and played like 62 snaps, basically one games worth, sat out 2020, and then tore his achilles for this year. Even if he was above average in 2018, he's gone three years playing one live game worth of snaps. The fortunate thing is that the Ravens very may well get to see him this year, but I don't have high hopes. I would be shocked if a tackle isn't a high priority for the Ravens.

I don't think the Ravens will do anything with the interior; just the tackle spot.

 

[purplepittabread88]

i really dont want to be spending on DL in free agency - we need an injection of youth in the defensive trenches - we just had 3 contracts for ageing vets on that DL simultaneously - i want to see more youth and energy in that position group - only money i want spent on DL really is to supplement not to rebuild - if calais is game for a reasonable price then sure we bring him back for one more year, if B Will wants to continue and is happy to take justin ellis money then sure he can tag along another year too

but we need youth coming through beyond just Madubuike and Washington

i think safety is important for sure - but more generally play-makers in the secondary

Yea I want us to resign Jelly and hopefully Cambell comes back cheap. I'd be cool with a second or third on defensive linemen for sure, I should have clarified I meant super early as in first round. I just want a game changer in the first at an under valued position (such as safety or guard)

 

[rossihunter2]

Yea I want us to resign Jelly and hopefully Cambell comes back cheap. I'd be cool with a second or third on defensive linemen for sure, I should have clarified I meant super early as in first round. I just want a game changer in the first at an under valued position (such as safety or guard)

whereas I would like us to spend our biggest capital on a high value position unless there’s an absolute game changer there at a different position...

DT, EDGE, OT, CB - if I could pick any position to draft in round 1 in an ideal 2022 scenario then it’s one of those 4

obviously it’s BPA when we get on the clock but I’m hoping BPA is at one of those positions in round 1

 

[rmcjacket23]

I looked it up (I called it rumors because I wasn't sure I could find it verify), but what it actually was is that in an interview, DeCosta named Darrisaw, alongside Rosseu (sp?), Oweh, and Bateman as targets for their first round pick. They didn't actually expect Bateman to be there, but when he was, they knew they had to pull the trigger. Point is, the Ravens knew they needed a tackle and were seriously contemplating taking one, if he was available. Didn't end up materializing, sadly, but anyway...

I think well above average is a... stretch, but let's just say he was well above average when he last played a full season in 2018. That would still mean this man last played a season in 2018. In 2019, he suffered an injury and played like 62 snaps, basically one games worth, sat out 2020, and then tore his achilles for this year. Even if he was above average in 2018, he's gone three years playing one live game worth of snaps. The fortunate thing is that the Ravens very may well get to see him this year, but I don't have high hopes. I would be shocked if a tackle isn't a high priority for the Ravens.

I don't think the Ravens will do anything with the interior; just the tackle spot.

Right, but that's my point... we're talking about changes on the Oline when its really just one position and could be one player.
I don't necessarily agree that they thought Tackle was a priority in last years draft? Why don't I? Well, because they didn't draft one. They may have had their eyes on Darrishaw, but that could very easily just be best player at the best spot. If they thought Tackle was a need, I'd have seen one in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc. round being taken. But they didn't take a single Tackle.

That tells me that they didn't view it nearly as a priority as the fanbase did. It'll be bigger priority this year, only because they've had injuries this season that they weren't expecting.

But that's my entire point. Everybody is talking about overhauling the Oline and what a need it is. We could add ONE body and that's it, and it would achieve what we want to do, if that player is good. We had like four new starters on the Oline coming into this season (3 and a position change). We're not going to see anything like that this offseason, unless the Stanley/Bozeman situation doesn't work out.

 

[rmcjacket23]

whereas I would like us to spend our biggest capital on a high value position unless there’s an absolute game changer there at a different position...

DT, EDGE, OT, CB - if I could pick any position to draft in round 1 in an ideal 2022 scenario then it’s one of those 4

obviously it’s BPA when we get on the clock but I’m hoping BPA is at one of those positions in round 1

I would throw inside linebacker in there. Just not convinced they're happy with what they're getting there.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Should it fall solely on GRo? Wasn’t Keith Williams brought in to help fix this as the pass game coordinator? I’m surprise we’re still having this issue with Keith and Tee there

I refused to believe that an OC dials up a play with that sort of route combinations. I guarantee the actual play call has much better route running and spacing in it. This looks like a play where at least 1-2 WRs don't really know what they're doing.

 

[29BmoreBird22]

Right, but that's my point... we're talking about changes on the Oline when its really just one position and could be one player.
I don't necessarily agree that they thought Tackle was a priority in last years draft? Why don't I? Well, because they didn't draft one. They may have had their eyes on Darrishaw, but that could very easily just be best player at the best spot. If they thought Tackle was a need, I'd have seen one in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc. round being taken. But they didn't take a single Tackle.

That tells me that they didn't view it nearly as a priority as the fanbase did. It'll be bigger priority this year, only because they've had injuries this season that they weren't expecting.

But that's my entire point. Everybody is talking about overhauling the Oline and what a need it is. We could add ONE body and that's it, and it would achieve what we want to do, if that player is good. We had like four new starters on the Oline coming into this season (3 and a position change). We're not going to see anything like that this offseason, unless the Stanley/Bozeman situation doesn't work out.

The Ravens will never force their board. The consensus from the media regarding the opinion of NFL teams after the first round is that NFL teams did not view there to be another high round tackle after Darrisaw, so the Ravens weren't going to take a tackle to take one. Then, the Ravens didn't even have a second round pick and didn't pick again until almost pick 100.

One thing I remember reading and hearing consistently from the media was that teams were super high on Brandon Stephens and he would not last until the Ravens next pick, so he was pretty much a must take with that second third round pick.

With all that in mind, the Ravens first true opportunity to take a tackle came at, I believe, pick 94 and they ended up taking a guard. After that, it was pick 136. I think we can both agree the chances of getting a starting quality OT is really slim that late into the draft, so why force it?

But anyway- if I'm remembering correctly, the Ravens were in pretty constant contact with tackles before the draft, putting out feelers and getting guys lined up for when comp picks wouldn't be affected. I do believe the Ravens realized they needed help at tackle, and wanted help at tackle, but this wasn't a stacked OL draft by any means (from a media perspective; time will tell on the field) and things just didn't fall in a way that the Ravens could pick "their guy."

No, I do not expect a massive overhaul of the offensive line. Not a huge fan of Mason, but they have players who can play LG and if Bozeman gets re-signed, I think the Ravens are happy with Bozeman-Zeitler for another year. But I truly do believe the Ravens will prioritize a tackle, assuming James doesn't ball out here all of a sudden, because there's uncertainty surrounding both tackle spots.

 

[rmcjacket23]

The Ravens will never force their board. The consensus from the media regarding the opinion of NFL teams after the first round is that NFL teams did not view there to be another high round tackle after Darrisaw, so the Ravens weren't going to take a tackle to take one. Then, the Ravens didn't even have a second round pick and didn't pick again until almost pick 100.

One thing I remember reading and hearing consistently from the media was that teams were super high on Brandon Stephens and he would not last until the Ravens next pick, so he was pretty much a must take with that second third round pick.

With all that in mind, the Ravens first true opportunity to take a tackle came at, I believe, pick 94 and they ended up taking a guard. After that, it was pick 136. I think we can both agree the chances of getting a starting quality OT is really slim that late into the draft, so why force it?

But anyway- if I'm remembering correctly, the Ravens were in pretty constant contact with tackles before the draft, putting out feelers and getting guys lined up for when comp picks wouldn't be affected. I do believe the Ravens realized they needed help at tackle, and wanted help at tackle, but this wasn't a stacked OL draft by any means (from a media perspective; time will tell on the field) and things just didn't fall in a way that the Ravens could pick "their guy."

No, I do not expect a massive overhaul of the offensive line. Not a huge fan of Mason, but they have players who can play LG and if Bozeman gets re-signed, I think the Ravens are happy with Bozeman-Zeitler for another year. But I truly do believe the Ravens will prioritize a tackle, assuming James doesn't ball out here all of a sudden, because there's uncertainty surrounding both tackle spots.

Right, but keep in mind that "prioritizing Tackle" doesn't mean a first round pick or even an expensive veteran. It may mean a day 2 or even day 3 pick.
And I can guarantee that the fanbase and even this message board will be extremely upset if we the only thing we have after day 1 of the draft is what we have now, which I think is a real possibility.